This game is incomprehensible

[Shirina]

Dear forum members:

Quite honestly, after attempting this game several times, I find it near impossible to play and have no idea how you folks can stand it for more than half an hour without wanting to toss the CD into the trash. I'm not a stranger to the Civ franchise, but I can never play a game beyond the second difficulty level without the AI going bonkers.

The first game I played was on the Warlord setting (3rd from the bottom).

I built about 6 cities and ended up -1 income per turn and all my units went on strike. At that point, the game was over. As far as I could tell, there is absolutely no way to play once this happens.

Existing workers were disbanded at a rate of 3-4 per turn. New workers built were instantly disbanded on the following turn, making it impossible to claim money-generating resources or to build cottages. I wasn't advanced enough to build wealth. I did not have the option to change the tax rate. I did not have access to the merchant special citizen. I couldn't sell off city improvements nor could I get rid of existing cities. What's worse, the game disbands units as if somehow their "maintenance" is putting me in the hole, but after clicking 'end turn' about 50 times and having every unit disbanded, I was still at -1 and the game became unplayable. This happened so early that I had absolutely no options to generate revenue.

The second game I played was even more pathetic.

I had 4 cities on the map and was in the very early stages with only warriors and archers available to me. Out of nowhere, the AI began to throw wave after wave after infinite wave of barbarians at me.

Inside of 5 turns, 3 of my cities were captured. Even winning a battle didn't matter since my units had no time to heal before the next attack came... and there was always another attack right after that. On and on it went. My capital, my last city, was cranking out a warrior or archer every turn while the barbarians pillaged every resource until I was left with one city and blank tiles. I tried waging a counter attack and managed to take back one of my cities ... but of course there were 10+ barbarians heading towards it, so there was no way to defend it. I lost it again the very next turn.

Dozens and dozens of attacks came at my capital, whiddling me down one unit at a time. With my resources destroyed, now I was producing a unit only once every 5 turns. I eventually just quit because my territory, what was left of it, was swarming with barbarian axemen, warriors, and archers with an infinite stream of them coming every turn.

What gives with this nonsense? How can anyone deal with an AI on a rather easy setting that does nothing but zerg your cities turn after turn after turn, giving the player no chance to develop a civilization or to build up defenses. It's obvious that the AI was just spawning them and would've continued to spawn them ad infinitum ad nauseum until my last unit was destroyed and my capital taken. I really don't see a strategy that can defeat an enemy with infinite numbers that don't have to travel ... I'd bet a year's pay that the AI was simply spawning them just outside the fog of war and moving them into my territory.

And if that wasn't bad enough, Egypt decided to declare war for no apparent reason, as if somehow Egypt had allied itself with the barbarians.

This kind of silly AI behavior is the epitome of bad programming, IMO and it just serves to make the game a nice paper weight collecting dust in my closet. I've read people's strategies and tips, but they're all irrelevant since I can't get past the first 10 tech advances before I'm hit with 30 or 40 barbarian units from all directions. How does one even defend against that? How can one build anything or claim resources if there's a barbarian unit in every other square? It's not like I can just build infinite warriors and archers and scour the world killing every barbarian, nor can I place military units on every square in my territory to prevent pillaging and the horrible, un-winnable war of attrition the AI wages. I remember Alpha Centauri was like this too, with those spore creatures attacking me with so many units that I litterally would go into the kitchen and make dinner only to come back and see that the AI was still hitting me with them, all in the same stack. After that experience, I've always been very careful to keep barbarians on a minimum setting since any higher than that and the AI feels at liberty to cheat up a storm with infinite spawns. Therefore I made sure that I didn't have 'raging barbarians' checked, but if this wasn't 'raging barbarians' then I'd imagine even a supercomputer would bog down with the numbers of them on the screen at once if that option were ever engaged.

So how do you get past that? Is it even possible?

 

[Defiant47]

Dear forum members:

Quite honestly, after attempting this game several times, I find it near impossible to play and have no idea how you folks can stand it for more than half an hour without wanting to toss the CD into the trash. I'm not a stranger to the Civ franchise, but I can never play a game beyond the second difficulty level without the AI going bonkers.

The first game I played was on the Warlord setting (3rd from the bottom).

I built about 6 cities and ended up -1 income per turn and all my units went on strike. At that point, the game was over. As far as I could tell, there is absolutely no way to play once this happens.

