Exsanguination
No longer here
I take it GOTM9 must be finished with 1.29f?
(I've started with 1.21, but will now finish with 1.29, like so many others.)
(I've started with 1.21, but will now finish with 1.29, like so many others.)
v1.29f + GOTM
- Thread starter Exsanguination
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cracker
Gil Favor's Sidekick
I am unsure if V1.29 has any effect on in process games because so much is preset in the initial save file.
However, I would finish the game under V1.21 if I expected to have my results be unquestion or undisrupted.
Modding or installing a patch in midgame without a really well documented and overly superior good reason would indicate a fairly high level of stupidity in my registry of "dumb things I have heard other people do."
The comment on finishing the game in V1.29 "like so many others" is not valid. A number of games have already been completed in V1.21 and many people are on the ball enough to not create the half patched version conflict in an ongoing game.
However, I would finish the game under V1.21 if I expected to have my results be unquestion or undisrupted.
Modding or installing a patch in midgame without a really well documented and overly superior good reason would indicate a fairly high level of stupidity in my registry of "dumb things I have heard other people do."
The comment on finishing the game in V1.29 "like so many others" is not valid. A number of games have already been completed in V1.21 and many people are on the ball enough to not create the half patched version conflict in an ongoing game.
MOE
Chieftain
I already submittet my game - with 1.21f! I think this month both versions will be valid.
cracker
Gil Favor's Sidekick
Definately do not attempt to load V1.29 and complete the GOTM9 game.
There are changes to the AI program that have not been documented that will severly alter the outcome of the game.
One factor that has been changed is the AI tech research rate. In V1.21 the AIs will be using a factor of 8 for tech research. If you patch to V1.29 the AIs will be using a tech research rate of 10.
The tech trading valuation algorithm is also altered particularly with respect to optional techs.
Some people will get severely crushed by these altered conditions while other players may be able to exploit them by switching rules in the middle of the game. I would personally try to play the game in V1.21 up until my Great Library obsoleted itself and then switch to V1.29 to exploit the tech research balance issues. But then again, my game is complete in V1.21 and that is effectively a non-issue.
As a matter of standard practice it has never been acceptable to let the players choose to use either one of a variety of different software patches to complete a tournament game of any kind. The standard of pratice is that the software patch in effect at the time the tournament game is released should be the required patch for completing the game.
There are changes to the AI program that have not been documented that will severly alter the outcome of the game.
One factor that has been changed is the AI tech research rate. In V1.21 the AIs will be using a factor of 8 for tech research. If you patch to V1.29 the AIs will be using a tech research rate of 10.
The tech trading valuation algorithm is also altered particularly with respect to optional techs.
Some people will get severely crushed by these altered conditions while other players may be able to exploit them by switching rules in the middle of the game. I would personally try to play the game in V1.21 up until my Great Library obsoleted itself and then switch to V1.29 to exploit the tech research balance issues. But then again, my game is complete in V1.21 and that is effectively a non-issue.
As a matter of standard practice it has never been acceptable to let the players choose to use either one of a variety of different software patches to complete a tournament game of any kind. The standard of pratice is that the software patch in effect at the time the tournament game is released should be the required patch for completing the game.
Exsanguination
No longer here
alright, how about we settle this once and for all.
MATRIX???
MATRIX???
Phillip_martin
Make it so.
I would hold off installing the latest patch until a ruling is made by Matrix.
There was some confusion last time in which the final decision was to not use the new patch until the current GOTM was finished.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20513
My preference is leave patches out for a current game.
There was some confusion last time in which the final decision was to not use the new patch until the current GOTM was finished.
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20513
My preference is leave patches out for a current game.
Sorry, I was away this weekend. You may choose which patch to use.
Exsanguination
No longer here
aye, but can we switch mid-game?
Scientia
Warlord
As Cracker has mentioned, there are changes to the AI in the latest patch that will possibly affect the outcome of the latest GOTM. If players are allowed to choose which patch they install, or switch versions mid-game, how can we have a stable baseline to compare results against?
