Unique Powers mod in progress...need ideas

[musicfreak]

I'm currently working on a mod that replaces civilization traits with unique powers, much like Rhye's and Fall of Civilization already does. The problem seems to be coming up with ideas... I'm no historian, so I don't really know what powers to give to a lot of civilizations. Here's what I have so far. The ones in italics are already decided, but you can still comment on them if you feel they are imbalanced or ahistorical. Please note that I want to try to keep my ideas original and not steal from RFC wherever possible.


America
All cities +2 happiness
OR
American culture in enemy cities has a much greater effect (in terms of unhappiness and revolt chance)

Arabia
State religion spreads faster

Aztec
Can always hurry production with population
OR
+2 food, production and commerce in every city for every vassal

Babylon
-50% civic upkeep

Byzantium
Some kind of bonus for attacking a city that was once yours
OR
Something to do with culture

Carthage
All military units start with +2 experience
OR
+25% military unit production

Celts
+0.5 happiness for all forests and jungles near a city (maybe +1 production instead?)

China
-25% food required for city growth

Egypt
+50% wonder production

England
+50% naval unit production
OR
Lower maintenance cost for colonial cities
OR
Something else?

Ethiopia
More city defense from culture

France
+25% culture in all cities

Germany
Upgrades cost half price

Greece
+100% Great People birth rate
OR
All cities +2 Great People points

Holy Roman Empire
?

Inca
All units can move through mountains

India
No anarchy in revolutions
OR
+1 happiness for each non-state religion in a city

Japan
Enemy culture spreads more slowly in Japanese territory
OR
Technologies already researched by other civilizations cost less

Khmer
All units start with Woodsman I and Woodsman II

Korea
All units start with City Defense I and City Defense II

Mail
+1 trade route in every city

Maya
?

Mongolia
Lower maintenance cost for military units

Native America
+1 food from plains

Netherlands
+100% trade route yield for coastal cities

Ottomans
-75% vassal maintenance

Persia
No resistance in conquered cities

Portugal
All naval units receive an extra movement point

Rome
+25% building build speed
OR
Workers build improvements 50% faster

Russia
All tiles produce at least 1 food
OR
Double production speed of workers and settlers

Spain
Cities with state religion receive +25% production
OR
All units +50% strength versus obsolete units (unfair?)

Sumeria
Farms produce +1 food

Viking
+100% gold earned from pillaging and city capture

Zulu
Enemy culture does not spread into Zulu cities (unfair?)
OR
Majority of foreign culture removed on city capture


As you can see, this list is nowhere near complete, so any feedback or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

PS: The numbers can be tweaked later, after I have a power for each civilization. For now, I just need to get some ideas rolling.

 

[Firestorm94]

1.)Aztecs need a different power or you have to change their UB, it reduces whip
2.) persia could have no city revolts after conquest
3.) Mongols: Barbarians less likely to attack them?
4.)Greece: universal suffrage civic is open with some classical tech
5.)Rome: Representation is open with some classical tech
6.)Vikings: more pillage, razing, and city capture gold
7.)Inca: mountains are passable and are just like hills. but with 1 more movement cost
8.)Zulu:Jungles can be chopped for production?
9.)Arabia: religion more likely to spread
10.)Mali:+1 trade route sounds good

I might be able to help somehow, I really liked the powers idea in RFC, I only know XML, can't help with other types, but I'd hate to see this project die

 

[musicfreak]

Thanks for the reply. I was about to give up on this.

Most of the changes I'm implementing have to do with the SDK, and they're fairly easy, so I don't really need help with that. I just need help thinking of ideas because, like I said, my history is really rusty. But thanks for the offer.

1) Ah, forgot about that, thanks.
2) That's what I was thinking, but I didn't know how historically accurate that woud be. Done.
3) I like the idea, but that wouldn't have much of an effect on easier difficulty levels. And later in the game it would be completely useless.
4) Okay, I'll think about that.
5) Same.
6) I was thinking just city capture, but that's even better. Done.
7) Ooo, that's a really good idea, thanks!
8) Hmm, sounds good, I'll use that unless I can think of something better.
9) That's what I was thinking, but there are a couple problems. First of all, it would be really easy to abuse that if you have multiple religions in your cities, and second of all, how good would that be? It seems to me like it would be pretty weak, but maybe I'm wrong. Missionaries are pretty cheap, so I'm not sure if it would really give them that much of an advantage. I'll consider it though.
10) Done.