Existing workers were disbanded at a rate of 3-4 per turn. New workers built were instantly disbanded on the following turn, making it impossible to claim money-generating resources or to build cottages. I wasn't advanced enough to build wealth. I did not have the option to change the tax rate. I did not have access to the merchant special citizen. I couldn't sell off city improvements nor could I get rid of existing cities. What's worse, the game disbands units as if somehow their "maintenance" is putting me in the hole, but after clicking 'end turn' about 50 times and having every unit disbanded, I was still at -1 and the game became unplayable. This happened so early that I had absolutely no options to generate revenue.

This is perhaps what I consider the one thing to make Civ4 stand above all others: expansion isn't mindless. Earlier this week, I pulled out Alpha Centauri from the shelf again and started playing a bit. I noticed that I could just spam cities anywhere and everywhere I wanted to, with no side effects, given that I could defend myself.

In Civ4, if you expand too much, you can stifle your economy (as it says in one of the tips). This has revolutionized empire-building strategy games. Of course, someone else may have done it, and I had no idea. Now you can't just throw cities everywhere, because they will cost you money, specifically money per turn. You have to take things slow and make sure your economy is ready to expand.

My tip for you is to expand slower next time. As an arbitrary point (people have differing opinions on this), try to play a game where you don't build another city if your research level is 50% or below. Wait until you can afford to have it up higher, and only then proceed to expand by settling a new city. (once again, I stress that it's a totally arbitrary point... people have differing opinions, but it's usually 50, 60, or 70)

The second game I played was even more pathetic.

I had 4 cities on the map and was in the very early stages with only warriors and archers available to me. Out of nowhere, the AI began to throw wave after wave after infinite wave of barbarians at me.

Inside of 5 turns, 3 of my cities were captured. Even winning a battle didn't matter since my units had no time to heal before the next attack came... and there was always another attack right after that. On and on it went. My capital, my last city, was cranking out a warrior or archer every turn while the barbarians pillaged every resource until I was left with one city and blank tiles. I tried waging a counter attack and managed to take back one of my cities ... but of course there were 10+ barbarians heading towards it, so there was no way to defend it. I lost it again the very next turn.

Dozens and dozens of attacks came at my capital, whiddling me down one unit at a time. With my resources destroyed, now I was producing a unit only once every 5 turns. I eventually just quit because my territory, what was left of it, was swarming with barbarian axemen, warriors, and archers with an infinite stream of them coming every turn.

What gives with this nonsense? How can anyone deal with an AI on a rather easy setting that does nothing but zerg your cities turn after turn after turn, giving the player no chance to develop a civilization or to build up defenses. It's obvious that the AI was just spawning them and would've continued to spawn them ad infinitum ad nauseum until my last unit was destroyed and my capital taken. I really don't see a strategy that can defeat an enemy with infinite numbers that don't have to travel ... I'd bet a year's pay that the AI was simply spawning them just outside the fog of war and moving them into my territory.

These are "barbarians". They aren't controlled by any AI civilization. They attack any and every civilization. Barbarians can spawn in any area of the map that you (or another civilization) can't see. Until 2000BC Normal game speed, you will only encounter animals as barbarians, which cannot enter your (or other civs') cultural borders. However, after that come barbarian warriors, which can and will enter your cultural borders to attack you. As more time passes, more advanced barbarians start coming, until all of the civilizations have pretty much occupied enough territory so that barbarians can't spawn anymore.

By your problems, it seems that you had the option "Raging Barbarians" on. This makes the barbarians just swarm all your cities, and it's quite a challenge to survive. For a beginning player like you, I would advise to check the option "No Barbarians" so you don't have to worry about this.

As for dealing with barbarians (non-raging), try to build enough units so that you can effectively defend your cities. Keep in mind that they will advance, so look to find copper and/or iron relatively soon so that you don't get a swordsman coming to your archer-defended cities. It's also a matter of luck; sometimes you'll encounter a lot of barbarians, sometimes barely any will attack you. As for raging barbarians, plenty of people have developed strategies for dealing with this situation, like stationing four units in the four corners of your city, but you can look it up yourself, or try devising your own strategies.

And if that wasn't bad enough, Egypt decided to declare war for no apparent reason, as if somehow Egypt had allied itself with the barbarians.

AI civilizations cannot ally themselves with barbarians. Barbarians seek to destroy all civilization, whether it's yours or someone else's (sometimes you can get really lucky and have barbarians just walk around your borders to attack your neighbors).

The AI will declare war on you if you are weak in military power (like you were in this case), among other motives and incentives. Wouldn't you take such an opportunity?

