Steam Install Q

[MaxCiv]

I posted this question in a different thread earlier, but never got an answer...

Will Steam require me to buy two copies of the game if I want to install it on my wife and I's two laptops to play a LAN game? I'm not going to spend over $100 on the game just to have mult-player LAN functionality.

In order to do what you are asking you do need to buy 2 copies of the game, Steam or not. This is true of any game unless the license explicitly says otherwise. Remember that you don't own the game. You buy A license to use the software.

If you want to install it on multiple PCs and want to use it concurrently, you need to have 2 licenses, the same way you need two Windows licenses if you want to install the OS on two machines.

The fact that there are ways around it and in some games, that limit is not enforced, it doesn't make it legal.

 

[treinacles]

morally, you should buy two copies, but IIRC if you put steam in Offline mode you can LAN party with one copy

This is kind of a gray area for me...I play mostly console games with my wife...Wii MarioKart, PS3 LittleBigPlanet, etc... none of these require me to purchase multiple discs / licenses for myself and my wife to enjoy together. So, what is the big difference? The fact that the game wasn't designed / doesn't really make sense to physically play on a single machine (even though the game actually is hosted on one machine) ?

I BUY games that I enjoy, but I buy one copy for my family. It's a piece of media...I don't buy multiple copies of a cd or dvd to play in my multiple dvd / cd players / computers / portable media players.

I'm not too certain that morals should be a basis for this argument...there are no morals in a corporate entity double charging a family unit who wants to play a game designed for multi-player functionality in their own home.

 

[treinacles]

In order to do what you are asking you do need to buy 2 copies of the game, Steam or not. This is true of any game unless the license explicitly says otherwise. Remember that you don't own the game. You buy A license to use the software.

If you want to install it on multiple PCs and want to use it concurrently, you need to have 2 licenses, the same way you need two Windows licenses if you want to install the OS on two machines.

The fact that there are ways around it and in some games, that limit is not enforced, it doesn't make it legal.

It also doesn't make it illegal. 'Connecting' MY additional computer is theoretically no different than a second controller for a console multi-player game. I don't have to buy two licenses / copies for fifa 2010, or LittleBigPlanet, or MarioKart, or many of my other console games to play multi-player locally...so why should I have to buy two copies of civ?

 

[MaxCiv]

It also doesn't make it illegal. 'Connecting' MY additional computer is theoretically no different than a second controller for a console multi-player game. I don't have to buy two licenses / copies for fifa 2010, or LittleBigPlanet, or MarioKart, or many of my other console games to play multi-player locally...so why should I have to buy two copies of civ?

Playing a console game with 2 controllers is totally different than installing a game on 2 PC and playing it concurrently. The fact that a game is multiplayer, simply means you can play with others who bough a copy of the game, wheter they are on the other side of the world or sitting next to you, connected to your LAN it doesn't matter.

Let's say you have 2 Wii, one in the living room and one in the basement and you buy one copy of Mario Kart. Can you play it on both consoles at the same time?

I don't want to be the license warden here and you do whatever your moral values allow you to do. All I'm saying is that for most PC games, if you install 1 copy on multiple PCs and play them concurrently you are breaking the law.

Does that make you a criminal and should you fear the SWAT team knocking down your door? No, but you are doing something you are not supposed to, that's all.

 

[Suho1004]

OK, being another Steam newbie...

I don't play online MP games. Will I have to log on to Steam every time I want to play Civ by myself? I heard someone say somewhere that Steam has an offline mode. Does that mean that I will still have to go through Steam to load up the program, just that I won't be connected to the Steam servers? I'm a bit confused about all of this.

 

[eireksten]

I don't play online MP games. Will I have to log on to Steam every time I want to play Civ by myself? I heard someone say somewhere that Steam has an offline mode. Does that mean that I will still have to go through Steam to load up the program, just that I won't be connected to the Steam servers? I'm a bit confused about all of this.

When starting a game offline, it will start Steam in the background to validate your game license. You don't need to do this manually. While playing, it'll run in the background, requiring about 10MB memory on top of what the game already uses (which will be a whole lot more).

When online, Steam will help handle patching and updating of your program.

 

[Shurdus]

I don't want to be the license warden here and you do whatever your moral values allow you to do. All I'm saying is that for most PC games, if you install 1 copy on multiple PCs and play them concurrently you are breaking the terms of the licence agreement.

fixed it for you.

 

[treinacles]

I understand and respect your points of view and your argument is valid if it is actually correct.

I can put the songs / apps / games that I purchase from itunes on multiple media players and machines, as long as the devices are registered under my account. I can even play local multi-player with them.

Again, it should NOT be illegal or morally wrong to install and play LAN multiplayer on computers that I own (LAN only on my machines).

Requiring me to purchase 2 copies at full price to play LAN games on my own machines is price gouging! I'll purchase two for internet play, if I want to play on the internet (never have), but I'll purchase 1 if my view is correct, or none if the user agreement / licensing is as you describe.

Okay...that's a little extreme...I'll probably still buy the game as I'm a civ addict...I'm just a little pissy about having to shell out 100+ dollars for my wife and I to, according to your argument, legally and morally play the game.

 

[Iceciro]

I fully give you your right to have your moral stance. It's a moral stance many people have.

Morality != legality.

Asking you to pay twice for two liscences to have TWO COPIES of the game running on TWO DIFFERENT computers, played by TWO DIFFERENT people, isn't price gouging. It's sanity.