I've also heard several people mention that 1.29 slows down the AI tech trading rate. For a majority of us, being behind several techs is the norm, so if the latest patch makes it semi-possible to keep up, or take a lead earlier on then would be otherwise possible, the outcome of the game will definitely be changed.
Just my 2 cents worth.
cracker
Gil Favor's Sidekick
Sorry if this is a bit harsh but the answer is still obvious and does not favor the option of submitting a V1.29 game for GOTM9. I don't make the rules but I also have not had my brain sucked dry by the Borg.
Unfortunately, I believe that Extinguishednations original question and then Matrix's relatively uniformed response both begin to take on fairly idiotic proportions when we begin to know the facts.
Using the V1.29 patch for GOTM9 is not acceptable and in most cases will disrupt or cripple the player that is stupid enough to try and load the patch either mid game or before playing at all.
The emporer tech research cost rate for the human player is altered to an effective multplier of 12.5 where it used to be 10 and that amounts to an effect increase of 25% in tech research cost.
The AI military power evaluation code is update to use unit strengths instead of just a straight body count and since GOTM9 is with a religious/industrious civ that means that all the workers are eliminated from the power count.
The AI is also a bit more aggressive about demanding extrotion and tribute as well a starting localized wars.
The changes do not cripple the game overall but V1.29 is not the same as V1.21 in process or outcome.
We should look at Extinguished's other posts where he/she indicates it is unlikely that they will even have time to finish the GOTM9 and the same player's past GOTM submission record to recognize that this question and this posting thread may just be an excuse to try and get Matrix to make a technical rules determination that benefits no one and that has no real place in this example.
V1.29 can be OK for GOTM10 where France can benefit from the slight upgrade in Commercial trait power, but to ask the question of "is it OK to shift horse's in mid stream of to have games submitted from either V1.21 or the V1.29 patch demonstrates a complete lack of functional understanding of eitehr the GOTM process or the basic functioning of the CIV3 game engine
Unfortunately, I believe that Extinguishednations original question and then Matrix's relatively uniformed response both begin to take on fairly idiotic proportions when we begin to know the facts.
Using the V1.29 patch for GOTM9 is not acceptable and in most cases will disrupt or cripple the player that is stupid enough to try and load the patch either mid game or before playing at all.
The emporer tech research cost rate for the human player is altered to an effective multplier of 12.5 where it used to be 10 and that amounts to an effect increase of 25% in tech research cost.
The AI military power evaluation code is update to use unit strengths instead of just a straight body count and since GOTM9 is with a religious/industrious civ that means that all the workers are eliminated from the power count.
The AI is also a bit more aggressive about demanding extrotion and tribute as well a starting localized wars.
The changes do not cripple the game overall but V1.29 is not the same as V1.21 in process or outcome.
We should look at Extinguished's other posts where he/she indicates it is unlikely that they will even have time to finish the GOTM9 and the same player's past GOTM submission record to recognize that this question and this posting thread may just be an excuse to try and get Matrix to make a technical rules determination that benefits no one and that has no real place in this example.
V1.29 can be OK for GOTM10 where France can benefit from the slight upgrade in Commercial trait power, but to ask the question of "is it OK to shift horse's in mid stream of to have games submitted from either V1.21 or the V1.29 patch demonstrates a complete lack of functional understanding of eitehr the GOTM process or the basic functioning of the CIV3 game engine
MOE
Chieftain
I agree with Cracker - I already submitted the game a few days before the patch came out. Should be the same rules for all of us!
Exsanguination
No longer here
(was that supposed to be an insult?)Anyways, I COULD CARE LESS. Get over it, I didn't want to get personal here, but seriously. you're one twisted person, cracker. You have no business saying its "idiotic" or"that I'm trying to twist the rules" - "just look at his GOTM record" I DON'T HAVE A GOTM RECORD. This is my first genius. Get off this board, is my advice. Or at least don't post in this thread again. Your opinion is worthless.
