This One Weird Trick Triggers Debates on What Makes a Good Neighborhood

[Birdjaguar]

Most Subways are locally owned franchises so they support folks from the area. They are also an inexpensive franchise within reach of people who can afford the build out.

Restaurants are a very competitive businesses. May the ones with the best food, best service, and best value win! The protester is being a jerk.

 

[Truthy]

I too am disappointed at the OP's lie.

I think BvBPL is having a good time making threads with BuzzFeed-sounding clickbait titles.

 

[CavLancer]

It's also CHEAP food, in an exceptionally expensive city. Is it awesome? No, of course it isn't, but it would also be one one of the very few places in all of Mt.Pleasant where you can get a lunch of under seven bucks. Throwing a temper tantrum to keep it out hurts hourly workers who have to work in the neighborhood and just want an affordable lunch.

Subway isn't going to drive any bodegas in the area out of business. It's not going to ruin the property value on your overpriced condo. He's just being a vindictive, selfish, jerk.

Well said.

 

[Hygro]

There's a McDonalds in Berkeley where many homeless folks congregate because it's one of the few places in their price range. That said, the Subway next to campus isn't really any cheaper than one of the numerous quick-food one-off establishments. Many of the expensive spots have portions so big they aren't actually expensive compared to chains.

I bring up the McDonalds because a lot of students around here don't like its presence but haven't considered the cost to human welfare if it were removed.

 

[civvver]

It's not good food, it's safe food people want. Emotionally safe food. People are afraid to try new things.

I don't know a single large food chain I like. Many are tolerable. I don't want them in my neighborhoods, unless there are no other low cost options available (no one should be priced out of food in an area).

I disagree entirely and that's the issue, all these people bash chains, but they're constantly busy. Why would they be if the food sucked? I'll bet you could do a taste testing and many of them would win out.

Examples of stuff from chains I like: Panera broccoli cheese soup is awesome. Their bread is awesome.

I had lunch at applebee's the other day and got this new grilled chicken wrap that had bacon and a maple mustard sauce in it and the outer wrap was grilled too. It was awesome and it was under $10 with fry refills (not that I needed any refills cus it was a lot of food just sayin'). The equivalent sandwich plus fries at my local non chain deli would be like $15 and wouldn't have beat it, it was that good.

Or have you ever been to carabba's and gotten their chicken parm or marsala or alfredo? It's like 10x better than the non chain italian places around here. Is it going to beat some mom and pop shop like in littler italy nyc? Probably not, but most people don't have access to that kind of food.

And benihana absolutely crushes all the independent hibachi places I've ever been too, and I've probably tried 4 or 5 independent ones. Benihana food is seasoned better with better sauces and the cooks prepare it more consistently.

It depends on the specific restaurant too. Like the olive garden by my house is awful, but there's one by my in laws that tastes great. I can't really explain why, the one by me the food always tastes like they left it sitting under heat lamps for 30 mins, it never tastes fresh. Other restaurant no issues.

 

[Farm Boy]

It is amazing how outside urban America, franchises have completely outcompeted everything.

Small town America is in the cities.

Legit curious. I'm baffled by how you think this is true. Chains do tend to dominate near the travel corridors harder than anywhere else, where you're right, people do want something safe since they're out of their element. You sure you aren't falling into the trap that, as you have informed me, led me to believe the entirety of SanFran is pretentious beyond belief?

 

[Hygro]

I disagree entirely and that's the issue, all these people bash chains, but they're constantly busy. Why would they be if the food sucked? I'll bet you could do a taste testing and many of them would win out.

Examples of stuff from chains I like: Panera broccoli cheese soup is awesome. Their bread is awesome.

I had lunch at applebee's the other day and got this new grilled chicken wrap that had bacon and a maple mustard sauce in it and the outer wrap was grilled too. It was awesome and it was under $10 with fry refills (not that I needed any refills cus it was a lot of food just sayin'). The equivalent sandwich plus fries at my local non chain deli would be like $15 and wouldn't have beat it, it was that good.

Or have you ever been to carabba's and gotten their chicken parm or marsala or alfredo? It's like 10x better than the non chain italian places around here. Is it going to beat some mom and pop shop like in littler italy nyc? Probably not, but most people don't have access to that kind of food.

And benihana absolutely crushes all the independent hibachi places I've ever been too, and I've probably tried 4 or 5 independent ones. Benihana food is seasoned better with better sauces and the cooks prepare it more consistently.

It depends on the specific restaurant too. Like the olive garden by my house is awful, but there's one by my in laws that tastes great. I can't really explain why, the one by me the food always tastes like they left it sitting under heat lamps for 30 mins, it never tastes fresh. Other restaurant no issues.

There's good chains I won't deny, and you're right that some individual venues do it better than their across-town counterparts.

But I think a big reason chains win is the same as why processed foods win. People love sugar, they love fat, and they care so, so much about texture. Food and music are good analogues and while some of the best music is major label, popular music, and there's loads of terrible terrible underground stuff, most of what makes pop music popular is its ease of consumption. It follows safe, rewarding formulas and is full of ear candy. Fast food is engineered for pleasure. Regular food is not.

Legit curious. I'm baffled by how you think this is true. Chains do tend to dominate near the travel corridors harder than anywhere else, where you're right, people do want something safe since they're out of their element. You sure you aren't falling into the trap that, as you have informed me, led me to believe the entirety of SanFran is pretentious beyond belief?

What's pretentious about observing how expertly designed chains will outcompete in small markets where there simply cannot be many instances of competition, whereas when there's many more competitive actors in an area, the chains will be outcompeted?

 

[Farm Boy]

What's pretentious about observing how expertly designed chains will outcompete in small markets where there simply cannot be many instances of competition, whereas when there's many more competitive actors in an area, the chains will be outcompeted?

Nothing pretentious at all. Perhaps maybe a sampling error. Just like the one I had(about pretention). I ate and dined in the area around Alcatraz and came away with a bad impression. You informed me that was an impression regarding the area around Alcatraz and corrected me that it wasn't accurate when expanded to the rest of SanFran. I'll take your word on it, I have no reason not to.

I agree that major urban areas have good non-chain stuff. They've got a huge market(relatively), often access to at least some significant cross-section of the population with some money(not always), and transportation access. Things in the city, and particularly on the major roads once you leave them, at least as they seem to me, tend to be tolerably routine for tolerable routines. Passing though? You know what you can get at a McDonalds. You know you like the Southwest Salad and the parfait. You know how much they cost, and you know they're unlikely to upset your stomach(getting more important as we dig into the 30s here). They're safe. But once you get off those tracks and into areas where people live, people know, and people can trust even absent the word of mouth the numbers of the city lend themselves to more easily, there are wonderful non-chain establishments all over the place. If I count the 3 closest examples of small town America to me for prepared foods/restaurants:

1) 1 chain/5 non-chain
2) 1 chain/2 non-chain
3) 1 chain/6 non-chain

If you get into the University-town-USA half a county hike away, chains along the major roads, some fast food chains particularly along the areas with chain retail, and tons of local establishments. Surprisingly good Thai(I've been informed, I haven't had a lot to compare it to) for the Midwest. Lots of stuff like that.