T1-4: Temple of Doom
- Thread starter Jet
- Start date
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
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SP, did you get any idea where Shaka and Ramses are located?
I noticed that in RK-05 the Oracle fell in 1210 BC. Our game is at 1120 and like RK-05 features HC and Ramses, both Industrious and both gone religious. Ouch! At minimum I'd be sure to finish the Oracle on the same turn as Writing. Having realized this, personally I wouldn't object to rushing the Oracle before Writing, taking Monarchy or IW. I think either pre- or post-Writing would be a fine choice. We do know that Ramses has Poly and Masonry, so he has the option of pursuing other wonders. Checking the sizes of their capitals (do they have Priesthood for a temple?) and their production in F9 might provide evidence.
Anyway, the turn before we discover Writing, could you please check who can open borders? That will give us a clue as to what kind of knowledge the other civs are dropping.
I noticed that in RK-05 the Oracle fell in 1210 BC. Our game is at 1120 and like RK-05 features HC and Ramses, both Industrious and both gone religious. Ouch! At minimum I'd be sure to finish the Oracle on the same turn as Writing. Having realized this, personally I wouldn't object to rushing the Oracle before Writing, taking Monarchy or IW. I think either pre- or post-Writing would be a fine choice. We do know that Ramses has Poly and Masonry, so he has the option of pursuing other wonders. Checking the sizes of their capitals (do they have Priesthood for a temple?) and their production in F9 might provide evidence.
Anyway, the turn before we discover Writing, could you please check who can open borders? That will give us a clue as to what kind of knowledge the other civs are dropping.
Swiss Pauli
Emperor
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Shaka came from the north and Ramesses from the east.
Regarding the Oracle, we should whip it when we're 1 turn from writing: we're too close to bail out to IW now! CoL will speed that border pop in little T and then we're really moving.
Regarding the Oracle, we should whip it when we're 1 turn from writing: we're too close to bail out to IW now! CoL will speed that border pop in little T and then we're really moving.
The only one offering Open Borders was Ramses, he had inked a deal with the other Meso American but canceled it before the turn ended. 
This was one of the easiest rounds I've ever played in Warlords and the most nervous making.
And here's why
By the time I got to the end those barbarians and their friends had pillaged every improved field in the working radius of "Big T". They just kept coming, and they even threatened "Little T".
To the point where I whipped a warrior in the town, as I was not going to lose it!
The combat log looks like this
The Oracle finished, as did Writing and Code of Laws was the choice, so Confucianism was founded. The missionary is immured in Little T at the moment as trying to send him to the capitol was to send him to a certain doom.
What I failed to scope however, until the penultimate turn, was that we had adopted State Religion for happiness in the capitol, so there was no cultural growth at Little T until I swapped back to No State Religion. Sorry to lose the five turns of culture growth up there and all that corn and gold. But that was fixed so both the capitol and Little T are getting 5cpt right now.
The capitol is unhappy now after the change in religious orientation, but it was unhappy before the whip was applied for the Oracle, so for good measure I whupped it again to get a worker to fix the ruined mines and farms. There are two archers and a warrior in town right now, and both archers have the hill defensive promotion, so maybe we can move out and start fixing what the bozos ruined now that they seem to be almost done with their incursions. They are coming from both SW and NE so once things settle down a little fog busting in both directions might be in order, as well as offering open borders to the French so their warrior hanging out in the corner by Big T can help us out a little.
Research is on the Iron Working path right now as having Jaguars will help us get our settlers and workers out into the surrounding jungles with less threat.
I dithered between that and Monarchy or Alphabet and finally plumped for the military rather than the government or trade.
This was one of the easiest rounds I've ever played in Warlords and the most nervous making.
And here's why
By the time I got to the end those barbarians and their friends had pillaged every improved field in the working radius of "Big T". They just kept coming, and they even threatened "Little T".
To the point where I whipped a warrior in the town, as I was not going to lose it!
The combat log looks like this
The Oracle finished, as did Writing and Code of Laws was the choice, so Confucianism was founded. The missionary is immured in Little T at the moment as trying to send him to the capitol was to send him to a certain doom.
What I failed to scope however, until the penultimate turn, was that we had adopted State Religion for happiness in the capitol, so there was no cultural growth at Little T until I swapped back to No State Religion. Sorry to lose the five turns of culture growth up there and all that corn and gold. But that was fixed so both the capitol and Little T are getting 5cpt right now.