I've also updated a couple other ones, take a look.

Thanks again for the reply! Keep the ideas coming!

 

[Temrek]

Russia - The power of Scorched Earth, enemies take a slight amount of damage each turn while in russian terratory.

 

[EviltheMonkey]

My humble suggestions:

Rome- Power of Military Engineering: all Infantry can build roads and forts

America- Power of Manifest Destiny: all cities start with 1 extra population

Spain- Power of The Inquisition: increased enemy espionage costs

Celts- Power of the Forest: one extra food from and 1 movement cost for all units through forest tiles

Native America- Power of the Plains: one extra food and one extra production from plains tiles

Netherlands- Power of Trade: coastal cities have one extra trade route

Aztecs- Power of Tribute: Vassal states available earlier (code of laws?)

Greece- Power of Hellenic Culture: beakers per culture rate (2 per 10%?)

Mongolia- Power of the Golden Horde: All cavalry start with mobility (+1 movement)

Sumer- Power of Agriculture: Farms spread fresh water from start of game

 

[sepamu92]

I love the idea. The power you have for Zulu doesn't make any sense, though - the Zulus lived nowhere near jungle. I like the power though, and it might make sense for someone else, like Maya.

Other suggestions:

Maya or Khmer - extra food, commerce, and/or hammers from jungle

Arabia - I think Rhye's power is very appropriate; maybe toned down, so state religion spreads to all captured cities

India - definitely something dealing with many religions per city

Mongolia - Bonus to pillaging, or capturing or razing cities. Maybe all mounted units get +X% to city attack? Or free units given when a city it razed?

Turks - Some bonus to vassals: other civs more likely to vassalize?

Portugal - some bonus to exploration

Byzantium - I think a bonus to the state religion, or one to defense would fit. Maybe both?: all cities with state religion get +X% defense.

Sumeria - Wild idea: maybe they start with X random free techs at the start of the game

Zulu - A bonus to units' mobility, like maybe free Guerrilla II or Mobility to all units

 

[musicfreak]

Wow, thanks for the replies guys!

Russia - The power of Scorched Earth, enemies take a slight amount of damage each turn while in russian terratory.

It's a great idea, I agree, but there are two things I don't like about it. First of all, Rhye uses this exact power, and I'm trying to keep the ideas in this mod fresh; and second of all, it would be a lot harder to calculate on a random map. If you use cultural borders as the "territory", then it would be really unbalanced if Russia had a lot of culture and/or land area. What does everyone else think about this?

Rome- Power of Military Engineering: all Infantry can build roads and forts

Wouldn't that be a little cheap? How about "The Power of Infrastructure: Workers build improvements 50% faster"?

America- Power of Manifest Destiny: all cities start with 1 extra population

It's a good idea, but the problem is it only works when you settle a city. After that it's useless. Maybe -25% food needed for population increase?

Spain- Power of The Inquisition: increased enemy espionage costs

Great idea, I added it to the first post.

Celts- Power of the Forest: one extra food from and 1 movement cost for all units through forest tiles

That would be a little cheap though. I don't know...this is a hard one. I was thinking all units start with Woodsman I, but they already start with Guerilla I after you build a Dun, so it would be really unbalanced if they had both (IMO).

Native America- Power of the Plains: one extra food and one extra production from plains tiles

Good idea, done.

Netherlands- Power of Trade: coastal cities have one extra trade route

That seems kind of weak when Mali gets +1 trade route in every city.

Aztecs- Power of Tribute: Vassal states available earlier (code of laws?)

I don't know how good that would be...Vassal states would be useless that early in the game.

Greece- Power of Hellenic Culture: beakers per culture rate (2 per 10%?)

Again, doesn't seem very good, but I'll consider something like this.

Mongolia- Power of the Golden Horde: All cavalry start with mobility (+1 movement)

Added to the list of possibilities.

Sumer- Power of Agriculture: Farms spread fresh water from start of game

Hmm, interesting idea, but it's really situational. If you don't start near water at all (or if you have rivers everywhere) then it's useless. But it's a good idea, I'll consider it until something better comes up.

I love the idea. The power you have for Zulu doesn't make any sense, though - the Zulus lived nowhere near jungle. I like the power though, and it might make sense for someone else, like Maya.