Just to clarify (everyone else): at this point, no patch will help me
. I'm in a hoel and can't get out (thanky ou Japan 
).If you are curious, I must have 1.29f since I am working on a scenario (a project that I have been working on since october), and that gets first priority. So i'm gonna reload 1.21 just to finish GOTM (or at least to submit it - I'm still gonna finish it).
Finally, Matrix, again, are we allowed to switch patch mid-game? I don't need anyone else's answer, please.
cracker
Gil Favor's Sidekick
Originally posted by Exsanguination
I DON'T HAVE A GOTM RECORD. This is my first genius. ....
Just to clarify (everyone else): at this point, no patch will help me
This was my point exactly.
You are missing the big picture. You are standing in large room crowded full of very knowledgable civ players and screaming at the top of your lungs "Watch me, Watch me!! Is it OK if I lick my fingers and stick them in this electrical socket."
The crowd first defers to the noble ruler Matrix, and he thinks a minute (gears grinding in the background) and he comes up with several options: 1) if he says "no", then this village idiot will continue to annoy the crowd and probably just argue, 2) if he says "yes", then all he has to do is wait the big frying "ZZZZAP-ZORT-SIZZLE" noises to stop and wait for the cleaning crew to clean up the pile of burned flesh and air out the room.
On a broader level, think what this question and your behavior says about the potential gameplay knowledge that will be embodied in your Mod package/Scenario. The reviews might say "Plays like a freakin' brick, so you can use it on any patch (V1.17 or V1.21 or V1.29 you want, without worrying if it will play any differently."
Cartouche Bee
Appropriations Consultant
Well, I know with many of the past updates people were allowed to switch gears mid stream. Personally, I will finish with 1.21 so that I know what I'm dealing with. I have no desire to learn about this patch with my current GOTM09, besides I don't have many outstanding issues so why flirt with the unknown. The reasoning in the past was that people were allowed to update to the current patch to keep the field open to as many participants as possible.
Yes, you are allowed to use the patch mid-game.
And if the patch gives a disavantage, then it shouldn't be forbidden. You don have to install the patch.
In any case, it's too inconvenient not to allow the patch. Last time I made an exception because the patch gave a big advantage, but since that's not the case here...
And if the patch gives a disavantage, then it shouldn't be forbidden. You don have to install the patch.
In any case, it's too inconvenient not to allow the patch. Last time I made an exception because the patch gave a big advantage, but since that's not the case here...
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I agree with Matrix. It's really not nice to ask players not to install the latest patch for a while because of this month's GOTM. I doubt the changes in 1.29f will have significant impact on the scores...
I doubt the changes in 1.29f will have significant impact on the scores...
Exsanguination
No longer here
thanks Matrix. I'll finish it now .
cracker - GET THE HELL OFF THESE FRICKIN BOARDS. You are a parasite and now are only bringing bad. If you wanna get personal about our respective creations, get over yourself - charging people for your "beautiful" units. I'm glad I haven't seen them released yet, and I hope someone "accidentally" deletes all your hard work off your disk. Your notion is disgusting, just cause you spent the $$$ to get the program doesn't mean we'll pay to get your stuff. If I could curse, I would. I have NEVER acted in such a manner on these boards before, but you just piss me off. I ask a simple question and this is the s*** you give.
TF/Matrix: Lock this thread. My question has been answered, no more replies are needed (unless cracker wants to come back with some smart ass remarks).
.cracker - GET THE HELL OFF THESE FRICKIN BOARDS. You are a parasite and now are only bringing bad. If you wanna get personal about our respective creations, get over yourself - charging people for your "beautiful" units. I'm glad I haven't seen them released yet, and I hope someone "accidentally" deletes all your hard work off your disk. Your notion is disgusting, just cause you spent the $$$ to get the program doesn't mean we'll pay to get your stuff. If I could curse, I would. I have NEVER acted in such a manner on these boards before, but you just piss me off. I ask a simple question and this is the s*** you give.
TF/Matrix: Lock this thread. My question has been answered, no more replies are needed (unless cracker wants to come back with some smart ass remarks).
As you wish.
And take an icecream.
And take an icecream.
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