(Testing) Leader Personalities Idea

Yeah sc369's feedback has been really valuable in helping iron out the kinks. After I do my dailies in FFXIV today, I'm gonna start a game I intend to completely finish with these settings.

Assuming Gazebo doesn't make an update right in the middle of it LOL. <3 your release cycle Gazebo
 
Haha, well, I love starting new games so I don't mind too much usually :p

FFXIV is such a cool game! Can't really find the time to spend on it and Guild Wars 2 though (and Civ and others... but mostly, one MMO is quite time consuming enough!).
 
I used to play GW2 but my frustration with Arenanet led me to FFXIV and I'm not looking back. They're really on a mission with this game and it shows. Plus HW is coming out soon :D

That said, helping this project makes me feel a little like a developer lol.
 
I love GW2 too much to leave it, quite frankly, and I'm still ok with Arenanet for the moment, so... I just took a couple of breaks here and there since it launched, so I still have plenty to do. Although really it's also because: 1) monthly fee, I can't afford that at the moment; 2) everyone I know play GW2 and nearly nobody FFXIV, which includes my SO, so I'm not switching over just yet :D

Modding is a pretty awesome feeling. Making changes to a game you love is hard to describe, it just feel so rewarding (although a large part of modding is also frustration). I haven't quite modded Civ5, only a civilization in the early days, but I always get the itch to do so.
 
Yeah GW2 had it moments, especially with fun people to play it with. Design problems, bugs, and a slow content release cycle are what turned me off the most but that can be alleviated with the social aspect. World v. World was pretty electrifying the first time I experienced it - dozens of people fighting and burning down a keep was great for that first two hours.

FFXIV is going to keep me for years though. I feel like it's what WoW should be like - great story, great economic system, raiding, fast content release cycle, and so much to do. My FC (guild in FFXIV terms) has some badass people in it, raid progression, and I help them out by making millions of gil and providing stuff they and I need to maximize our performance in those fights. The upcoming expansion is going to be incredible - to be honest Heart of Thorns looks like a small patch compared to it, but that's just my opinion.

Yeah, Civ 5 has been a game I have played on and off for years and this project honestly stopped me from getting the new Civ game and now this is the ultimate Civ game IMO. The quality of this project has been getting stronger every month and it's great to play a part in it, however small mine may be.
 
Hotfix: the version I had up earlier today doesn't work correctly I have a new one uploaded. The problem was the Nuke flavor was deleted from the Policy flavors, so I replaced it with Use_Nuke. It will work correctly now.
 
I'm going to start a new game now with the latest flavors and see if we can get a war going. I will select entirely Nationalist civs. If I need to, I will bribe the AIs to fight each other and see what happens.
 
I'm afraid it was a damp squib. Turn 170 and there have been no wars whatsoever.

The Mongols did the best, eating 4 CS. Several people have denounced me and them, but no-one wants to actually fight. Lots of diplomatic offers to declare war, but no actual wars.
 
I played a bit over the weekend with the 6-1 version of CBP and jma's flavor's downloaded from this thread. Seems like I am late for the party again, as Gazebo released a new version again today, but I think it did not touch jma's falvors, so my comments below are probably still valid.

My settings were: Epic, Emperor, Huge Communitas with low sea level, 18 AI Civs, 16 CSs. Bunch of other mods, but none altering flavors or adding new civs. The only change of rules is that I set min distance between cities to 4 tiles. I have played 351 turns and I am in the Reneissance era now and I have been very happy with the AI performance.

A few comments about my play-through so far:

1) Civs expanded quite well in the beginning, the civs around me expanded at similar rate as I did. All civs now have 4-8 cities, except Russia, which has only the capital - a strong city with a good infrastructure. I have not uncovered all the area around it, so I do not know if they did not have enough space to expand or what was the actual reason why they did not found any other cities.

2) I have found quite a lot of unclaimed land in Medieval and reneissance era though. It seems as if the AI civs did not want to expand beyond 6-7 cities. I claimed some of the land for my own. I can see that my French neighbor has a settler parked near the capital, but they do not send it to the unclaimed land next to their current territory on the same continent (they already have 6 cities by the way).

3) It seems that there have been no wars at all so far. I checked the names of all cities owned by the AI civs in the Diplo screen and there are no foreign names (I do not know about Huns, but they are so backward, that I do not think they have conquered anything). I started next to France, Napoleon became hostile very quickly, coveted my lands, hated me for settling near him and for me telling him to mind his own business when he protested against my expansion. He also had a stronger military than me in the early game. Yet he has never DOWed me. I know I should not base my conclusions just on 1 play-through, but it seems that sc369 had a similar experience.

UPDATE: Indonesia declared war on the Incas! Yeey!! ... I mean ... that is unfortunate, war is a terrible thing :)

4) It seems that AI produces enough units now and upgrades them properly. Yet they do not go bankrupt. It seems that jma managed to break the vicious cycle :)

5) About one fourth of civs have negative GPT a bit, but nobody is going bankrupt probably thanks to the liberty policies granting money upon expanding territory, etc. Some civs were a little unhappy in the Medieval era, but now everyone is happy. The Celts are the scientific leader with 38 techs, I am second with 36. Russia and Huns have 21 techs. Unlike in my early May version games, nobody is producing 0 science beakers and even the backward civs are researching new techs.

6) As somebody else mentioned in another thread, CSs have close to non-existent armies - usually something like 1-2 non-resource melee unit and an archer.
 
Good to hear it's going better!

As far as getting the AI to go to war, I think I've done all I can on that from the flavors/personalities end. 3 of the 4 archetypes focus on war as a top priority so it might be a peripheral AI issue, like diplomacy AI.