The capitol is unhappy now after the change in religious orientation, but it was unhappy before the whip was applied for the Oracle, so for good measure I whupped it again to get a worker to fix the ruined mines and farms. There are two archers and a warrior in town right now, and both archers have the hill defensive promotion, so maybe we can move out and start fixing what the bozos ruined now that they seem to be almost done with their incursions. They are coming from both SW and NE so once things settle down a little fog busting in both directions might be in order, as well as offering open borders to the French so their warrior hanging out in the corner by Big T can help us out a little.
Research is on the Iron Working path right now as having Jaguars will help us get our settlers and workers out into the surrounding jungles with less threat.
I dithered between that and Monarchy or Alphabet and finally plumped for the military rather than the government or trade.
angeleyes
mood indigo
0 850 BC Openborders with everybody
2 Meet chairman Mao
North of Teotihuacan appears the first barbarian Axeman ...Waaahhhh
3 BarbAxe moves towards incan borders...pffffff
4 No! He changed his mind and comes to us!
7 BarbAxe moves on the copper Grrrrrr
Whip an archer in the city.
8 Coppermine destroyed by the barbAxe, second one appears north of the same city
9 Disaster. Archer defending Teotihuacan get killed, just as an archer and a warrior in the wild. Second archer in Teotihuacan takes revenge at the barbAxe. Barrack ready.
12 We have gold!, but how long? It's defended by a warrior.....
14 Teotihuacan now threatened by 2 barbAxes. Whip again an archer
15 625 BC Attacking barbAxe get killed by archer in Teotihuacan.
Thebes threatened by barbAxe and barbwarrior.
Worker can finish mine this turn but probably better to put him with his defending archer back in the city.
IRONWORKING READY IN 2 TURNS!
2 Meet chairman Mao
North of Teotihuacan appears the first barbarian Axeman ...Waaahhhh
3 BarbAxe moves towards incan borders...pffffff
4 No! He changed his mind and comes to us!
7 BarbAxe moves on the copper Grrrrrr
Whip an archer in the city.8 Coppermine destroyed by the barbAxe, second one appears north of the same city
9 Disaster. Archer defending Teotihuacan get killed, just as an archer and a warrior in the wild. Second archer in Teotihuacan takes revenge at the barbAxe. Barrack ready.
12 We have gold!, but how long? It's defended by a warrior.....
14 Teotihuacan now threatened by 2 barbAxes. Whip again an archer
15 625 BC Attacking barbAxe get killed by archer in Teotihuacan.
Thebes threatened by barbAxe and barbwarrior.
Worker can finish mine this turn but probably better to put him with his defending archer back in the city.
IRONWORKING READY IN 2 TURNS!
Swiss Pauli
Emperor
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A tough round with all those barbs, looks like we've been pillaged back to the stone age. Is that our archer on the edge of the shot of the capital? If it is then we can maybe leave our guys on the hill and move him there too: our guerilla gets +70 and his fortification bonus.
IW was absolutely the right call!
IW was absolutely the right call!
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
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I actually had this huge post politely arguing for The Wheel instead. For Axes, which can actually defend against other Axes. I had second thoughts about posting something possibly overly verbose and, coincidentally, got distracted reading all 80 billion pages of "So there's this girl on my bus." No worries. 
I'm going to look at the save now and probably play soon - anyone have any suggestions?
I'm going to look at the save now and probably play soon - anyone have any suggestions?
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
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Listen, ***hole, I'm going to tell you exactly what to do.
I'm going to make this IDIOT-proof, because OBVIOUSLY that's what's required here.
No wait, that's the rant I was writing to the kid in "So there's this girl on my bus".
Right. 625 BC.
State of knowledge:
The hidden techs are HC-Ironworking, Ramses-AW, HC-AW. Both will give me everything they have on offer for CoL, but I demur. No wars on offer yet, heh.
Speaking of which, relations:
OK.
Little T has 2 Archers to a Warrior and an Axe - cool, I sit tight. The missionary, however, can do some super-Kung Fu fogbusting action with his move 2:
Big T is good too. We're in good shape with the mine pre-built to one turn left - un-pillagable! So I move the Worker back into town as suggested and move the GII archer over to the working mine.
2: 610 BC
The attackers are, predictably, repelled. In Big T I realize I should have rotated the defenders so that the Archer who already had 10XP wasn't defending again - oh well. Now there's an Archer coming in toward our Gold and 2 warriors north of Big T.
Much as I hate to mix the promotions, I give one of the CGI Archers in little T GI and move him towards the Gold. He's at has 2.4 strength and will get there just in time to defend against the barb. The Warrior is at strength 0.9.
I realize with irritation that I hadn't actually moved the Missionary (too busy taking the screenshot) and move him cautiously towards El Intestino Grueso.