This kind of silly AI behavior is the epitome of bad programming, IMO and it just serves to make the game a nice paper weight collecting dust in my closet. I've read people's strategies and tips, but they're all irrelevant since I can't get past the first 10 tech advances before I'm hit with 30 or 40 barbarian units from all directions. How does one even defend against that? How can one build anything or claim resources if there's a barbarian unit in every other square? It's not like I can just build infinite warriors and archers and scour the world killing every barbarian, nor can I place military units on every square in my territory to prevent pillaging and the horrible, un-winnable war of attrition the AI wages.

I suggest that you turn off barbarians for a while, and then when you do want to try playing with them again, don't have them as raging. I myself never play with raging barbarians, because it's just too much (though it isn't impossible). As for defending against enemies (such as barbarians) pulling a war of attrition on you, the best defense is a good offense. Have one or two units in your city for defense, but have two or three offensive units extra so that if an enemy comes near your lands to start pillaging, you can just attack them and get rid of them.

I remember Alpha Centauri was like this too, with those spore creatures attacking me with so many units that I litterally would go into the kitchen and make dinner only to come back and see that the AI was still hitting me with them, all in the same stack.

Although you can't disable them in Alpha Centauri, you can tone them down significantly. You can have Rare, Medium, and Abundant Native Life, with Abundant being plenty of mind worms, and rare being not so many. If you really hate them, you could go with Rare, but you would get a -25% to your score (naturally), whereas if you went with abundant, you would get a +25% to your score.

One thing to note, though, is that if you cause a lot of eco-damage, then native life can get pretty hectic. Especially late-game if you're causing a lot of eco-damage, not only will your improvements be destroyed and replaced by fungus, tons of mind worms (and later on locusts) will spawn in that fungus and attack your city.

Additionally, keep track of random events. There is a random event where Hercules B reaches perihelion, which increases native life dramatically.

To help fight mind worms, you can give your units trance special ability, which gives you +50% defense against mind worms (and also empath song for +50% offense against mind worms) and other native life.

After that experience, I've always been very careful to keep barbarians on a minimum setting since any higher than that and the AI feels at liberty to cheat up a storm with infinite spawns. Therefore I made sure that I didn't have 'raging barbarians' checked, but if this wasn't 'raging barbarians' then I'd imagine even a supercomputer would bog down with the numbers of them on the screen at once if that option were ever engaged.

What you described is either raging barbarians, or really unlucky. Try playing again, making sure raging barbarians is off, or better yet, just turn off all barbarians.

 

[Shirina]

Defiant:

Thanks for all the advice, I appreciate the well thought out reponse.

I can only guess that I was massively unlucky with the barbarians because I always make sure raging barbarians is turned off. I've always disliked games with continuous zergs (I avoided multi-player games because of this) since I'm a very methodical player. I enjoy building and researching at least as much as I enjoy the warfare aspect, but zergs usually mean quick, fast-paced arcade-style experiences, which I'd hope Civ IV wasn't meant to be.

As for the economic perils I encountered, I realized that I had expanded just one city too many (I was at -1 income and ran out of money). My major gripe was that there was no way to counteract this early in the game. It seemed like you're pretty much done. I remember one of the earlier Civ games had an 'abandon city' option that simply turned your city into a settler, but they removed that apparently. Now if you build one too many, you're stuck.

One thing that concerns me about slow expansion is the AI. In most empire building games I've played in the past, the AI expands indiscriminately like a virus. If you don't plop cities down (or colonize planets, or whatever genre it is) willy-nilly, you'll very quickly find yourself with no land to claim as the AI will have it all. You'll be left with 3 or 4 cities while the AI will have 30 or more, making warfare extremely difficult. I'm not sure if Civ IV does this, but I've heard a few people talk about how the AI delibertely settles toward you and hems you in ... so there could be mile after endless mile of unsettled land, but you're blocked by a handful of AI cities. I've always tried to expand as rapidly as possible to avoid this problem, especially in Civ 3 when strategic resources were introduced. There's nothing worse than having a tiny empire with no resources because you didn't expand enough early on.

 

[Defiant47]

Defiant:

Thanks for all the advice, I appreciate the well thought out reponse.

Glad to help!

As for the economic perils I encountered, I realized that I had expanded just one city too many (I was at -1 income and ran out of money).

No... from the sounds of it, you expanded many cities too many, and too early! You can be at a negative income with no money, it's just that your research rate will drop. If you managed to drop your research rate so much that you were at 0% with a negative income, you need to slow down...

