T_McC02 - The Forbidden Traits (Emp, Cont)

[Bezhukov]

"the next clost city that will produce a GP is like 15 turns away in lybran or what ever the cities is called."

Were we running Pacifism with lots of specialists (i.e. at least six in two or three cities) as was planned?

Iznik was supposed to hire five, including three engineers to build the National Epic the turn I handed off the game 20 turns ago, so there should be a GP coming there soonish.

 

[Sharog]

yes iznik is producing quite some point, but it is still half way from full. and a spanish city we counquered somehow managed to hire 8 specs, so that one is the clost to getting one right now, i hired like 5 merchant there and hope we dont get another scientist.

and we havent swiched to pacifism yet and i had tons of infra stuff to build during my turn and 5 casings + some other part. and we can switch after we can fusion i think. since we wont have many parts to build.

 

[Bezhukov]

"we havent swiched to pacifism yet"

Well, that would explain the lack of GP's. Hate it when a plan falls apart. Oh well.

 

[romeothemonk]

IHT: Well a few things. Many of our cities were unhealthy, so I threw in some harbors and aquaducts. Our spies were all in Peter's land, NOt Capacs.
I swap a few things, actually, more than half the builds. We want Marines, not Tanks. Get some more Navy started.
Disband some ancient military.
Turn 1: I spend 200 gold and blow up a spice plantation in HC's land. WOOT. Stuff builds, etc.

Turn 2: More stuff builds, Heavy Infra pushing.

Turn 3: We get Fusion, A GE and a Golden AGE!! Research to get us a fridge so we can store our beer.

Turn 4: Actually get a Missionary to spread religion. YaY!!

Turn 5: Workers are doing a Civ3 Style RR JOb now. Moving ships around to prepare for trouble with HC.

Turn 6: We have a GE by Istanbul

Turn Whatever: A good portion of our Navy is by Zaragoza.


Turn 9: I know this is generally bad SG ettiquette, but HC converted religions to Taoism, and I could buy in Peter and Toku. So I did!!
I have been building a bunch of jails, I have Rushmore going, and I have been sneaking in temples and such.
I also pillaged with spies a lot of HC's resources, dropping his trading relations.
Be advised we are not yet at war, but could be really soon like!!

Turn 10: we build the internet. (Inserts the video "The Internet is for Porn" )

Anyway, thoughts: Keep using spies to really Mess up HC. Keep some Marines coming, along with building airports for trade and troop transit to the other continent.
Toku build his apollo, but we shouldn't have to worry too much.

Health, and then happiness once the war starts will be key.

When the war starts, use our ships and Marines to take a lightly defended city on the coast, then ship over some modern armors and Mechs. Then it is pretty much game over man for the Incans.

Other random thoughts involve utilizing our many Janissaries to Defend by Volume, if we take a city from the Inca. Otherwise we may wish to disband them.

We got flight, satellites and composites on my last turn from the internet, so there are probably some SS parts to build now. We get genetics next turn, so that will help quite nicely as well.
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/T_McC_AD-1920.Civ4SavedGame

 

[Bezhukov]

"HC converted religions to Taoism, and I could buy in Peter and Toku"

Romeo, for the win!



I have difficulty seeing how we lose from this position, short of nukes. Who's up?

 

[Woebearer]

Belive that's me, I got it and will play soon...

 

[Woebearer]

1920 (Preflight) - Everything is fine, or fine enough. This game looks to be well in hand, especially since we got the happy-go-lucky continent bashing eachother's skulls in.

1921 (1) - Genetics ---> Ecology Robotics comes in from the Internet. So we are reseaching our last SS tech. Romeo must of went on a spending spree last turn, just about every town finished a build. Start our SS parts in our top production cities, most will be built in about 10 turns. Take a gander around HC high production cites, all are building Jet Fighters and most are starving!

1922 (2) - Pop an Engineer in Lybian, too far away from our next GP to get a GA out of it, so I decide to do a elevator rush to expidite our finish. More Military in HC's cities.

1923 (3) - Eco ---> Medicine. Cut science to 0% Santiago will have Lab finished next turn, so I will build the Life Support there.

1924 (4) - Rush Elevator, put science back up.

1925 (5) - Elevator comes (screwed up screenie). Get Mass Media via Internet. Our longest SS project is 6 turns from completion. Workers on Automate, building wealth were there aren't any problems (sorry, don't know the procedure for milking points).

1926 (6) -

1927 (7) -

1928 (8) -

1929 (9) - Thrusters and Life Support built. HC cancels a deal.

1930 (10) - More parts come in, HC cancels another deal, putting a lot of our cities sick and unhappy. One turn left on the last of our spaceship parts.

T_McC.... care to do the honors?

View attachment 117678

 

[T_McC]

One <Enter> later ...

The end Demographics

Having 2X the GDP and 2X the production of the #2 civ will usually get the job done.

And the end Finances

Organized was worth 121 gpt, or ~5% science due to the multipliers. Maybe more critically we rarely had to leave Org Rel and could effectively have free Forges in all of our cities.

So despite a fairly bad starting location this game wasn't that close in the end. We probably could have won even without the war on the other continent as Huyana still had techs to research and three parts to build. But every little bit helps.

The primary thing I take away from this game is that the Redcoat is a really strong UU.

 

[Woebearer]

The primary thing I take away from this game is that the Redcoat is a really strong UU.

Agreed, if you have and catch a civ that is even slightly behind on techs..... Even if they do have rifles that bonus to gunpowder gives you a huge advantage.

Not a really good test of the two traits, but you can blame the starting locations on that. Also, nothing here disuaded me from my opinion that Creative and Organized are the two weakest traits.

Now, a real test of the "Forbiddin Traits" would be Philo/Ind. Partho/Philo/Pasa/Epic anyone?

 

[Bezhukov]

"Having 2X the GDP and 2X the production of the #2 civ will usually get the job done."

Only 2X? Slackers.

I agree on redcoats. A couple notes: they can be drafted for one pop (infantry cost two, and mechs three). Grenadiers don't get their usual bonus that they do vs. the unit redcoats replace (rifles). And they come at the point in the tech tree where an economically-focused strategy is ready to bust out and whoop some butt.

"Also, nothing here disuaded me from my opinion that Creative and Organized are the two weakest traits."

Well, since the strength of this trait combination is grabbing tiles, and:

A: we weren't given many practical tiles to grab by this map.
B: we often weren't bothering to work the tiles we had.

Not really the ideal test. T McC makes a good point on OR, as I often find it ruinously expensive when not playing an org civ. I wouldn't underestimate the value of cheap court and lighthouses either. I'll agree that creative didn't really come into play that much, though it helped us get Wall Street built in Teno by stealing its productive tiles from Toku.

"we got the happy-go-lucky continent bashing eachother's skulls in."

What's this "we"? This was Romeo's devious brilliance once again coming through in the clutch. And I said it couldn't be done!

 

[romeothemonk]

Actually, this game confirmed something that I already knew.

Bez and T_McC are 2 of the best guys to SG with.

T_McC uses his analytical wit to sort through many difficult and challenging puzzles.

Bez makes lots of comments and plays a very sound game that can break in a lot of ways.

I have a tendancy to like to bash some heads.

Note that I will usually play in any SG I can with these 2 guys.

Thanks for the great game guys. I will prolly check back into SG's after the next patch. I am currently trying to develop and define a style in PBEM and multiplayer games. And reading lots of books.

Any time T_McC and/or Bez want a warmonger, they know where to look.

 

[Sharog]

;0 strong finishing turn romeo !

 

[Bezhukov]

We could try it again on a map like Great Plains or Highlands where the traits would be more valuable...