Strategic tile improvements?

[Craxymaxy]

I would say:
No to the trenches and walls/dragon teeth (those are basically forts combined with minefields) as well as the silos (they could just be combined with forts)

Yes to the canals, minefields and forts (they all do reasonably different things)

Overall though i maintain that in general (besides minefields) forts already cover most of these things.

 

[sputnik323]

I would say:
No to the trenches and walls/dragon teeth (those are basically forts combined with minefields) as well as the silos (they could just be combined with forts)

Totally disagree... new combat mechanics means there should be new defensive structures. The old way fit well in a SOD system because fort replaced all those things as a catch all-in-one. Now with lines of combat, the all encompassing fort does not fit.

 

[Craxymaxy]

yes, it does...

What exactly is the difference, game play wise between a line of trenches and a line of forts?

 

[chongli]

I'm personally not fond of having a whole bunch of improvements that have no tile yield

What if military and civilian improvements stacked? So on a tile you could have a fort and a farm or a mine and a radar site.

This way you could have greater strategic improvement variety without sacrificing the ability to increase tile yields.

 

[The_J]

What if military and civilian improvements stacked? So on a tile you could have a fort and a farm or a mine and a radar site.

A minefield in a town?




Strategic improvements...if they are limited, but you get a good bonus from them, i could be fine with them.
But it, like everything here, depends on the implementation.

 

[Craxymaxy]

What if military and civilian improvements stacked? So on a tile you could have a fort and a farm or a mine and a radar site.

This way you could have greater strategic improvement variety without sacrificing the ability to increase tile yields.

I think one of the imprtant things about improvements is the decision attached to them, whats stopping me from just building a fort on every hex if i can stack military improvements on top of civilian?

 

[chongli]

I think one of the imprtant things about improvements is the decision attached to them, whats stopping me from just building a fort on every hex if i can stack military improvements on top of civilian?

Time, for one. The fact that your enemy could use your forts against you for another.

 

[Craxymaxy]

they can also use forts in choke points against you...

 

[sputnik323]

yes, it does...

What exactly is the difference, game play wise between a line of trenches and a line of forts?

Maybe not too much difference in gameplay... possibly different bonuses (so still a difference). However, graphically it would look tons better. I dont think they want their beautiful new graphics they are creating be scarred by an eyesore of a line of forts. Walls would look soooo much better and are not hard to implement.

 

[Tantor]

I have a few I`d like to see:
watch tower: removes fog of war
Radar station: improved watch tower --> longer range, increased interception of aircraft
Sonar station: Removes fog of war at sea
Colony: like in Civ 3, gives you control of resources in the hex, one hex of cultural zone
Port: deployment area of naval units and trade point for nearby cities not connected to the sea, point of embarkment/disembarkment of units without amphibious promotion,
Canal: selfexplanatory, can only be built in desert, plain, grassland, max 3 hexes long.

 

[pi-r8]

perhaps they could allow a choice of 1 production improvement and 1 military improvement per tile. If you can only have just 1 improvement total, then it hardly ever makes sense to NOT take a production improvement, even with forts doing everything. If you separate the various functions of a fort into different improvements then it REALLY wouldn't make sense to sacrifice a mine or a cottage to build those. but getting both might be fun.

 

[Tantor]

perhaps they could allow a choice of 1 production improvement and 1 military improvement per tile. If you can only have just 1 improvement total, then it hardly ever makes sense to NOT take a production improvement, even with forts doing everything. If you separate the various functions of a fort into different improvements then it REALLY wouldn't make sense to sacrifice a mine or a cottage to build those. but getting both might be fun.

I think you should have to choose between military and civilian improvements. This way you have to protect resources by establishing a line of defense outside your cityzone (previously known as the fat cross), rather than on top of them.

 

[Craxymaxy]

I have a few I`d like to see:
watch tower: removes fog of war
Radar station: improved watch tower --> longer range, increased interception of aircraft
Sonar station: Removes fog of war at sea
Colony: like in Civ 3, gives you control of resources in the hex, one hex of cultural zone
Port: deployment area of naval units and trade point for nearby cities not connected to the sea, point of embarkment/disembarkment of units without amphibious promotion,
Canal: selfexplanatory, can only be built in desert, plain, grassland, max 3 hexes long.

those ar all things that forts should be able to do, outside of canalsi personally think those should be a seprate improvement.

But forts are colonies, ports, sonar/radar stations and watch towers. I would liek to have these things split up if i was playing a scenario in the modern era or something like that

 

[Craxymaxy]

Maybe not too much difference in gameplay... possibly different bonuses (so still a difference). However, graphically it would look tons better. I dont think they want their beautiful new graphics they are creating be scarred by an eyesore of a line of forts. Walls would look soooo much better and are not hard to implement.

Couldn't you have it so that when two forts were built next to each other the skin could change so that there was now a wall between them.

 

[globalempire]

realistically there are no forts in the modern era.
trenches +25% defense to infantry
dragons teeth +25% defensive bonus to everything. vehincles cannot move through, so pillage to bring your tanks through. cost 2 move points to move
canals- self explanatory, only up to 6 tiles in land getting more expensive as you go deeper
airbase-stations air units
missile silo-houses missiles
miltary base or fort or what evs you gonna call it- +25% defensive bonus
radar and sonar station, idk, idk, idk,idk,idk i just dont know

thats what i think should be included

 

[Impaler[WrG]]

I could see perhaps 3 'lines' of improvements that evolve through the course of the game, as you discover a new tech that allows an improvement your workers can upgrade existing military improvements to a higher level.

The three types would be offense, defensive and air. Offensive improvements are ones that give a unit stationed on them an advantage like zone-of-control, expanded sight radius, improved bombardment, bonus to attack strength, each additional bonus effect being gained with each upgrade, they appear as forts/castles. The defensive line provides benefits for a unit that is on them and defending, such a raw defense strength bonus, additional first-strike chances, a free reduction of enemy strength (mine field) etc etc, they appear graphically as walls/trenches/minefields. The Air line is of course late game and provides a spot to base aircraft, scrambles defensive fights from and houses and launches defensive/offensive missiles in its final form.

The use of two main types of improvements for most of the game means your going to have more flexibility to tailor your improvements to what suites your military posture best. This should make them more useful then Civ4 ware the generic nature makes them quite bland. If the 'two improvements' system of SMAC is used then it would allow for the combination of the two into a kind of 'super' tile which would be nigh impregnable at the cost of having no civilian improvements.

 

[Disgustipated]

anyone know if zones of control is in the game?

I rarely build forts since they have limited value without zones of control. The ai just bypasses my defenders anyways. you pretty much have to have a solid line of defenders to stop them.

 

[Woodreaux]

There's already 2 layers for tile improvements: the improvement (Farm/Mine/Cottage) layer and transportation layer. As multiple improvements (Military and Non-Military) for the same tile, I doubt Firaxis will go that route. If they're forcing 1UPT on us, do y'all think they'll allow improvement stacking?

 

[chongli]

There's already 2 layers for tile improvements: the improvement (Farm/Mine/Cottage) layer and transportation layer. As multiple improvements (Military and Non-Military) for the same tile, I doubt Firaxis will go that route. If they're forcing 1UPT on us, do y'all think they'll allow improvement stacking?

They allow you to stack a military unit with a worker, so why not a fort to protect your farm?

 

[Tantor]

They allow you to stack a military unit with a worker, so why not a fort to protect your farm?

Because it would make it to possible to litter the land with forts if you want to. In reality defensive lines are constructed to form a barrier between the enemy and the resource you want to protect, you don`t form a line of defense on top of your resources.