In Big T, our 2 GII Archers can do all sorts of ridge running, so I spread them out. I move the worker back onto the hill tile to finish the mine.
3: 595 BC
What with all the barbs and all, we form an elite band of merry Woodsmen:
We're desparately in need of both The Wheel (6) and Alphabet (28). Either would be reasonable; I choose The Wheel, for Axes, Gold, maybe gems, maybe military. And it's only 6 turns.
Big T grows to its (whipped) happy cap, so I set it to max production and stagnant, and its Archer will finish next turn. I move one GII Archer West, but realize that's the GII/CGI Archer, and move it back. I want to swap it with the plain GII one.
4: 580 BC
Barb Archer attacks Gold and is killed. Barb Warrior approaching Big T foolishly attacks GII Archer and is killed with no damage to us. Other Barb Warrior turns toward Little T.
I move the Gold citizen onto the Oasis - Little T is at pop 1 and has to grow some time. I should have done this last turn, right after we finished IW. The Wheel changes from 5 turns to 7. Eh. Start a Jag in Little T.
Archer finishes in Big T. I'm very tempted to start a Settler right away, and I think we could almost make it. A Settler would be strategic in that more culture would bust more fog. But I start a Jag instead. Big T Worker finishes mine and goes back to refarm rear Rice - I don't want it to be overgrown with jungle, and it's less likely to be pillaged back there.
5. 565 BC
Ramses still won't trade Alphabet (or Monarchy), but he has just researched Mathematics, although he won't trade it yet.
It's interesting. Napoleon has the same visible merits with everyone but is Annoyed with Ramses, Cautious with us, and Pleased with the others.
I'd prefer to keep Napoleon happy (which ideally also would require arranging so that we can afford to pay the tribute that he will inevitably ask for) but I'd also like Mathematics, not that Ramses would trade it yet.
Why Napoleon? On the assumption that we want a warmonger on our side and he hasn't discovered a religion, making him vulnerable to ours. And so we can attack HC, assimilate his religion, and use our corner as safe base. All debatable, of course.
I think I probably will close OB with Ramses. But for the moment, I decide I haven't slept in far too long and go for a nap. To be continued.
I'm going to make this IDIOT-proof, because OBVIOUSLY that's what's required here.
No wait, that's the rant I was writing to the kid in "So there's this girl on my bus".
Right. 625 BC.
State of knowledge:
The hidden techs are HC-Ironworking, Ramses-AW, HC-AW. Both will give me everything they have on offer for CoL, but I demur. No wars on offer yet, heh.
Speaking of which, relations:
OK.
Little T has 2 Archers to a Warrior and an Axe - cool, I sit tight. The missionary, however, can do some super-Kung Fu fogbusting action with his move 2:
Big T is good too. We're in good shape with the mine pre-built to one turn left - un-pillagable! So I move the Worker back into town as suggested and move the GII archer over to the working mine.
2: 610 BC
The attackers are, predictably, repelled. In Big T I realize I should have rotated the defenders so that the Archer who already had 10XP wasn't defending again - oh well. Now there's an Archer coming in toward our Gold and 2 warriors north of Big T.
Much as I hate to mix the promotions, I give one of the CGI Archers in little T GI and move him towards the Gold. He's at has 2.4 strength and will get there just in time to defend against the barb. The Warrior is at strength 0.9.
I realize with irritation that I hadn't actually moved the Missionary (too busy taking the screenshot) and move him cautiously towards El Intestino Grueso.
In Big T, our 2 GII Archers can do all sorts of ridge running, so I spread them out. I move the worker back onto the hill tile to finish the mine.
3: 595 BC
What with all the barbs and all, we form an elite band of merry Woodsmen:
We're desparately in need of both The Wheel (6) and Alphabet (28). Either would be reasonable; I choose The Wheel, for Axes, Gold, maybe gems, maybe military. And it's only 6 turns.
Big T grows to its (whipped) happy cap, so I set it to max production and stagnant, and its Archer will finish next turn. I move one GII Archer West, but realize that's the GII/CGI Archer, and move it back. I want to swap it with the plain GII one.
4: 580 BC
Barb Archer attacks Gold and is killed. Barb Warrior approaching Big T foolishly attacks GII Archer and is killed with no damage to us. Other Barb Warrior turns toward Little T.
I move the Gold citizen onto the Oasis - Little T is at pop 1 and has to grow some time. I should have done this last turn, right after we finished IW. The Wheel changes from 5 turns to 7. Eh. Start a Jag in Little T.
