To hill or not to hill

[Victoria]

This has vexed me a little at times so interested in other peoples view.
Naturally if it was the only hill around and I could not restart I would probably mine it but that is an exception.

 

[greygamer]

I am fine with moving several turns for a hill.
The AI needs all the early help it can get

 

[Arent11]

Actually, there is another "vexing" question: Intuitively, I would always settle in "open plains" near a river & not in "difficult" terrain like forests or hills. However, since forests, hills etc. only *add* to ressources, this terrain is actually better than open plains! It is really counter-intuitive.

 

[mayhemster]

As long as its a plains hill then yeah The extra production is worth losing a couple of turns over. I also consider settling on luxuries if the tech needed for that is going to cost me a few turns of research on a different path to what I'd like to take.

 

[Victoria]

You get production from the palace so the extra hammer is not worth double, not even 1/3 rd extra prod so its tricky
I like @greygamer logic

 

[trojan13]

For me, it is more about total food plus production output of best 2,3 tiles and bonus tiles in 1st and 2nd ring, not just city on hill or open terrain.

 

[Victoria]

For me, it is more about total food plus production output of best 2,3 tiles and bonus tiles in 1st and 2nd ring, not just city on hill or open terrain.

As the questionnaire says ....if it does not hurt your position.

 

[trojan13]

I understand 'if it does not hurt your position' as fresh water position. For example, there is 5 tile length river, and your initial settler position seems to leave 1 fresh water tile for next city. And there is a hill tile also not covering whole fresh water tile, leaving room for 2nd city.

 

[elitetroops]

I also consider settling on luxuries if the tech needed for that is going to cost me a few turns of research on a different path to what I'd like to take.

Prior to the patch you always got immediate access to the luxury if you settled on top of it, but it seems the fall patch changed this. I have not checked if you do get the luxury you've settled upon when teching the relevant tech. Settling on top of luxuries was very strong pre-patch, since they also come with some special yields and often the tiles aren't that good to work when improved. For example getting +1 faith from Tobacco from turn 1 is really good to get an early pantheon without running God King.

 

[mayhemster]

Prior to the patch you always got immediate access to the luxury if you settled on top of it, but it seems the fall patch changed this. I have not checked if you do get the luxury you've settled upon when teching the relevant tech. Settling on top of luxuries was very strong pre-patch, since they also come with some special yields and often the tiles aren't that good to work when improved. For example getting +1 faith from Tobacco from turn 1 is really good to get an early pantheon without running God King.

I've not actually settled one post-patch but I always give it thought, looks like I've been wasting my time!

 

[Onii-chan]

I don't really like moving away but if there's a hill right next to me and it doesn't seem to be an otherwise worse position (as in still fresh water and more or less similar resource reach) then I'll do it

Don't think I've ever moved to a hill 2 tiles away though (or 2 tiles away ever for that matter)

 

[Victoria]

I don't really like moving away but if there's a hill right next to me .... then I'll do it

I was just wondering if anyone had considered it fully. I mean if you get 4 production is you settle where you are and 5 production on a hill (with better defense) but of course that hill is not going to give you more for mining later. I guess there is no easy answer for that lost turn and those lost 4 production (gained back 4 turns later) and then the consideration of going 2 tiles especially with barbs spawning etc.

 

[greygamer]

I like @greygamer logic

In the same vein currently I have been avoiding upgrading or building higher tech military until the AI has some

 

[Victoria]

You see, now there is a true gamer. Manipulate the situation with your own rules and you have a game on your hands.

 

[elitetroops]

I was just wondering if anyone had considered it fully. I mean if you get 4 production is you settle where you are and 5 production on a hill (with better defense) but of course that hill is not going to give you more for mining later. I guess there is no easy answer for that lost turn and those lost 4 production (gained back 4 turns later) and then the consideration of going 2 tiles especially with barbs spawning etc.

It's not only about production. If you get 4 production from city center+worked tile settling on a non-hill tile, then you would probably be working a 1f3h tile and grow in 15 turns. If you instead move onto the hill and can work a 3f1h tile, you have one less production in the first few turns but grow onto the next tile already in 5 turns. I usually try to make an overall estimation for the first 20 or so turns based on how fast I'll be growing and how much I can produce with growth taken into account.

 

[FurballRocker]

Given the exact same surrounding tiles in both locations, most specifically the initial ring and to a great degree the second ring also i would settle on a hill rather than not but in all the games i have had i have never really had to think about it and tend to place myself in the middle of the most resources next to a river if there is one as they will usually bring a much larger benefit than a single hammer from settling on a hill especially as the AI is a bit lethargic so you don't tend to need to rush to build units to defend yourself or settlers to grab the best spots so quickly as in previous games.

 

[Browd]

Prior to the patch you always got immediate access to the luxury if you settled on top of it, but it seems the fall patch changed this. I have not checked if you do get the luxury you've settled upon when teching the relevant tech. Settling on top of luxuries was very strong pre-patch, since they also come with some special yields and often the tiles aren't that good to work when improved. For example getting +1 faith from Tobacco from turn 1 is really good to get an early pantheon without running God King.

You do not get amenities from, or the ability to trade, luxuries you settle on before researching the required tech, even after researching the required tech. See https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...ble-to-sell-luxury-that-you-settle-on.605549/

 

[DonPato]

You do not get amenities from, or the ability to trade, luxuries you settle on before researching the required tech, even after researching the required tech. See https://forums.civfanatics.com/thre...ble-to-sell-luxury-that-you-settle-on.605549/

Is this thought to be intentional, or a known bug? Do we know? I really miss settling on luxuries such as tea and incense that give yields that I want but wouldn't waste a citizen to work =[

 

[Browd]

It cropped up in the Fall patch, and was not in the patch notes, so probably a bug.

 

[jaegybomb]

Filthyrobot said something about a study done examining ai vs ai games and moving 1 turn statistically helped on average but anything more than that dropped off really quick.