My major gripe was that there was no way to counteract this early in the game. It seemed like you're pretty much done. I remember one of the earlier Civ games had an 'abandon city' option that simply turned your city into a settler, but they removed that apparently. Now if you build one too many, you're stuck.

Yeah, you can no longer abandon your city back into a settler. But think about it, it would be horribly unbalanced: instant jungle-chop and road-build in one turn. However, I still think you should have the option to raze your own city, with no benefits. Right now the only way to destroy a city is for another civilization (or barbarians) to capture it and decide to raze it.

One thing that concerns me about slow expansion is the AI. In most empire building games I've played in the past, the AI expands indiscriminately like a virus. If you don't plop cities down (or colonize planets, or whatever genre it is) willy-nilly, you'll very quickly find yourself with no land to claim as the AI will have it all. You'll be left with 3 or 4 cities while the AI will have 30 or more, making warfare extremely difficult.

I hear you. It's usually wise to expand as fast as possible... to the extreme, in various other games. For example, I said earlier that I recently played a little Alpha Centauri. When I realized that you don't get any maintenance or side-effects from building a city (other than losing one population for the colony pod), I just loaded up four pods in a isle-of-the-deep I captured, and colonized an entire island. In Civ4, that would be suicide! The only maintenance costs in Alpha Centauri is from buildings, and the buildings usually pay for themselves the instant they're brought in (or you can make sure to only build them when they do). For example, energy bank has maintenance of 1, but with economy of 2 it's already been paid for.

I'm not sure if Civ IV does this, but I've heard a few people talk about how the AI delibertely settles toward you and hems you in ... so there could be mile after endless mile of unsettled land, but you're blocked by a handful of AI cities.

Haven't had this happen to me too often, because usually I'm the one doing the hemming in. But it would probably be a wise move on the AI's part.

However, to avoid the problems of this (although it will impede you significantly), you can sign an open borders agreement with the civilization, or use galleys to transport your troops around their cities.

I've always tried to expand as rapidly as possible to avoid this problem, especially in Civ 3 when strategic resources were introduced. There's nothing worse than having a tiny empire with no resources because you didn't expand enough early on.

I know. The annoying thing about playing at higher levels is that the AI gets bonuses such that it can just settle around everywhere much faster than you can.

 

[danieldaniel]

Hi all,

I have experienced this "barbarian wave" issue too many times myself. Barbarians are especially strong when you play in certain maps, where the civs are very spaced out, leaving a lot of room for the barbs to spawn.

I almost always play Large Pangea/Marathon/emperor with the standard number of opponents. This map has the adventage of letting me expand to 5-6 cities before the AIs surround me, but the counterpart of this is that I will have to deal with hundreds of barbarians.

Around 2300 the first warrior/archer waves enter my territory, later come the axemen. You can not stop this with just warriors, even with archers would be difficult, you really need to get chariots or axes before this starts.

That's why I always research (mining) >> Bronze Working >> The wheel, no matter the leader i'm playing, and then i send my first chopped settler to nearest copper mine, hook it ASAP, and chop/whip a few axemen, then I know I am safe. The good thing about so many barbs is all the experiece your units get.

If I can not find copper I'm in trouble. In that case I'll go for animal husbandry, but probably won't hook the horses soon enough.

I hope this helps.

 

[KMadCandy]

I had 4 cities on the map and was in the very early stages with only warriors and archers available to me. Out of nowhere, the AI began to throw wave after wave after infinite wave of barbarians at me.
...
I'd bet a year's pay that the AI was simply spawning them just outside the fog of war and moving them into my territory.

yup. they literally come "out of nowhere". if you're not real close to other civs, you'll get more barbs too, since they can only spawn in places that are out of everybody's fog of war. sometimes neighbors to see tiles that you can't is helpful ... until they get all mean and stuff.

fogbusting is a technique you have to develop, placing troops in strategic locations to give early warning when barbs are coming, and to prevent them from being able to spawn too close to your territory. it's actually fun to fogbust, can get up to 10 exp on your units. they're capped at 10, so after that rotate them out for new recruits, take the 10'rs back home.

barb cities can pop up too after a certain point. it's random. they tend to build troops, although twice in my games nobody bothered to build stonehenge, so the barbarians did!

balancing expansion so that you don't go broke, but don't lose the chance to grab land before the AI gets it, is something you learn by doing. i can't give specific advice there except forget what you know from previous civ games and smac as far as that goes.

one totally random note: at first i missed the unit workshop from smac and wanted it in civ4. but now that i've learned to mix and match different promotions i'm happy as is.

