Strange allowed event option

[joncnunn]

This was under Better AI 0.75 but deals more with events than the AI, but since you guys are more active at this point:

On the Burned Homes random event, shouldn't the option to retreat to near your capital be grayed out if the capital is not on that landmass?
(They would have to swim across the ocean to reach the capital?)

I noticed this in my latest game when I burned down a useless city on small landmass.

 

[jdog5000]

There will probably be a 3.19 UP ... in a game this large, there are always more bugs and it sounds like there's an issue with the new gold overflow calculations in 3.19.

I'd suggest you post this over in the UP forum:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=323849

Hopefully someone steps up to the plate to run a UP, there's certainly demand for a patch without the AI changes which are a focus here.

 

[joncnunn]

Done.......

 

[Jaybe]

I have no problem with refugees fleeing to the capital (which gives them refuge), other landmass notwithstanding. Or, you could imagine forces raised at the capital domestically based on the atrocity of the razing.

 

[r_rolo1]

Well, it is not worse than the flying battleship syndrom when naval units are ejected to the nearest water tile, regardless of being able to get there by themselfs or not....

 

[joncnunn]

Real life Bug out losses across bodies of water are horrendous. Their usually only done because losing all the unit's heavy equipment and half the light equipment is better than the alternative of all that equipment captured and all the personal killed or taken as prisoners.

So for realism it should result in half as many as the in capital option would normally do, which would result in something so minor it shouldn't even be an option.

Yeah, a label change of the text of the option from refugees fleeing towards the capital to volunteers from the capital flock to join new units in response to the atrocity would make more sense.

On the flying battleship syndrome, I've never seen that, but it should be fixed.

 

[MadmanAtW]

Flying Battleship and similar issues are a consequence of Civ kicking you out of territory on a wardec. That's utterly unrealistic... so either you need to change that, which would probably be a gamebreaking change, or accept that sometimes when that happens, the only valid place to put a ship will be a teleport over land (or a land unit a teleport over water)- and that's probably better than the unit just disappearing (which humans would almost certainly quickly start exploiting to remove AI units!).

Specific examples of it, like that Event, are worth looking at. But solving the entire teleporting ships issue would require either causing auto-scuttles or removing bump on DoW, I suspect.

 

[r_rolo1]

Not necessarily. The worst manifestations of the "flying battleship syndrom" ( i call it that way because of a thread in vanilla that described the odd journey of a English battleship in Earth 18 civs that, by a combination of wardecs, flew from the baltic to the African great lakes, passsing by the Black sea, the Mediterranean and the Red sea... epic journey ) could be easily solved by checking if the there is any tile in the same area ( by area, I mean a tile that can be reached by normal unit travel ) before going to more epic flying options. Not that is a great issue anyway, but it would also help solve those interminable cases of SoD stranded in 1 tile islands that both humans and AI have some dificulty to solve adequately....

 

[MadmanAtW]

That's a fair point- certainly there are times where a stack might cross land/water when it doesn't have to because by making it move 3 tiles further it could stay in its current landmass or body of water. Doing something about that would be great, but removing the teleport entirely is pretty much impossible if for instance you declare war while owning your entire landmass.

 

[Dom Pedro II]

I agree that the teleporting needs to be addressed... and not just because its unrealistic. The main issue is that when ships are transported from one body of water to another, theres a chance that the body of water might render the units completely useless. If the AI declares war on me when i have units in their borders, I shouldnt be penalized by having my fleet transported to a one-tile lake in the middle of the continent where the only thing I can do is scuttle it.

It´s rare that really bad choices like these will be made, but it does happen.

 

[joncnunn]

I'm thinking I'd go about it by:

Part 1: (Person wanting to cancel an order borders agreement with units currently inside that players territory) : Disallow canceling an open borders while you have units that would be illegal to be there if you did not have open borders.

Part 2: (Person wanting to cancel an order borders agreement while the other party has units inside his territory) : Instead of searching for nearest land/sea tile first, change to nearest tile it's actually possible to move to first and only look for strange locations if there were no valid ones.

DOW declarations: #1 would apply for master civs wanting to DOW someone else.
#2 would apply to the person being DOWed along with all vassals on both sides being brought along for the ride.
#2 would also apply to the auto DOW due to a Defensive Protective Pact.
But #1 would apply for seeking allies. Some new text in red saying can't because I have tourists sunbathing in his country.