Archer finishes in Big T. I'm very tempted to start a Settler right away, and I think we could almost make it. A Settler would be strategic in that more culture would bust more fog. But I start a Jag instead. Big T Worker finishes mine and goes back to refarm rear Rice - I don't want it to be overgrown with jungle, and it's less likely to be pillaged back there.
5. 565 BC
Ramses still won't trade Alphabet (or Monarchy), but he has just researched Mathematics, although he won't trade it yet.
It's interesting. Napoleon has the same visible merits with everyone but is Annoyed with Ramses, Cautious with us, and Pleased with the others.
I'd prefer to keep Napoleon happy (which ideally also would require arranging so that we can afford to pay the tribute that he will inevitably ask for) but I'd also like Mathematics, not that Ramses would trade it yet.
Why Napoleon? On the assumption that we want a warmonger on our side and he hasn't discovered a religion, making him vulnerable to ours. And so we can attack HC, assimilate his religion, and use our corner as safe base. All debatable, of course.
I think I probably will close OB with Ramses. But for the moment, I decide I haven't slept in far too long and go for a nap. To be continued.
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
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6: 565: Aw, ****. I mis-click on the option to refuse to stop trading with Ramses and reload the auto-save because it's from the previous turn, which I believe I can replay in exactly the same way, but I can't get it to work. I try a few more times without success. So we're without Napoleon making his demand. Sorry, I won't do that again. 
The barb warrior attacking Little T attacks intercepting Archer and dies. A barb Archer appears north of big T. I find a barb city in an unappetizing spot to the west, 1N of the Deer. HC will trade Alphabet - very tempting. I hold off, but I think it might be good to trade for it after The Wheel.
7: 550: Copper mine finishes in Little T. Move Confucian Missionary to hill (known safe) for fogusting.
8: 535: ...
9: 520: Barb city appears 3 NE of Little T.
10: 505: I move Little T's 1 pop from the Oasis to the Copper mine. The Wheel is still due in 2.
11: 490: Big T finishes Jag and its whip weariness runs out. I switch it to max food tiles and start another Jag so that it can grow in 1 turn.
12: 475:
Big T grows, switches to Settler.
I notice that bizarrely, the only other Wonder completed is Stonehenge, by Mao in 750.
Finish The Wheel and look at trading options. HC now has Math and will trade it. Ramses still won't trade Alpha, Math, or Monarchy. For CoL, I could get Alpha (only) from HC and everything else from Ramses. We don't have a huge immediate need for any of those techs except perhaps AW, although at some point we could trade Alpha or CoL for Math to another Civ. Hmm... I go for it.
First:
Then:
Now we're cooking with bacon. Unfortunately
Napoleon won't give anything better than Fishing for Writing and Priesthood. (He'll take just Priesthood, though)
Mao lacks only Alpha and CoL.
Shaka, as you can see, won't trade anything (surprise).
I'm reluctant to give Ramses anything, so I hold off until next turn.
I think it's a tough call between sticking with Monarchy (46 left) or switching to Math (38), but I stick with Monarchy.
13: 460:
Napoleon learned Writing. Shaka has war on every civ white-lined, but won't do it even for Poly + Alpha + CoL.
14: 445: an Archer raiding from Saxon bounces off Little T's garrison.
A forest grew somewhere near Big T.
I can get Masonry from Napoleon for Priesthood and Meditation. I'd really like to open Monotheism for OR (easy missionaries) and Theology, but I hold off in the (rather faint) hope that Napoleon will demand one of those techs in tribute rather than Alpha - or CoL, which he could demand if he had Priesthood. Mao won't trade Masonry because he has his reasons (world wonder). Maybe he has stone, since he already built the Henge, and could be working on the Pyramids now. Oddly, Masonry is whitelined for HC and Ramses, both Industrious. Come on, HC, build some wonders for us!
15: 430:
Ramses will trade Math and Masonry for CoL. I think it's well worth considering because then we could research Construction, build Cats and get our groove on relatively soon. Seems like the main disadvantage is that he's the #1 civ. I leave it to frankcor.
Plains Corn near Little T finishes, I switch its one pop onto it. Now Little T will grow in 2 turns. It will also get its second border pop next turn.
A Great Prophet is due in 40 turns. We'll have to declare on someone then. I don't know, maybe HC, if we think we can wear him down in a defensive war? We'll need to immediately run at least one priest or settled Great Prophet to support Little T. The obvious thing to do with the Prophet would be building the Hindu shrine (3 priest slots), but I think settling him or lightbulbing Theology, if available, are also plausible options. The Hindu shrine might get Hinduism to Napoleon for free, but I fear Napoleon might also be upriver of Ramses.
