Teaser ...

[Fallensmith]

I have created a simulation of the start (attached), trying to get things on it as accurately as possible. In the simulation Monarchy and Republic are avalible without Techs for easier testing. (The lone AI is on a forest island to the south, if you're curious )

The Gold Hill is 2/1/5 as our capital under Despotism. (1/3/5 non capital, improved) (EDIT: Err, obviously 1/2/5)
As our capital under Monarchy it is 2/1/6. (1/3/6)
Under Republic it is 2/1/7. (1/3/7)

The minimum trade of the capital I believe is 3 in despotism and 4 in anything else. Having the capital on that square gives no bonus trade, whereas on other squares it might give a trade bonus.

On the Ivory, investigation yields the same null trade bonus for all governments.

On the forest (Normally a Plains, I think, producing 2/1/2 from irr+road+river), the capital is 2/1/3, 2/1/4, 2/1/5.

So settling on the forest gives one, (then two) bonus trade, and neither of the other good squares gives any. With such a small difference the hill is probably best IMO. (Though I hate to waste Whales :/)

EDIT Again: Somehow the wrong save, from my first version with a wrong whale placement, got on here instead of the correct one with it moved a bit. Sorry for the mistake.

EDIT: Did a bit of touch up on the edges based on educated guesses and absences of water.

 

[classical_hero]

Actually there are only two real option after having a look at the save. That would be where we are or on the Ivory.

 

[peter grimes]

I'm fine staying where we are, but if I were playing at home, my instincts would lead me to not waste the whale. I just imagine that everyone else will have as good a start, and I doubt they would waste a turn..... I'm so torn!

Thanks for the analysis, Fallensmith!

 

[classical_hero]

I'm fine staying where we are, but if I were playing at home, my instincts would lead me to not waste the whale. I just imagine that everyone else will have as good a start, and I doubt they would waste a turn..... I'm so torn!

Thanks for the analysis, Fallensmith!

I think that the consensus is that we should stay on the original site.

 

[Fallensmith]

Sorry, Classical Hero, made a mistake on the whale in that last save.

 

[classical_hero]

You did too, but I still think that we will stick with the original site. It is a shame that we cnnot get every resource to be perfectly placed, but it is still an excellent start.

 

[Meleager]

Sorry didn't realise there was a second page. Replied to something already figured out.

 

[RegentMan]

Just so you know: Wines do not give a food bonus. They give +2 gold instead.

 

[Meleager]

Here are some pics of some possible starts.

I think that staying where we are is best (though we miss out on a whale, and wont have a costal city).

Where we are we have access to some bonus grassland when we expand as well.

@Regent Man - Is that a clue

 

[Rik Meleet]

Mele: the gold hill-site is coastal...

 

[Meleager]

Ahh, so it is (am I blind?). Yet another reason to just stay.

 

[Kentharu]

settle right there!! this is the best starting place i ever saw wasting a turn moving would be pointless

 

[fe3333au]

Great analysis of options and testing ... we better settle on the gold ... defence bonus of the hill is also good

 

[classical_hero]

If we were to move, it would only be on the coast, but we are not going to move.

 

[Chamnix]

I strongly agree with the current consensus of settling in place – my primary reason is that we want to be able to work a food bonus immediately instead of having to wait until the capital expands.

I would be thinking about what we plan to do with our capital – i.e. what improvements do we make and in what order. We have the magic +5 fpt without any improvements already once we get to size 2. An old-fashioned 4-turn settler factory would be easy to set up (once we get pottery). Alternatively, we could irrigate both the cow and the wheat for +7 fpt meaning we grow every 3 turns even without a granary for an easy 6-turn settler + warrior factory.

I’m leaning toward the 6-turn +7fpt settler + warrior factory. Based on our research thread, we will not have pottery anytime soon, and in multiplayer I think expanding too fast without building an adequate military is probably suicide.

 

[peter grimes]

Let me see if I understand the idea behind the settler/warrior factory:

After a settler is built, the population goes down by two, and rather than build another settler before the city builds back up to previous level you build a warrior, then go back to settler. It's a stable pattern of growth/decrease that allows production of settlers and warriors indefinitely?

 

[Chamnix]

Exactly right.

 

[Black_Hole]

we could get pottery after iron working and the wheel

 

[fe3333au]

Let me see if I understand the idea behind the settler/warrior factory:

After a settler is built, the population goes down by two, and rather than build another settler before the city builds back up to previous level you build a warrior, then go back to settler. It's a stable pattern of growth/decrease that allows production of settlers and warriors indefinitely?

Lets add the currugh (sp?) early in the production line as well ... we need to expore the coastline

 

[classical_hero]

Athens will be a great settler factory with or without a granary. It will get even better once we are out of despotism, but that is for domestic to decide.