 

[Rycheman]

I find Barbs a real pain too.What i tend to do now is turn them off in my games and pick an extra civ to replace them.That way you can just concentrate on all the other civs without the continual waves of barbs coming at you from every angle.If you do play with barbs on then you must fogburst early.

If you're having trouble with you're economy/expansion early on then don't build too many cities too early.Also try picking a leader with the financial trait as this should help you,but get those cottages up early.

 

[Jimdigriz]

Sharina, Ive encountered this barb wave as well - you get used to it after a few games but it is annoying (particularly as the other reply said...on large continental maps with not too many AI players).

Well placed archer units (with a couple of axeman/chariots on roads ready to respond) can help with the initial assault...then set up a rough 'perimeter' around your cities so that you can 'see' them coming or maybe stop them spawning at all.

The barb cities that will form are great fun to take out later...and all this of course means you will have lots of experienced units which will be great for taking on the nearest AI players! Dont forget the Great Wall either which stops the problem completely (havent had to use Great Wall myself yet though)

 

[Neoclast]

for dealing with Barbs I will usually use a few units to keep areas of the map exposed around my borders so that they have to spawn further away from my land and I can see them marching in ahead of time. Also, I always look for horses before copper since the chariots will mow down the axemen (make sure you attack with chariots as they do not get the bonus vs axemen on the def). Then I hook up copper so that I have axemen before the barbarian swordsmen come to play. As mentioned earlier the best way to deal with barbarians is to hit them before they get inside your borders or to have troops set up to hit them the moment they step onto your land.

On another note this game can be a lot more frustrating then others. However, in the long run you learn how to deal with these various issues and the game becomes great.

 

[wolfigor]

One thing that concerns me about slow expansion is the AI. [...] how the AI delibertely settles toward you and hems you in

In CIV-IV the AI settle down at slow pace compared with Alpha Centaury and all the older CIV versions.
Clearly, having slower expansion, it's nececessary for both AI and human player alike to settle in the smartest way possible.

Many players, given the right map, will settle in direction of an AI to pick the best land before the opponent does it.
The "gaps" will be filled later when the economy will be strong enough to support more expansion.

In other cases I was able to prevent the AI to settle in a large portion of the continent (and block it in a small/poor area) just with the oculate placing of two towns and no open border... just a small example of how to use the slow pace of expansion in your favour.

in CIV-IV placing town is more a matter of quality than quantity.
In the beginning, I admit, I was frustrated pretty much like you.
Maybe I am getting old but with time I started to appreciate the slower pace of expansion.
In previous CIV titles it was a kind of mad rush to settle, now you have to concentrate on building a solid state before thinking to expand.

 

[wolfigor]

On another note this game can be a lot more frustrating then others. However, in the long run you learn how to deal with these various issues and the game becomes great.

Holy words!

I also would like to remind you the possibility to build the Great Wall:
in CIV-IV warlord it keeps barbarian out of your cultural borders... increasing the pressure against your opponents.
Actually it's pretty nice to have your attack troops safe inside your cultural borders and attacking roaming barbarians to gain xp in full safety: see barbarian - attack - win - go back in the same zone to cure the wounds.

For barbarians is also useful to remember that they do not attack from the sea: one side less to worry for barbarians attacks.

 

[LucyDuke]

barb cities can pop up too after a certain point. it's random. they tend to build troops, although twice in my games nobody bothered to build stonehenge, so the barbarians did!

Oh, my! The barbs built Stonehenge? Twice! That's amazing. How great it must be to take a barb city and get Stonehenge in the deal! I didn't know they could build wonders, I imagine the balance works out when the culture goes away from the capture. Still, capturing Stonehenge without pissing off any AI civs... that's so awesome.

 

[Willem]

Defiant:
I can only guess that I was massively unlucky with the barbarians because I always make sure raging barbarians is turned off. I've always disliked games with continuous zergs (I avoided multi-player games because of this) since I'm a very methodical player. I enjoy building and researching at least as much as I enjoy the warfare aspect, but zergs usually mean quick, fast-paced arcade-style experiences, which I'd hope Civ IV wasn't meant to be.