The Russia situation sounds like they got conquered to me. I'd check the Cities tab of InfoAddict to see if there was any flux in the # of cities civs have because a One City Civ with 10 Expansion is weird.

I vaguely remember that there was old AI settings a long time ago about Culture Grand Strategies wanting to sit on 4 cities but I'll double check on that.
 
The Russia situation sounds like they got conquered to me. I'd check the Cities tab of InfoAddict to see if there was any flux in the # of cities civs have because a One City Civ with 10 Expansion is weird.

Nope, I got a repeatable CTD shortly after I wrote my report, so as part of debugging I retired and watched the map replay. Russia never expanded beyond its capital and there have been no wars anywhere ever until turn 355 or so.

However the civs around Russia boxed her in very quickly, so maybe if her first settlers got captured by barbs or if she was focusing on something else in the beginning, there was only a little space to expand - the replay map is too small, but I think she had enough space to squeeze in one additional city for a while. Maybe she did not want to anger the neighboring expansionist civs by settling right next to them??? Does AI consider such things?

I also used IGE now and revealed the whole map at turn 364 (I am getting the CTD on turn 345) and found out there was one more 1-city civ - the Assyrians. The very funny thing is their army: it consists of 1 swordsman and 18 Siege Towers!!! Apart of these units, it has 2 Great Scientists, 2 idle settlers a worker and a Great musicians. By the way, there is an ok-ish spot nect to their territory, where they could plop a city.

The Huns have 4 cities (one is on an island), but their land army consists solely of Battering Rams. They have a settler, a worker and several Dromons. If they cross a narrow strait, there is a big island where they could probably plop another city or 2.

Some civs have good armies, some are stretched too wide and thin with not enough units to defend their borders (if they were attacked). Also it seems to me that they focus too much on their UUs (at least the Huns and Assyrians do in this game).

I suppose the military units mix/variety is adjusted by Gazebo, not your flavors, correct?
 
I have no idea what's going on with that one. I saw what Gazebo said about AI logging in the 6-6 thread so I'm going to be logging any test games I run now and uploading them so they can be analyzed.

The expansion flavor is higher than any other so if they are sitting on a single city then it's a combination of other factors. It looks like they're building the settlers, but not using them, which is a different problem than flavors/personalities.

The military units are also puzzling because I have all four AIs value Ranged, Offense, Mobile, Air, and Navy equally. I choose those because they are the "Trinity" of Land warfare, naval, and air power - the idea is for the AI to want to have a Combined Arms force by valuing those flavors higher than the others.

I don't know why Assyria would want to build 18 Siege Towers lol. That's just insane. The flavors tell him to build units like Horse Archers, Swordsmen, and Siege Towers but maybe he didn't have any Horses...? Idk that's kind of funny lol. Not using Great People is also really weird.

As far as not settling near other civs, I'd have to dig into the Diplomacy AI which frankly scares the crap out of me lol. I might take the plunge though because as much as this has made a difference there are other areas that need to be improved to make the AI stick to these overall strategies.

As an analogy it's like these flavors are the brain telling the body to do one thing, but a neurological problem preventing that thing from happening.
 
Question..don't know how this works...ive only mess with civ files by trial and error, but the files 'names' don't match the existing ones in cbp. Your instructions say to just put it in...is that really all we do??:goodjob:
 
Best way is to copy the original files into another folder as a backup, then put the files from the RAR in the OP into the respective areas.

You could also open the files, copy the text, and paste into the appropriate SQLs/XMLs.

Yeah it's pretty simple.
 
So I'm going to experiment with something to help the AI declare War.

http://civilization.wikia.com/wiki/AI_trait_(Civ5)

If this is to be believed, then there are some issues in the way I have my flavors set up that prevent the wars from happening.

Meanness is going to higher overall, Loyalty lower, DenounceWillingness higher, and DiploBalance will be 8. If DiploBalance is what this and other sites have said it does, then if it's high there will be a desire for everyone to maintain international balance. Boldness being 8 for everyone will make them want to fight irrespective of how strong the opponent is.

This should ramp up the wars a bit. I'll update the OP.
 
So I'm going to experiment with something to help the AI declare War.

http://civilization.wikia.com/wiki/AI_trait_(Civ5)

If this is to be believed, then there are some issues in the way I have my flavors set up that prevent the wars from happening.

Meanness is going to higher overall, Loyalty lower, DenounceWillingness higher, and DiploBalance will be 8. If DiploBalance is what this and other sites have said it does, then if it's high there will be a desire for everyone to maintain international balance. Boldness being 8 for everyone will make them want to fight irrespective of how strong the opponent is.

This should ramp up the wars a bit. I'll update the OP.

Generally, try not to ramp all the flavors up too terribly high. Anything over 8 is 'extreme' by DLL standards, especially for leader flavors. As it stands now, most of the leader flavors are either extreme, or minimal - some 'average' flavors, spread across leaders and across leader types, would be ideal for a bit more randomness.

G
 
The personalities flavors only go up to 8 I don't have anything higher.

The Expansion at 10 for Leader Flavors is the only one in double digits.

Edit: Oh I see what you mean. So reducing the tiers down from 10, 9, 8, 7 to 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, would be better?
 
The personalities flavors only go up to 8 I don't have anything higher.

The Expansion at 10 for Leader Flavors is the only one in double digits.

Edit: Oh I see what you mean. So reducing the tiers down from 10, 9, 8, 7 to 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, would be better?

Generally, yes. I mean, it is okay to have a few values over 8, but if all civs sit at around 7-9 for all their personality flavors, it may lead to erratic behavior.

G
 
I reduced the range of flavors from what they were to 0-8, but mainly 2-8. I didn't know that had adverse consequences on the DLL side my bad
 
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