The way I know this is not true is that I vividly remember my first hearing of the piece, before I knew anybody else's estimation of it. And this quote by Robert Frost came to mind (with song in place of poem):
It is absurd to think that the only way to tell if a poem is lasting is to wait and see if it lasts. The right reader of a good poem can tell the moment it strikes him that he has taken an immortal wound – that he will never get over it. That is to say, permanence in poetry as in love is perceived instantly. It hasn't to await the test of time. The proof of a poem is not that we have never forgotten it, but that we knew at sight that we never could forget it.
The way I know this is not true is that I vividly remember my first hearing of the piece, before I knew anybody else's estimation of it. And this quote by Robert Frost came to mind (with song in place of poem):
And for me, Terra Nova and Sogno di Volare. More to the point, I'm not sure how we can claim that our individual personal experience with a song disproves anything about popular conception of it. By this logic, my experience proves me right about Terra Nova, and it's the greater song! I kid, of course.
I said it in response to your claim that we believe the hype about Baba Yetu because of a self-reinforcing meme on the internet without knowing why we believe it. I'm saying I am sure of why the hype for Baba Yetu came to be, and it isn't because the internet told me to feel that way. I'm not citing my personal experience, per se, just the fact that that experience preceded anything I heard anyone else say about the piece.
It's a classic.
And I'll curtail this pedantic exchange before you even ask.
Baba Yetu is a good song but is massively overrated by this fan base. Both Terra Nova and Sogno di Volare are better to me.
I never understood the hype for Baba Yetu. It’s like a meme reinforcing itself. One of those pieces of “conventional internet wisdom” that you’re never sure how it even came to be.
I don't care how fanbase rates different songs, never actually paid attention. But I still sometimes sing Baba Yetu to myself after more than a decade not playing Civ4. Sogno di Volare was always just a song in titles to me.
Not as good, perhaps, as Sogno Di Volare and Baba Yetu, but still very, very good. I have an extensive Civ playlist that includes one theme from each civ and main themes from civ games, this will be a happy part of the collection.
I don't care how fanbase rates different songs, never actually paid attention. But I still sometimes sing Baba Yetu to myself after more than a decade not playing Civ4. Sogno di Volare was always just a song in titles to me.
Honestly my favourite main theme of the whole series. Baba Yetu has become an overplayed meme to me, and Sogno di Volare is based on a fake da Vinci quote that was made up by a mid-20th century American TV writer to forward a specific petroleum-driven futurism that was the style at the time.
And to those saying the theme sounds a bit to military/conquest focused? The song is called "Live Gloriously", not "Die Gloriously" or "Kill Gloriously". The message of the lyrics is basically, "Our time on Earth is short, so we ought to make the most of it while we still can," rather than the death-obsessed heroism Umberto Eco mentioned in the essay far too many people seem to misinterpret
Honestly my favourite main theme of the whole series. Baba Yetu has become an overplayed meme to me, and Sogno di Volare is based on a fake da Vinci quote that was made up by a mid-20th century American TV writer to forward a specific petroleum-driven futurism that was the style at the time.
And to those saying the theme sounds a bit to military/conquest focused? The song is called "Live Gloriously", not "Die Gloriously" or "Kill Gloriously". The message of the lyrics is basically, "Our time on Earth is short, so we ought to make the most of it while we still can," rather than the death-obsessed heroism Umberto Eco mentioned in the essay far too many people seem to misinterpret
The Iliad quote starting "Let me not die ingloriously and without a struggle.." is literally a quote about Hector wanting to kill Achilles in battle is it not?
The whole point of Beowulf is about battling a dragon.
Popul Vuh is more religious, for sure, and it's the one bit of the song that sounds less violent too, so it's for sure a break of theme.
Ramayana is religious too, but why would they pick, of all quotes from it, "Here let us all for death prepare or on the last great journey fare". That's clearly a heading to a final battle line.
It's called live gloriously because it's about the battle that you hopefully don't die in. The tone and lyrics are 75% about glory through battle.
Or die in a memorable way. I'll have to go back to the text, but I think he's already said that he knows he's doomed when he faces Achilles. But one can die gloriously (as he in fact goes on to; here we are still talking about him all these centuries later).
To take up the larger issue of the poster you were quoting, in cultures with a heroic code, to live gloriously and die gloriously were not the antonyms they may seem to us to be. You lived hoping/planning/resolving that when death came, it would be a glorious death; you accepted death (over say ignobly running away) if it could be glorious.
The Iliad quote starting "Let me not die ingloriously and without a struggle.." is literally a quote about Hector wanting to kill Achilles in battle is it not?
The whole point of Beowulf is about battling a dragon.
Popul Vuh is more religious, for sure, and it's the one bit of the song that sounds less violent too, so it's for sure a break of theme.
Ramayana is religious too, but why would they pick, of all quotes from it, "Here let us all for death prepare or on the last great journey fare". That's clearly a heading to a final battle line.
It's called live gloriously because it's about the battle that you hopefully don't die in. The tone and lyrics are 75% about glory through battle.
I don't think the lines have to mean the exact same things they meant in the original context. The idea of doing something of worth before you die, living gloriously, is widely applicable. The sources are about battle because a good amount of famous texts are, but they are used here to communicate the idea of creating a legacy in general, which is relevant to Ages and every victory path in Civ VII.
Not bad at all. I just have a question to any of you who can understand the texts quoted on this. Do the languages sound anything like they should? because Greek, well they managed to kill it again. Greek text written in Latin characters and attempted to be read as if it is English. Having said that, in this case where a choir is involved it certainly would have been quite an achievement to pull it off. I just hope they get it right when we get a Greek leader(i do not think that is too much to ask). Please Firaxis if you love your craft find a linguist to help the actor speak his lines properly, my ears are still bleeding from Pericles, Gorgo and Alexander. This is not a language lost in time, we know how it sounds and how it is pronounced.
They even leave a word out of the Iliad quote: alla.
I've been thinking a lot about that. After humming the tune as I fell asleep last night, I got myself convinced that it had the musical time-values of dactylic hexameter (with spondees in the second and fourth feet): long short short | long long | long short short | long long | long short short | long long. (but the multiple longs as sustained notes), So I went back to look and listen. I don't think it does. Furthermore, you're right. The song doesn't remotely do justice to Homer's own "music." The words are just syllables for singers to voice. Now, that's common in Western music: the text of the Mass or the Magnificat, essentially reduced to just hey-nonny-nonny nonsense syllables.
For all that, I think it's cool that Tin/Firaxis used Civ-resonant quotes as the source for their nonsense syllables.
As for this song, I did get goosebumps at the beginning. Might be because of the anticipation. Better than Baba? Not likely.
And yes I realize nostalgia is one reason we rate it highly. It helps that Civ 4 was such a good game, we associate that greatness with the theme song.
And yes I realize nostalgia is one reason we rate it highly. It helps that Civ 4 was such a good game, we associate that greatness with the theme song.
I dare say it is not just nostalgia. Baba Yetu won a Grammy. It must be one of the most performed video game compositions, and is popular with choirs all over the world who haven’t necessarily even played Civilization.
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I kid, of course.
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