That Philosophy slingshot with Caste System scientists still seems possible, but difficult since we have such low population. One possible strategic advantage would be to delay the day of prophecy, if we did it so that our first great person was a scientist rather than a prophet.
I'd suggest settling A4 (production monster), then either B, H, or I:
The barb warrior attacking Little T attacks intercepting Archer and dies. A barb Archer appears north of big T. I find a barb city in an unappetizing spot to the west, 1N of the Deer. HC will trade Alphabet - very tempting. I hold off, but I think it might be good to trade for it after The Wheel.
7: 550: Copper mine finishes in Little T. Move Confucian Missionary to hill (known safe) for fogusting.
8: 535: ...
9: 520: Barb city appears 3 NE of Little T.
10: 505: I move Little T's 1 pop from the Oasis to the Copper mine. The Wheel is still due in 2.
11: 490: Big T finishes Jag and its whip weariness runs out. I switch it to max food tiles and start another Jag so that it can grow in 1 turn.
12: 475:
Big T grows, switches to Settler.
I notice that bizarrely, the only other Wonder completed is Stonehenge, by Mao in 750.
Finish The Wheel and look at trading options. HC now has Math and will trade it. Ramses still won't trade Alpha, Math, or Monarchy. For CoL, I could get Alpha (only) from HC and everything else from Ramses. We don't have a huge immediate need for any of those techs except perhaps AW, although at some point we could trade Alpha or CoL for Math to another Civ. Hmm... I go for it.
First:
Then:
Now we're cooking with bacon. Unfortunately
Napoleon won't give anything better than Fishing for Writing and Priesthood. (He'll take just Priesthood, though)
Mao lacks only Alpha and CoL.
Shaka, as you can see, won't trade anything (surprise).
I'm reluctant to give Ramses anything, so I hold off until next turn.
I think it's a tough call between sticking with Monarchy (46 left) or switching to Math (38), but I stick with Monarchy.
13: 460:
Napoleon learned Writing. Shaka has war on every civ white-lined, but won't do it even for Poly + Alpha + CoL.
14: 445: an Archer raiding from Saxon bounces off Little T's garrison.
A forest grew somewhere near Big T.
I can get Masonry from Napoleon for Priesthood and Meditation. I'd really like to open Monotheism for OR (easy missionaries) and Theology, but I hold off in the (rather faint) hope that Napoleon will demand one of those techs in tribute rather than Alpha - or CoL, which he could demand if he had Priesthood. Mao won't trade Masonry because he has his reasons (world wonder). Maybe he has stone, since he already built the Henge, and could be working on the Pyramids now. Oddly, Masonry is whitelined for HC and Ramses, both Industrious. Come on, HC, build some wonders for us!
15: 430:
Ramses will trade Math and Masonry for CoL. I think it's well worth considering because then we could research Construction, build Cats and get our groove on relatively soon. Seems like the main disadvantage is that he's the #1 civ. I leave it to frankcor.
Plains Corn near Little T finishes, I switch its one pop onto it. Now Little T will grow in 2 turns. It will also get its second border pop next turn.
A Great Prophet is due in 40 turns. We'll have to declare on someone then. I don't know, maybe HC, if we think we can wear him down in a defensive war? We'll need to immediately run at least one priest or settled Great Prophet to support Little T. The obvious thing to do with the Prophet would be building the Hindu shrine (3 priest slots), but I think settling him or lightbulbing Theology, if available, are also plausible options. The Hindu shrine might get Hinduism to Napoleon for free, but I fear Napoleon might also be upriver of Ramses.
That Philosophy slingshot with Caste System scientists still seems possible, but difficult since we have such low population. One possible strategic advantage would be to delay the day of prophecy, if we did it so that our first great person was a scientist rather than a prophet.
I'd suggest settling A4 (production monster), then either B, H, or I:
I've got the save and I'll start playing tonight, probably post in the morning.
I've got a couple of questions, though:
I'm not certain what you mean by "support."
I've got a couple of questions, though:
Jet said:
I'm not certain what you mean by "support."
What is the advantage of delaying a great prophet? Wouldn't shrine income always be a good thing?Jet said:
I concur. I'll work on getting settlers out.Jet said:
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
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I meant support in the sense that the variant rules require Temple of Doom to run one priest or settled great prophet per "non-core" city. You can think of the specialists as "supporting" the cities.
> What is the advantage of delaying a great prophet?