This is why I started this thread. Thanks for pointing that out.

Maya or Khmer - extra food, commerce, and/or hammers from jungle

Added something like that for Khmer, although I'd like to do something relating to science for Maya (since they were scientifically advanced compared to the rest of the civilizations in the area).

Arabia - I think Rhye's power is very appropriate; maybe toned down, so state religion spreads to all captured cities

I'll just use the "religion spreads faster" idea. That way you don't have to conquer anything for it to work.

India - definitely something dealing with many religions per city

Okay, I'll try to think of something that isn't too situational.

Mongolia - Bonus to pillaging, or capturing or razing cities. Maybe all mounted units get +X% to city attack? Or free units given when a city it razed?

I added the city attack idea to the list.

Turks - Some bonus to vassals: other civs more likely to vassalize?

I don't want to do anything relating to AI because then the power would have no effect in multiplayer. Same with France's "other civs have a friendlier attitude" power in RFC. But a vassal-related bonus would be fine.

Portugal - some bonus to exploration

Maybe all ships start with Navigation I? (+1 movement)

Byzantium - I think a bonus to the state religion, or one to defense would fit. Maybe both?: all cities with state religion get +X% defense.

Okay, that sounds like a good idea, I'll definitely consider it. If not, then I can make all units start with the city defense promotion (whatever it's called).

Sumeria - Wild idea: maybe they start with X random free techs at the start of the game

Hah, that is a wild idea. But then that would only help them in the very beginning of the game, something I want to try to avoid. But it's definitely a creative idea, I'll try to figure out how to make it balanced. Were they technologically advanced historically?

Zulu - A bonus to units' mobility, like maybe free Guerrilla II or Mobility to all units

Their UU already starts with mobility. But otherwise it's a good idea.


Thanks again for all the replies guys!

 

[Temrek]

Russia has? Long time since I played Rhyes mod. Anyway, I dont think it will be unbalanced.

Lets see:

Rome - The Power of Slavery: Whenever they raze an enemy city, its population is spread out to the civilizations cities.

Greece - The Power of Classical Thought: Cities with state religion gets +10 Research and Culture.

 

[Firestorm94]

this is going to be a great mod, i'll be first to download it

Ottomans:+2 per vassals and maintenance costs from having vassals decreases

Egypt: extra food/production/commerce from desert

Aztecs:can whip without slavery

EDIT: how far are you in the making of these powers? i'd like to see how it is going so far. crossing fingers for a playtest

 

[Firestorm94]

Time for some thread reviving

Ready...
CLEAR


India could have faster research rate for religiously weighted techs

 

[musicfreak]

Hey guys, sorry it's been so long, but this mod is not dead, I've just had a lot of schoolwork and it's gotten in the way.

However, recently I've had some time to tinker with it and I will have something playable sometime soon (in a week or two). Basically what I'm doing is replacing the trait system and instead having one trait for every civ that represents the power. Because of this, you'll be able to play with the numbers in the XML as you see fit.

Note that I still have some civs without powers. I'm going to update the original post with what I'm currently using, but please keep the ideas coming.

 

[jlc102127]

you could have India with the ability to have more than 1 state religion.
We just finished Sumer in history, and they could have +1 food for flood plains (since floods were such a big part, similar to the egyptians and the nile)
speaking of the egyptians, maybe +50% wonder production, not +100% (100 may make things a bit unfair).
the greeks could have a defense bonus for all units (similar to the 300 movie)
although i think the bonus should be something scholarly.
english- the power of the battle of britain- all fighters and jets start with interception 1. or something similar for the royal navy.
spain- the power of conquistadors- 100% more pillaging yield and 100% more money for city razing.

 

[musicfreak]

you could have India with the ability to have more than 1 state religion.

I actually really like this idea, but it would require a LOT of work, as the Civ4 religion engine is based around each civ only having one engine. But I will consider it if I have time.

We just finished Sumer in history, and they could have +1 food for flood plains (since floods were such a big part, similar to the egyptians and the nile)

Right, they were really big on agriculture, which is why the current power is as it is. I was also thinking of having farms produce +1 food.

speaking of the egyptians, maybe +50% wonder production, not +100% (100 may make things a bit unfair).