It doesn't matter wether she's your wife in the next room or your friend down the street. You've got two people. Two copies. Two programs running at the same time. You don't randomly get a free code to give out to some yahoo on the street. It's not any different here, just because you know and live with the person. What's more, your liscence does allow you both to play alone at different times - as does Steam.

 

[MaxCiv]

fixed it for you.

Well, where I live, if at work I buy one copy of MS Office and install it on all of my 60 users, without having a volume license or site license, not only I'm am braking the license agreement with MS, but I'm also breaking the law and my company could get in serious trouble if I get audited.

When it comes to games, like I said, the swat team is not coming looking for you if you install Civ on 2 PCs and play a LAN games, but the same principle applies, like it or not.

 

[Senethro]

Hopefully this awkwardness with licenses will go away soon. As gamers start having offspring perhaps family licenses for multiple installations will appear.

 

[civ_king]

Legally yes. Morally, no way.

This is kind of a gray area for me...I play mostly console games with my wife...Wii MarioKart, PS3 LittleBigPlanet, etc... none of these require me to purchase multiple discs / licenses for myself and my wife to enjoy together. So, what is the big difference? The fact that the game wasn't designed / doesn't really make sense to physically play on a single machine (even though the game actually is hosted on one machine) ?

I BUY games that I enjoy, but I buy one copy for my family. It's a piece of media...I don't buy multiple copies of a cd or dvd to play in my multiple dvd / cd players / computers / portable media players.

I'm not too certain that morals should be a basis for this argument...there are no morals in a corporate entity double charging a family unit who wants to play a game designed for multi-player functionality in their own home.

Actually console games are typically designed to be playable with friends, for competitions or co-op mode, plus consoles only have 1 optical drive

It also doesn't make it illegal. 'Connecting' MY additional computer is theoretically no different than a second controller for a console multi-player game. I don't have to buy two licenses / copies for fifa 2010, or LittleBigPlanet, or MarioKart, or many of my other console games to play multi-player locally...so why should I have to buy two copies of civ?

same as above

if you want to play Civ with your wife/friend/kids/whoever than play hotseat, that is the designed mode for two or more people to play on one computer

 

[grant2004]

morally, you should buy two copies, but IIRC if you put steam in Offline mode you can LAN party with one copy

It's always been the case that it's ok to share a game with members of your immediate family. Two people shouldn't and doesn't require two copies if they're related. If it did, my brother and I were criminals countless times, sharing video games growing up. There is nothing more frustrating than a game disabling legitimate uses, by paying customers, in some crazy attempt to defeat pirates. Many games have gone too far in adding overly restrictive DRM, Civ IV certainly didn't go far enough, but if Civ V becomes another draconian game I'm going to be really angry.

Also at the suggestion that hotseat should be used. We all know that hotseat is significantly slower than a LAN connection, to the point that it's frustrating to play sometimes. If you agree that members of the same household should be able to play together on one copy of the game, why should they be restricted to a single machine? If they have the extra computers to set up a LAN game in their house there's no reason they shouldn't be able to take advantage of simultaneous turns.

 

[HamTard]

I'm pretty sure if you install it on both your PCs, and put Steam into Offline Mode on both of them, you can LAN with buying only 1 copy. You just can't play online from 2 PCs with 1 copy.

Of course, that only works if the game has a LAN mode. Starcraft 2 doesn't have LAN specifically to make people buy multiple copies if there are, for example, 2 brothers who want to play together and live together. On the bright side, at least each person would get to take their copy with them if they move away from each other.

 

[civ_king]

It's always been the case that it's ok to share a game with members of your immediate family. Two people shouldn't and doesn't require two copies if they're related. If it did, my brother and I were criminals countless times, sharing video games growing up. There is nothing more frustrating than a game disabling legitimate uses, by paying customers, in some crazy attempt to defeat pirates. Many games have gone too far in adding overly restrictive DRM, Civ IV certainly didn't go far enough, but if Civ V becomes another draconian game I'm going to be really angry.

Also at the suggestion that hotseat should be used. We all know that hotseat is significantly slower than a LAN connection, to the point that it's frustrating to play sometimes. If you agree that members of the same household should be able to play together on one copy of the game, why should they be restricted to a single machine? If they have the extra computers to set up a LAN game in their house there's no reason they shouldn't be able to take advantage of simultaneous turns.

didn't realize hotseat is slower, when you say you and your brother you mean multiplayer right?

 

[Suho1004]

When starting a game offline, it will start Steam in the background to validate your game license. You don't need to do this manually. While playing, it'll run in the background, requiring about 10MB memory on top of what the game already uses (which will be a whole lot more).

When online, Steam will help handle patching and updating of your program.

Belated thanks for the the prompt reply!

I must admit that I was a little annoyed when I heard that Steam was going to be required, mainly because I don't game a lot, and I don't play online multiplayer, so I though that Steam would be a nuisance. As long as it doesn't eat up too much of my resources (10MB doesn't sound like too much), though, and as long as its not too intrusive, it should be OK.

 

[Nictel]

Hopefully this awkwardness with licenses will go away soon. As gamers start having offspring perhaps family licenses for multiple installations will appear.

Steam tends to do this with big multiplayer games already. e.g.: You could by 5 L4D2 licenses for the price of 4. So that means if you have 5 friends and you buy it together you get a serious discount.