It is possible to set up a custom game where the Barbs are turned off completely if it really bothers you that much. However, they can be controlled very easily if you go about it the right way. Just send some Archers out to the Hills around your empire. Not only does this break up the fog of war that creates Barbs in the first place, but any Barbs that do come around will usually attack the unit on sight before it reaches your border. And an Archer on a Hill, especially if it's also forested, is a formidable defender. It's very unlikely the Barb would survive the encounter.

My major gripe was that there was no way to counteract this early in the game.

You still have the option of disbanding your military.

One thing that concerns me about slow expansion is the AI. In most empire building games I've played in the past, the AI expands indiscriminately like a virus. If you don't plop cities down (or colonize planets, or whatever genre it is) willy-nilly, you'll very quickly find yourself with no land to claim as the AI will have it all. You'll be left with 3 or 4 cities while the AI will have 30 or more, making warfare extremely difficult. I'm not sure if Civ IV does this, but I've heard a few people talk about how the AI delibertely settles toward you and hems you in ... so there could be mile after endless mile of unsettled land, but you're blocked by a handful of AI cities. I've always tried to expand as rapidly as possible to avoid this problem, especially in Civ 3 when strategic resources were introduced. There's nothing worse than having a tiny empire with no resources because you didn't expand enough early on.

The AI has the same limitations as you do when it comes to builing it's empire, so it's not going to be in a position to spam cities either. As for hemming you in, yes it will try that sometimes. That's why you have to try to beat it to the punch, it's just good strategy. Do some exploring right away and find out who your closest neighbour is and don't let him get the upper hand right off the bat. But also don't get carried away either, remember that distance from your capital is a factor in your maintenance costs.

But most important of all, forget about your style of play in Civ 3, it won't work any more. Treat this as the brand new game that it is, and learn some new strategies. Everyone who jumped over from Civ 3 has had to go through the same early frustrations that you're experiencing, but once you get through them, you'll discover that Civ 4 is light years ahead of what you're used to.

 

[vra379971]

It also sounds like you did not build any cottages, which add more money the longer they are worked.

 

[KMadCandy]

Oh, my! The barbs built Stonehenge? Twice! That's amazing. How great it must be to take a barb city and get Stonehenge in the deal! I didn't know they could build wonders, I imagine the balance works out when the culture goes away from the capture. Still, capturing Stonehenge without pissing off any AI civs... that's so awesome.

there's a list in .xml under civilizations about what buildings/units/wonders they can and can't build. stonehenge isn't on that list. i was so surprised that i went to the .xml to check the city name to be sure it wasn't a city they'd conquered. a recent thread prompted me to check ... they apparently are also allowed to build the internet *giggle*.

shirina i hope you're having more fun now! how are your later attempts going?

 

[Stolen Rutters]

Welcome to the forum.

If you are expanding too fast, you can actually build research (once you get alphabet) and shoot for currency. With six cities it shouldn't take too long to get there. Currency will let you build money.

You only need one or two workers per city since you only have to have tiles improved that you are using... (pop 4 works up to 4 tiles, pop six only works up to six tiles, etc.). One worker per city can usually keep up with tile improvements as your population grows but sometimes two is needed.

Building units and wonders is good but certain technologies are required to support larger empires. Rapid expansion is seriously expensive in this game.

FAQs abound and the War Academy on the main page of civfanatics has good tips too.

 

[Sofista]

there's a list in .xml under civilizations about what buildings/units/wonders they can and can't build. stonehenge isn't on that list. i was so surprised that i went to the .xml to check the city name to be sure it wasn't a city they'd conquered. a recent thread prompted me to check ... they apparently are also allowed to build the internet *giggle*.

As of Warlord 2.08, "Barbarians can no longer build any of the Wonders".

Someone had to do something to prevent them from being first to the Great Wall!

 

[KMadCandy]

As of Warlord 2.08, "Barbarians can no longer build any of the Wonders".

Someone had to do something to prevent them from being first to the Great Wall!

i think there must be a bug in that. i never got warlords til after 2.08 and patched it the day i installed it, and the .xml files don't forbid all wonders, they just list some/most. but yeah i'd probably laugh too hard to keep playing if they built the great wall! barb GGs at double speed OMG!

actually i do play vanilla still sometimes, those games were probably vanilla and therefore didn't have the 2.08 patch. doh!

 

[Neoclast]

If the barbarians built the great wall they wouldn't be able to be inside their own borders!! lol

 

[omega9500]

Read the book and play the tutorial geez, and if that dosn't work try hitting yourself in the head. Anything before Noble is not hard, anyone can do it. you sure as hell do not get as overwhelmed like you describe.