How about +75%? The current industrial trait gives +50%, so I wanted something higher than that. I guess only playtesting can determine the right amount for that.

the greeks could have a defense bonus for all units (similar to the 300 movie)
although i think the bonus should be something scholarly.

Mmm, I don't know about "scholarly", but it's an interesting idea. Added to the list.

english- the power of the battle of britain- all fighters and jets start with interception 1. or something similar for the royal navy.

Since when did they have such a good air force? But yeah, I'd like to add something to do with their navy.

spain- the power of conquistadors- 100% more pillaging yield and 100% more money for city razing.

That's what I have for the Vikings right now.

Thanks for the ideas! Keep 'em coming!

 

[mujambee]

The Aztec "empire" (actually a military influence) was based on vassal states paying tributes, so maybe you could get a % of every vassall state's turn income.

Carthag was, in fact, a naval power. Their galleys/galleons/transports could have strong combat.

Don't like the spanish espionage bonus, has nothing to do with historic facts. What about cities with official religion get +25% production (food, money, beakers, hammers...)?

Mongol hordes were capable of moving so long distances because of their ability to sustain themselves while on the move, so maybe a reduced cost on unit manteinance could be historically accurate.

Portugal: +1 naval movement allowance (like when circumnavigating the world) and +1 sight radius at sea.

Rome: Workers build roads in 2 turns; can use enemy roads/railroads.


America: Inmune tu foreign culture

 

[Infantry#14]

China: how about tiles that already produce 4 food gets an extra food?
(may be too overpower after biology)

 

[musicfreak]

The Aztec "empire" (actually a military influence) was based on vassal states paying tributes, so maybe you could get a % of every vassall state's turn income.

Hmm alright, I'll ponder that.

Carthag was, in fact, a naval power. Their galleys/galleons/transports could have strong combat.

I'd rather give a naval bonus to England, but I'll consider it.

Don't like the spanish espionage bonus, has nothing to do with historic facts. What about cities with official religion get +25% production (food, money, beakers, hammers...)?

Alright, changed.

Mongol hordes were capable of moving so long distances because of their ability to sustain themselves while on the move, so maybe a reduced cost on unit manteinance could be historically accurate.

Good idea, added. I'll probably end up using this one because it's the easiest to balance while still being historically accurate.

Portugal: +1 naval movement allowance (like when circumnavigating the world) and +1 sight radius at sea.

Added. I had that originally but I didn't want to copy Rhye's power. But I guess it makes the most sense for Portugal, so I added it back in.

Rome: Workers build roads in 2 turns; can use enemy roads/railroads.

Would the latter part be unfair? (All units start with Commando.) I don't know, it seems a little cheap to me. Original idea though.

America: Inmune tu foreign culture

If immigration existed in Civ4, I would gladly add this as a feature.

China: how about tiles that already produce 4 food gets an extra food?

Hmm, so then is my current power for Sumer too powerful? Should I change it to something like Farm +1 food?


As always, thanks for the suggestions.

 

[Tholish]

Ethiopia: slowed effects of starvation.
Netherlands: can found cities in coast. (works on advanced start only since no sea unit has found)
Byzantium: can respawn indefinitely
Celts:can draft regardles of civic
HRE: can release vassals at will (ie, gets this choice when the vassal gets into a war)
Maya:gets extra food from jungle
Zulu: can upgrade workers to impi

 

[Shiggs713]

I was thinking more something to do with religion for Ethiopia. You know they claim to own the Ark of the Covenant?

Netherlands maybe something for trading or expanding. Or perhaps both, like +1 trade routes for coastal cities or something along those lines.

America +2 culture? That just sounds odd. They should get an industrial, or economical bonus over culture. Or perhaps something about elite marines or that certain units don't get amphibious penalty or perhaps even bonuses for air units. Any of those sound more like America then a culture bonus.

 

[musicfreak]

America +2 culture? That just sounds odd. They should get an industrial, or economical bonus over culture. Or perhaps something about elite marines or that certain units don't get amphibious penalty or perhaps even bonuses for air units. Any of those sound more like America then a culture bonus.

Oops, that was definitely a typo, it was supposed to say "+2 happiness" (for the American Dream).

 

[Tholish]

For civ 3 I made an America mod that gave America all the unique units and unique buildings belonging to anybody, due to its being a land of diversity, and America started with Republic and to compensate for all this you could only play on Deity level. Something like this would be out of the question I guess.