It might (or might not) be a strategic advantage to delay the first great prophet because the requirement to declare war and the variant restrictions don't kick in until the first prophet is born. Furthermore once the restrictions kick in it will be much harder to farm any great people other than prophets. The second great person could be a scientist if we wanted to do that and were careful about it. I wouldn't have suggested delaying the first prophet unless there was also some other motivation to do it - for example, making the first great person a scientist for a Philosophy lightbulb.
> Wouldn't shrine income always be a good thing?
Well, I can elaborate a little on
> The obvious thing to do with the [first] Prophet would be building the Hindu
> shrine (3 priest slots), but I think settling him or lightbulbing Theology,
> if available, are also plausible options. The Hindu shrine might get Hinduism to
> Napoleon for free, but I fear Napoleon might also be upriver of Ramses.
In general the first great people give the most payback from settling because their bonuses last the longest. In our variant settled great prophets also "support" non-core cities. A Theology lightbulb would give us a religion and deny it to the others, and give us a trader tech, and open a military civic.
> What is the advantage of delaying a great prophet?
It might (or might not) be a strategic advantage to delay the first great prophet because the requirement to declare war and the variant restrictions don't kick in until the first prophet is born. Furthermore once the restrictions kick in it will be much harder to farm any great people other than prophets. The second great person could be a scientist if we wanted to do that and were careful about it. I wouldn't have suggested delaying the first prophet unless there was also some other motivation to do it - for example, making the first great person a scientist for a Philosophy lightbulb.
> Wouldn't shrine income always be a good thing?
Well, I can elaborate a little on
> The obvious thing to do with the [first] Prophet would be building the Hindu
> shrine (3 priest slots), but I think settling him or lightbulbing Theology,
> if available, are also plausible options. The Hindu shrine might get Hinduism to
> Napoleon for free, but I fear Napoleon might also be upriver of Ramses.
In general the first great people give the most payback from settling because their bonuses last the longest. In our variant settled great prophets also "support" non-core cities. A Theology lightbulb would give us a religion and deny it to the others, and give us a trader tech, and open a military civic.
The barbarians are really nerve-wracking in this game!
Inherited turn (430 BC): My goals for this turnset were similar to my previous one:
1. Establish a 3rd city
2. Work some trades
3. Start building a freakin' army, for goodness sakes! We're using Jaguars for fogbusting and they are terrible against Axemen. We need to use them for capturing cities; they're darned good at that.
Site A1 on Jet's maps looked like the best spot for a city and he had a settler being trained in Big-T. I observed the path there was well lit by fog busters and we've got an archer nearby ready to be the garrison for the new city.
I was struck by the utter lack of roads in our empire. Did I miss a variant?
Turn 1 (415 BC):
IBT: We met Victoria. She would only offer us Fishing in exchange for Meditation, not a very useful technology on this map. So I upped the ante:
We sealed the deal, but I passed on the kiss. The gained technologies knocked about 8 turns off Monarchy(24).
Turn 2 (400 BC):
IBT: A Barbarian Archer from Saxon committed Suicide by Aztec at Little-T. Our garrison Archer earned a CGII promotion.
Turn 3 (385 BC): Little-T grew to size 2 and started working the gold mine.
Turn 4 (370 BC):
IBT: Ramesses Jr. made a demand:
We were at +2 relations with him so I took a chance he wouldn't go ballistic on us and I refused. He would trade Sailing with us but I couldn't think of a good reason to ask. Note that our days of 100% researching were just about over.
Turn 5 (355 BC):
Turn 6 (340 BC):
IBT: A Barbarian Axeman came out of the fog south of Little-T.
Turn 7 (325 BC): Little-T trained a Jaguar. A Monument was next in the queue but I figured we can postpone it a bit because we've already popped our borders there. I moved the Jaguar south to greet the Barbarian Axeman approaching.
Turn 8 (310 BC):
IBT: Another Barbarian Axeman is seen outside of Saxon; an Archer is approaching from the Northwest. Napoleon made a demand:
Turn 9 (295 BC): Our eastern Jaguar killed a Barbarian Warrior at very high odds.
IBT: The souther Barbarian Axeman parked on top of our Copper mine outside of Little-T.
Turn 9 (295 BC): Our Jaguar at Little-T can only get 30% odds on the Axeman, even with a Shock (25% Melee) promotion. We're going to lose that copper mine.
IBT: There are now 3 Barb Axeman and an Archer bearing down on Little-T. Napoleon wanted us to give him Mathematics for Sailing. We ain't got no time for sailing.
Turn 10 (280 BC):
IBT: Napoleon wanted us to give him Mathematics for Sailing. We ain't got no time for sailing.
