Aquatic
Child of Surprises
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2005
- Messages
- 93
The partisans bug is corrected. See posts 1816 & 1817!
@ Bhruic
This gives me the opportunity to say thank you very much for posting this! Much appreciated.
Unofficial BTS 3.13 patch
- Thread starter Bhruic
- Start date
The partisans bug is corrected. See posts 1816 & 1817!
@ Bhruic
This gives me the opportunity to say thank you very much for posting this! Much appreciated.
Wodan
Deity
Bhruic, are you going to fix the worker bug?
More and more I'm thinking this is a huge issue. I think there's not a big outcry because it isn't thrown in your face. Yet, when the AI constantly has its workers changing Towns to farms, and farms to cottages, with workshops etc thrown in the mix, the nerf to AI development is drastic.
Wodan
More and more I'm thinking this is a huge issue. I think there's not a big outcry because it isn't thrown in your face. Yet, when the AI constantly has its workers changing Towns to farms, and farms to cottages, with workshops etc thrown in the mix, the nerf to AI development is drastic.
Wodan
Roland Johansen
Deity
I agree that this is probably one of the biggest problems for the AI. It means that some of their cottages will never develop beyond the cottage stage which essentially makes a certain percentage of their tiles of much poorer value than comparable human managed cities.
It's probably not something that can be solved easily though. City tile improvement isn't such an easy issue. Maybe slightly easier than city placement, but still pretty hard. I talked about this a bit with DrewBledsoe and essentially, the AI has to be a bit more conservative. If 2 different tile improvements both have comparable value and one has already been constructed, then don't change things. Presently, the AI switches them around because apparently their valuation algorithm changes the valuation all the time. Maybe because their city is either starving or growing, dependent on the improvement that is being build or maybe because multiple changes are being made to the city tile improvements at the same time.
The most awful version of this AI behaviour is when one tile is being changed from a cottage to a farm and the tile next to it (in the same big fat cross) is being changed from a farm to a cottage. And a few turns later, the workers change it back again. Maybe, it's better if a city is being improved one tile at a time or workers should somehow be aware of other changes being made.
(I presently don't have savegames that show the issue as I'm at the start of a game and haven't made contact yet.)
Wodan
Deity
I think you're probably right it's not a simple 5 minute fix, but that doesn't mean it'll be a huge undertaking. Anyway the question is whether Bh will look into it or not.
Regardless of when the next official patch comes, good documentation of further changes such as this one will easily enable any missed by the Firaxis patch to be carried over to a future new unofficial patch.
Wodan
Regardless of when the next official patch comes, good documentation of further changes such as this one will easily enable any missed by the Firaxis patch to be carried over to a future new unofficial patch.
Wodan
Wodan
Deity
Roland Johansen
Deity
Great to hear that you are willing to take a look at it.
I think any game in the industrial age or further will have instances of this dumb behaviour once you open the world builder to look for it. It might not happen that much in earlier ages before the world is covered in tile improvements.
My present game isn't in a sufficiently advanced stadium yet and I'm not a quick player so it won't get there any time soon either.
DrewBledsoe
Veteran QB
Have to agree with this....(and I've played only a handful of hours in the couple of weeks, so I won't have any examples to show either
)Two other points on workers, both (hopefully) with merit, but neither as important, as RJ's illustration of "dumb behaviour"...
1) Early in the game, the ai doesn't seem to "pair" up its workers enough. I often see 2 seperate tiles being improved for the same city, by 2 individual workers. If they "pair" and improve one tile at a time, the city can use that tile earlier (especially beneficial with horses and copper, for examples).
2) IMO, the ai still builds far too many workers, period. You don't need to improve every tile for a size 10 city in the early medievel period, for example. If there is nothing else to do, then you (or the ai) has built too many workers (the hammers could have been used on something more useful). The ais also in this case, often suffer from unhealthiness, as they've chopped every forest in sight, in their hurry to improve presently "pointless" tiles.
Let's hope Bhuric can maybe come on with something, but its a tough ask, as a lot of worker behaviour (what to improve, what to leave, when to chop etc.), is down to the judgement of an experienced player....
TheWilltoAct
I am observe
Is this screwy worker AI something that has been there all along or...?
KrikkitTwo
Immortal
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2004
- Messages
- 12,418
Well I think changing the AI to be more Conservative about tile Improvements would be a Big one. As for having too many workers... well by and large that's not too bad, but the AI will need less of them if it doesn't switch as often.
Wodan
Deity
Roland Johansen
Deity
I'm pretty sure it has been there all along. Most players aren't that observant of AI behaviour that isn't effecting their own empire negatively and often you can't see what the AI is doing inside their own empire. If an AI is using a dumb tactic to attack you, then that is far more visible than their tile improvement behaviour.
Minor Annoyance
Deity
Automated workers will show the bad A.I. to the player first hand and I saw it a lot before I realized I should do it myself.
In my last game an AI had covered their empire in towns without finding time to ruin them, but they were financial so something in it's decision making probably had it prioritize cottages enough to not remove them.
In my last game an AI had covered their empire in towns without finding time to ruin them, but they were financial so something in it's decision making probably had it prioritize cottages enough to not remove them.
Saves are of primary importance, I'll want something to test when I'm tinkering with things.
Bh
Would save documentary of this during war be of any use? I have little knowledge of the AI's inner workings, but I guess that could cause a different improvement personality. In this case Zara gg'ed all of his improved cottages in favour of workshops.
Edit: In any case, you could try going into the world builder and force peace and see whether it changes.
Edit: In any case, you could try going into the world builder and force peace and see whether it changes.
Dumbest Questions of the Month:
All the Supplementary files by the same name as the patch files are the exact same content, or do they add minor fixes within themselves as well? And the event one is the only one needed to fix the Partisans, right? I ask because there really wasn't any documentation in regards to that.
It's not a dumb question...
The files in the supplementary patch are based on the official 3.13 patch files, but they also include the fixes mentioned in the first post. The CvEventManager.py file is the only one necessary to fix the Partisans bug, yes.
Bh
The files in the supplementary patch are based on the official 3.13 patch files, but they also include the fixes mentioned in the first post. The CvEventManager.py file is the only one necessary to fix the Partisans bug, yes.
Bh
I thought that was the answer. Had a headache and didn't feel like trying to read the python at the time, so I figured I might as well just post the question
Much appreciated man
Shurdus
Am I Napoleon?
A few quick questions if I may...
Can I uninstall this patch seperately should it turn out to not work as I intended?
Is this patch compatible with a fresh installation of the complete edition?
What are the known issues?
Thanks in advance?
Can I uninstall this patch seperately should it turn out to not work as I intended?
Is this patch compatible with a fresh installation of the complete edition?
What are the known issues?
Thanks in advance?
