Upgrades more powerful tool in civ4

[LeConquerant]

I don't know for you all... but I find it much more interesting to upgrade units than in previous civ versions: this time, upgrading leads to many more units (one stone-age warrior can become an antic spearman which can turn into a medieval mace-man, etc...)

In fact, in later stages of the game, this leads me to regretting not having stacked-up spearmen and axemen: in civ3 I used to produce only units i needed, but in fact since they are upgradeable even up to modern ages, it looks more valid than before to develop a strong army from the very beginning. Of course this comes to a cost but with the many civics available, I think a way can be found to manage both a large army and not hammering too much the finance/research.

any thoughts?

 

[remconius]

You need just a hordes of cash....

 

[Phyr_Negator]

archer=>longbowman=100gp, assuming he is not promoted, cuz I suspect that promoted units cost more. Assuming that there will be near 6 or 8 cities to the time longb. will be researced that upgrade will drive you to beggar's life -_-

 

[Good Omens]

I with there were a "Newon's Workshop" or "Skunkworks" style wonder that would allow cheap upgrades. Or else a Great General addition to the Great People system might have that ability.

 

[LeConquerant]

I am playing only at Regent level yet... but my economy produces tons of cash. I have a financial leader (Catherine) and have +50 to +100 per turn, though I am at 70% research and 10% culture: that allows me to upgrade one unit per turn.

I only let the workers improve as they wanted, put tribunal, marketplaces, groceries, etc... + specialists, in all cities and bam loads of cash are coming in, research started getting boosted, etc... so at this moment it is really worth upgrading units vs producing new ones from scratch, but maybe that is only because Regent grants easy cash

 

[Brota]

I never had more than 50g on Emperor level.

 

[vinstafresh]

Or else a Great General addition to the Great People system might have that ability.

Excellent idea!

 

[KMadCandy]

i found the alt-key to upgrade all units of one type, but haven't found any way to tell the total that would spend. i suppose i could go to the military advisor and see how many i have and do math, if the cost is always the same and doesn't depend on promotions, but i'm hoping there's an easy way like in previous versions that i just haven't seen.

 

[duxup]

i found the alt-key to upgrade all units of one type, but haven't found any way to tell the total that would spend. i suppose i could go to the military advisor and see how many i have and do math, if the cost is always the same and doesn't depend on promotions, but i'm hoping there's an easy way like in previous versions that i just haven't seen.

If you have units grouped together you can upgrade them all at once. Also I believe when you mouse over a group that can be upgraded the mouse over window in the lower left will show the total cost to upgrade.

 

[spa]

I have found upgrading is key in this Civ. You simply can't afford to waste the city production time on new units every time tech advances at because the cities need to be building improvements so that you get the most out of them. There really isn't a whole lot of time to be wasting on Normal speed on a large map. One thing that I do that I find is useful if I need to upgrade but I'm low on cash is for a single turn I'll turn science to 0. One less turn of science research usually means that I have enough gold to upgrade the whole army. More than a fair trade off.

 

[Volstag]

I've always been a huge fan of unit upgrades. It's really the only way to extend their usefulness. I've found that the cash isn't particularly difficult to obtain, provided you're in a position to reduce your science/culture research. I usually check to see how much it'll cost to completely upgrade all units of the same type. Then I'll reduce science/culture spending to zero until I gain the required amount. Upgrade the whole mess. Continue generating cash for a few turns (to restore the coffers), then adjust back to the previous science/culture levels.

 

[Volstag]

i found the alt-key to upgrade all units of one type, but haven't found any way to tell the total that would spend.

Hold down the alt key, hover your mouse over the "upgrade" icon. It'll give you the total cost to upgrade all your units. Note that the price won't update while you have the cursor over the icon. Move it off, hold down alt, move it back -- you'll see the total cost.

 

[joelzhl]

Upgrade cost = 25g + ( 3 * difference in hammers )

It might be adjusted by difficulty too, but I am not too sure on that one. Given the base 25g upgrade cost, I usually delay most of my upgrades unless my total military strength is below the average. The only units I keep constantly up to date are my response teams and few selected border units. Last game on monarch difficulty, I only had 1 warrior guarding my capitol city while I have tanks on my borders .

 

[Kikimalaka]

Has anyone made an tree for the upgrade units?

 

[Ghraabthar]

Well the last game I played upgrades played a huge role. I was playing Japanese on a Large map on Prince difficulty. After my closest neighbor Gandhi had expanded to my border, I rushed him with swordsmen who were promoted with a combination of city raider and cover (bonus vs archer). After wiping out the Indians I had tech'd up to get samurai. In addition to training new units, I also upgraded my swordsmen whenever I could afford it (selling techs, plunder from), many of whom had cover and city raider already. From this point on all my promotions were to city raider. After wiping out the Roosevelt, I turned my attention to Napolean. After taking 3 cities along the border, he started to get Muskateers, which were difficult for my samurai to overcome. I started massing cavalry, but at the same time, I was also promoting my samurai to riflemen.

The point to all this is that my riflemen had all the previous city raider promotions, so in many cases they were more effective at taking cities than cavalry. The have almost equivalent strength, but with the promotions that I wouldn't have had access to if I had built fresh riflemen. In the end I won with a space victory in 1898, and I had a few infantry left over from my original swordsmen/samurai after wiping out the Hatshepsut.

 

[Heroes]

Has anyone made an tree for the upgrade units?

Yes, I did one: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=136517. But hope it's clear to you ...

 

[TigrisJK]

I find upgrading to be particularly helpful, especially with a financial leader playing a peaceful route (typically for me, playing Catherine, who is Cre/Fin) when assaulted by the enemy.

Having superior units to the enemy, especially with a civ that has the money to afford high levels of research, can make the difference between a sacked and stable city.

For example, a single machine gunner can hold off hordes of riflemen, especially if they do not all attack in one turn; and he will benefit from the promotions. It also gives you a single turn's time to rush-build another defensive unit... and hopefully you've gotten whatever civic it is that lets you rush-build with money... and if not that, slavery, which works well enough in emergencies.

Since I like to maintain a small standing army, it is generally a good thing to have it up to date.

The only gripe I have with advanced units is the lack of production capability in new towns, since they cost more hammers... and thus make new towns near useless in terms of defending on their own... and the choice between colonizing the new world while losing some of your defensive capability at home or keeping your troops home is a tough one.

I'd like to be able to build archers when I'm only dealing with barbarian scum, even if I can get riflemen..

 

[KMadCandy]

Hold down the alt key, hover your mouse over the "upgrade" icon. It'll give you the total cost to upgrade all your units. Note that the price won't update while you have the cursor over the icon. Move it off, hold down alt, move it back -- you'll see the total cost.

*giggle* very intuitive, silly me for missing that. but thank you very much i'm sure i'll be using it now that i know!

 

[Dairuka]

Edited due to a misunderstanding. The Kremlin makes rushing production cheaper; which is still pretty damn awesome; but doesn't relate to the initial topic.

 

[CitizenCain]

That's not what it does. It makes rushing production cheaper, not upgrading.