Turn 11 (265 BC): Cripes! I just realize I never swapped out the Monument at Little-T. We'd been building it all along instead of building something useful like a military unit! I switched to an Archer but there was no way to whip it. Big-T finished the Settler and continued training a Jaguar. I sent the settler to A-1.
IBT: The southern Barbarian Axeman attacked Little-T and died without leaving a scratch on our Archer. The Barbarian Archer bypassed the Gold Mine and continued on toward Little-T. He and another Axeman will arrive outside the city together. Sheesh, our Jaguar won't have a chance to kill him before he gets there if they land on the same tile.
Turn 12 (250 BC):
IBT: The Archer attacked the Gold mine afterall, and died; the Axeman continued on to the city.
A Machiavellian evaluation:
Turn 13 (235 BC):
IBT: The next Axeman to arrive at Little-T pillaged the road to the gold mine. The third one is now only 2 tiles away.
Turn 14 (220 BC): Tlatleco (Middle-T?) was founded and started work on a monument. I decided to bail out of roading the Gold mine and start remining the Copper. We need something to fight back these Barbarian Axemen. Jaguars are useless against them.
IBT: Our wounded Archer on top of the Gold mine was got killed by one of the Axemen outside of Little-T. A Barbarian Warrior attacked our Archer outside of Saxon and died.
Turn 15 (205 BC): I moved our Jaguar in Little-T out to get ready to counterattack the Axeman on the Gold mine -- he can get 99% odds if the Axeman pillages and doesn't do any healing. Our Archer outside Saxon is healing on the hilltop and we now have 2 Archers in Little-T; I moved one of our fogbusters inside.
That's it. I've shifted some of our fog busters around, hoping to shore up defenses at Little-T. The eastern fogbusting Jaguar is now moving toward Saxon. If our Jaguar in LIttle-T survives attacking the Axeman, we'll have a shot at capturing Saxon. Take a look and adjust as you see fit.
Here's The Save. Good luck and have fun.
Inherited turn (430 BC): My goals for this turnset were similar to my previous one:
1. Establish a 3rd city
2. Work some trades
3. Start building a freakin' army, for goodness sakes! We're using Jaguars for fogbusting and they are terrible against Axemen. We need to use them for capturing cities; they're darned good at that.
Site A1 on Jet's maps looked like the best spot for a city and he had a settler being trained in Big-T. I observed the path there was well lit by fog busters and we've got an archer nearby ready to be the garrison for the new city.
I was struck by the utter lack of roads in our empire. Did I miss a variant?
Turn 1 (415 BC):
IBT: We met Victoria. She would only offer us Fishing in exchange for Meditation, not a very useful technology on this map. So I upped the ante:
We sealed the deal, but I passed on the kiss. The gained technologies knocked about 8 turns off Monarchy(24).
Turn 2 (400 BC):
IBT: A Barbarian Archer from Saxon committed Suicide by Aztec at Little-T. Our garrison Archer earned a CGII promotion.
Turn 3 (385 BC): Little-T grew to size 2 and started working the gold mine.
Turn 4 (370 BC):
IBT: Ramesses Jr. made a demand:
We were at +2 relations with him so I took a chance he wouldn't go ballistic on us and I refused. He would trade Sailing with us but I couldn't think of a good reason to ask. Note that our days of 100% researching were just about over.
Turn 5 (355 BC):
Turn 6 (340 BC):
IBT: A Barbarian Axeman came out of the fog south of Little-T.
Turn 7 (325 BC): Little-T trained a Jaguar. A Monument was next in the queue but I figured we can postpone it a bit because we've already popped our borders there. I moved the Jaguar south to greet the Barbarian Axeman approaching.
Turn 8 (310 BC):
IBT: Another Barbarian Axeman is seen outside of Saxon; an Archer is approaching from the Northwest. Napoleon made a demand:
Turn 9 (295 BC): Our eastern Jaguar killed a Barbarian Warrior at very high odds.
IBT: The souther Barbarian Axeman parked on top of our Copper mine outside of Little-T.
Turn 9 (295 BC): Our Jaguar at Little-T can only get 30% odds on the Axeman, even with a Shock (25% Melee) promotion. We're going to lose that copper mine.
IBT: There are now 3 Barb Axeman and an Archer bearing down on Little-T. Napoleon wanted us to give him Mathematics for Sailing. We ain't got no time for sailing.
Turn 10 (280 BC):
IBT: Napoleon wanted us to give him Mathematics for Sailing. We ain't got no time for sailing.
Turn 11 (265 BC): Cripes! I just realize I never swapped out the Monument at Little-T. We'd been building it all along instead of building something useful like a military unit! I switched to an Archer but there was no way to whip it. Big-T finished the Settler and continued training a Jaguar. I sent the settler to A-1.
