The Patreaus report

[Merkinball]

Those 100 or so laws passed by proconsular Dictator Bremer, which sold the country out to US corporations. Banks, essential state owned industries and so on, were all sold off to big US business. The orders forbid Iraqis from receiving preference in the reconstruction while allowed foreign corporations -- Halliburton and Bechtel, for example -- to buy up Iraqi businesses, do all of the work and send all of their money back to the States. They cannot be required to hire Iraqis or to reinvest their money in the Iraqi economy. They can take out their investments at any time and in any amount. Basically, its pillage. - Princeps

This is such a joke. Who's worse Princeps? Saddam, or Bremer? Which of those laws are still in place? Which were necessary in Iraq's infancy? I'm real glad you're with the times. We do whatever we can to farm out employment to locals in whatever capacity we can. This goes for Iraq, Afghanistan, and the Horn of Africa. What you say really makes no sense. Bechtel and Halliburton get contracts, but then don't hire out labor or buy resources locally? What about military civilian aid projects? The majority of civilian affairs projects that have taken place in Iraq have been contracted out through local labor and local help. It's cheaper, and it's far more productive than doing it all on our own.

If Halliburton is making so much money doing this, then why are the LEAVING numerous area's of operation?

but the fact is that the military wasn't there to provide order, they just stood there and allowed the pillage to go on and cause massive destruction to public and private property. While of course the oil infrastructure and supporting industries were protected. - Princeps

Again, laughable. If we protected the oil infrastructure so well, then why has oil production stagnated at pre-Saddam era levels? Sort of like the electricity (which we turned over to them, but we had to take back over because they didn't have the people to manage the energy grid correctly and grow it.)

I think you need to get yourself an ROE card for Iraq. We're not authorized to use deadly force when there is destruction of private Iraqi property, or even most public Iraqi property. You can't even do anything if a man is raping a 10 year old girl in broad daylight.

I'm sorry, but the things that you complain are constructs of your ilk. Not mine.

Fallujah massacre. The one that was ordered by the highest commands. - princeps

How was this a massacre?

You don't know a damn thing about Fallujah do you. We gave civilians DAYS to get out of Fallujah. We leafletted the city. This was a mil to mil battle in the purest sense.

 

[innonimatu]

Again, laughable. If we protected the oil infrastructure so well, then why has oil production stagnated at pre-Saddam era levels?

Incompetence, on top of greed.

I think you need to get yourself an ROE card for Iraq. We're not authorized to use deadly force when there is destruction of private Iraqi property, or even most public Iraqi property. You can't even do anything if a man is raping a 10 year old girl in broad daylight.

You don't know a damn thing about Fallujah do you. We gave civilians DAYS to get out of Fallujah. We leafletted the city. This was a mil to mil battle in the purest sense.

Oh, my, I do home you didn't destroy any private iraqi property in the course of the Fallujah "battle"...

 

[Merkinball]

Incompetence, on top of greed. - Inno

Whaaaa? How's greed factor in there?

Oh, my, I do home you didn't destroy any private iraqi property in the course of the Fallujah "battle"... - inno

The only time you can destroy private property is when there is a direct threat coming from it. If someone shoots at you, you have the right to return fire, but if the person does not represent a threat to your life, or the safety of coalition personel, you can't do anything.

Private property got rocked in Fallujah because of the who remained there were unequivocally enemy combatants, shooting at coalition forces.

 

[FriendlyFire]

I think you need to get yourself an ROE card for Iraq. We're not authorized to use deadly force when there is destruction of private Iraqi property, or even most public Iraqi property. You can't even do anything if a man is raping a 10 year old girl in broad daylight.

I'm sorry, but the things that you complain are constructs of your ilk. Not mine.

Let me explain most of the "numbered" US uformations had very tight ROEs and were run very tighly. In falluja 2 US sniper "prior" to hostilities were only allowed to kill armed combatants. The Poles though could target anyone with a mobile phone in there hands (insurgent spotters)

However. most CA, CPA and Guard units were less well run. The most damming being convys which would run a daily gauntlet of ambushes. Truckers would shoot very freely Numbered divisions would complain that these Guards would simply shoot and drive and they would find body peices all over the place. Wrecked cars, blood everywhere they had a poor reputation.

The CPA also literally went to war with SF and eventually the rest of the armed services. SF wanted to go in take out a sniper by capturing him instead they went in evacuated the entire building and blew the entire place up.
Bremer wasnt know as a "Piece of S_____" for nothing you know.

This whole situation arrived because of the way Bremer worked starting with de-bathacation. which was done exactly the opposite way as it was done in germany. One SF whos life has been saved found out that the Iraqi whom saved him. No longer wanted anything to do with the US after this went down. Gen Garner was mad, Amritage was frecking out big time, Gen Kellogs wanted bremer replaced and went over hes head to Abizade to do so.

first class "soap opera"

 

[FriendlyFire]

The only time you can destroy private property is when there is a direct threat coming from it. If someone shoots at you, you have the right to return fire, but if the person does not represent a threat to your life, or the safety of coalition personel, you can't do anything.

Private property got rocked in Fallujah because of the who remained there were unequivocally enemy combatants, shooting at coalition forces.

Also rest assure that (Mad Dog) Mattis hand was forced when going into Fallujah. Those contractors were lured into an ambush and for poltical reasons the Marines were ordered in. Mattis was pissed at the decision he had already employed the classic counterinsurgency techniquies and was certain he would have gotten the insurrgents.

Worse was the poltical dicision to halt Mattis was batsh_t (He command platoon had 75% casualties) He had them pinned down and was blockaded in low on amo they could not have lasted. Other commanders were incensed that the pulled back with getting an agreement on disarming the enemy. You can thank Bremer and Rumsfield for that.

you probably know Mattis in person so you know what hes like when hes mad.
(I like how he calls Gen Petraeus "Dave".) <---

 

[Merkinball]

you probably know Mattis in person so you know what hes like when hes mad. - FriendlyFire

Mattis was pretty heated about Haditha when he addressed all Marines in DJ. I had the pleasure of translating for General Mattis and Sargeant Major Kent during their visit. Mattis is absolutely motivating. His perception of warfare, his knowledge, his tactics, they're superfelous. I reckon if he had that fourth star, that he'd probably be in Patraeus' position right now.

Mattis is probably the most well spoken General I've ever heard speak or gotten to know, although General Pace is right up there too.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Mattis was pretty heated about Haditha when he addressed all Marines in DJ. I had the pleasure of translating for General Mattis and Sargeant Major Kent during their visit. Mattis is absolutely motivating. His perception of warfare, his knowledge, his tactics, they're superfelous. I reckon if he had that fourth star, that he'd probably be in Patraeus' position right now.

Mattis is probably the most well spoken General I've ever heard speak or gotten to know, although General Pace is right up there too.

Yeah Mattis and Petraeus would have made a very fine team.
Mattis though I hope is going to become the next marine commandant. Firstly was hes record in Iraq with falluja battle makes him rather contiversial while petraeus dose not.

Secondly was he very frank manner of speaking. Hes most famous for hes "Be polite, be professional be prepared with a plan to kill everyone" he was also very blunt when meeting with Iraqi leaders, "Iam begging you with tears in my eyes dont F___ with me I will kill you all". very to the point and likeable but petraeus definitly has more poltical speaking skills over Mattis. Given he also was very blunt with the media and this may hurt hes promotion chances

Both very intelligent and capable generals. I certainly do hope Mattis gets the tap for Marine commandant despite hes shortcommings.