IBT: The southern Barbarian Axeman attacked Little-T and died without leaving a scratch on our Archer. The Barbarian Archer bypassed the Gold Mine and continued on toward Little-T. He and another Axeman will arrive outside the city together. Sheesh, our Jaguar won't have a chance to kill him before he gets there if they land on the same tile.
Turn 12 (250 BC):
IBT: The Archer attacked the Gold mine afterall, and died; the Axeman continued on to the city.
A Machiavellian evaluation:
Turn 13 (235 BC):
IBT: The next Axeman to arrive at Little-T pillaged the road to the gold mine. The third one is now only 2 tiles away.
Turn 14 (220 BC): Tlatleco (Middle-T?) was founded and started work on a monument. I decided to bail out of roading the Gold mine and start remining the Copper. We need something to fight back these Barbarian Axemen. Jaguars are useless against them.
IBT: Our wounded Archer on top of the Gold mine was got killed by one of the Axemen outside of Little-T. A Barbarian Warrior attacked our Archer outside of Saxon and died.
Turn 15 (205 BC): I moved our Jaguar in Little-T out to get ready to counterattack the Axeman on the Gold mine -- he can get 99% odds if the Axeman pillages and doesn't do any healing. Our Archer outside Saxon is healing on the hilltop and we now have 2 Archers in Little-T; I moved one of our fogbusters inside.
That's it. I've shifted some of our fog busters around, hoping to shore up defenses at Little-T. The eastern fogbusting Jaguar is now moving toward Saxon. If our Jaguar in LIttle-T survives attacking the Axeman, we'll have a shot at capturing Saxon. Take a look and adjust as you see fit.
Here's The Save. Good luck and have fun.
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2006
- Messages
- 2,431
frankcor, we didn't have any roads because we didn't have The Wheel until the turnset before yours.
I suggest we cultivate relations with Napoleon because he's an unaligned warmonger and not friendly with Ramses. For example we might get a trade relations bonus if we traded Alphabet for Sailing. However, Napoleon "has enough on his hands right now". If "enough" means us, I'm not sure whether a boost in relations will help. I've heard that it won't. Does anyone know?
Bummer that Shaka converted to Ramses's religion.
frankcor, what units did you see in the Incan cities? Did you see any evidence of HC having metal? It might not be that long before he has Longbows.
Big T isn't working its cows. Good call chopping in Big T, frankcor, since at this point I'm not sure a Philosophy slingshot and chopping Angkor Wat is realistic, but I suggest that if we build a road there it would be better to build one to the river instead of to the Rice. Then Hinduism might spread more, and Big T might be able to build Axes.
The day of prophecy is in 25 turns, during Bede's turn set. Razing Saxon for XP might be a good idea but wouldn't count as the day of prophecy war declaraton.
I suggest we cultivate relations with Napoleon because he's an unaligned warmonger and not friendly with Ramses. For example we might get a trade relations bonus if we traded Alphabet for Sailing. However, Napoleon "has enough on his hands right now". If "enough" means us, I'm not sure whether a boost in relations will help. I've heard that it won't. Does anyone know?
Bummer that Shaka converted to Ramses's religion.
frankcor, what units did you see in the Incan cities? Did you see any evidence of HC having metal? It might not be that long before he has Longbows.
Big T isn't working its cows. Good call chopping in Big T, frankcor, since at this point I'm not sure a Philosophy slingshot and chopping Angkor Wat is realistic, but I suggest that if we build a road there it would be better to build one to the river instead of to the Rice. Then Hinduism might spread more, and Big T might be able to build Axes.
The day of prophecy is in 25 turns, during Bede's turn set. Razing Saxon for XP might be a good idea but wouldn't count as the day of prophecy war declaraton.
Swiss Pauli
Emperor
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2006
- Messages
- 1,805
I've got and will play tomorrow, but I'll look at the save directly.
Ok, I squeezed in my turns today. Actually, I took a couple of extra turns: on my penultimate turn a barb sword turned up at poorly-defended Tlatelolco and the next turn another one arrived. I decided it would be the least bad option to over-run than to hand over such a mess to Bede. We saw off the swords and have 8 turns til Doomsday.
Will post a full report tonight.
Ok, I squeezed in my turns today. Actually, I took a couple of extra turns: on my penultimate turn a barb sword turned up at poorly-defended Tlatelolco and the next turn another one arrived. I decided it would be the least bad option to over-run than to hand over such a mess to Bede. We saw off the swords and have 8 turns til Doomsday.
Will post a full report tonight.
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