War and Relations

[shumble]

When you sign an MA with another civ, the civ becomes polite or gracious to you or at least a change of attitude. I have noticed lately that if I sign an MA and then sign peace with the other civ after about 5 turns of the MA, the other civilization turns Furious toward me.

After signing an MA, do you have to stay at war until the civ you signed the MA with declares peace or do you have to wait at least 20 turns? What is the normal protocol especially on the Emperor and Deity levels where it is somewhat important to keep good relations for tech trading.

 

[druidravi]

When you sign an MA with another civ, the civ becomes polite or gracious to you or at least a change of attitude. I have noticed lately that if I sign an MA and then sign peace with the other civ after about 5 turns of the MA, the other civilization turns Furious toward me.

After signing an MA, do you have to stay at war until the civ you signed the MA with declares peace or do you have to wait at least 20 turns? What is the normal protocol especially on the Emperor and Deity levels where it is somewhat important to keep good relations for tech trading.

You can declare peace if your mil allince partner declares peace ,no need to wait for 20 turns then.
Good relations is not needed for tech trading but good reputation is , like not breaking any deals.
Only exception is right of pasage which if you break the ai 's dont give you another right of passage for a long time ,but it doesn't affect tech trading unless your right of passage deal has also a resource trading.

 

[shumble]

What if your mil alliance partner does not declare peace?

 

[nerovats]

You'll have to stay at war for those 20 turns or you are a deal breaker (just learned this myself).

 

[Himalia]

It can be abit anoying at time the amount of times my ally has gone ahead and signed a peace treaty but if you do thats like a whole different set of rules. I had it in one game (actually more than one) there was several nations involved in a war. One of my allies who i had an alliance with signed a peace treaty with three of the enemy. I then signed with one of that lot. That was ok as they were at peace with them. I then signed with a fourth nation. That changed them from gracioues to furioues just like that. A few turns later we were at war as i requested they moved there troops out of my land. Sometimes it makes no sence at all.

 

[Theoden]

The AI looks very hard on you if you break alliances and in addition to that you lose some positiveness as you lose the attitude bonus of the alliance. According to how the game works you would normally have them to be very gracious if you want to avoid them changing to furious after you break an alliance.

 

[shumble]

Yes, that's what just happened to me in my Emperor game. I had an MA with Rome against the Greeks, and the Greeks were begging for peace and were willing to give me Currency for it. I wanted Currency and the Romans wouldn't trade me for it without me giving them 71GPT. I saved the game just to see what would happen, made peace and then checked their attitude. They had turned from Gracious to Furious just like that. The game I have going is pretty good but still in the early stages (I don't think we've hit AD yet) so I haven't decided if I want to restart a new one from scratch now that I know about this new rule. I would have rather kept the Romans gracious with me for longer to get better trades since the Greeks and Aztecs (only other 2 civs we know about right now) are both Furious with me.

I truly don't understand though why the Computer is allowed to sign peace treaties whenever they want. In my last game, I signed an MA with one of the civilizations and they signed a peace treaty the very next turn and I was left fighting the war on my own.

 

[Padma]

Well, the AI (like you) can sign peace treaties whenever it seems advantageous to it. The AI (like you) takes a rep hit if it does so before the MA is cancelled. Face it, are *you* going to trust the AI to hold to a deal when it just broke one?

 

[Proletariat]

Yeah, I'm having to learn that myself in my current game. The vikings and germans both declared war on me out of nowhere, so I got the Zulus and Persians to keep the Germans busy and allied with the Russians to deny the Viking access through their territory. Within 10 turns or so, both the Russians and Persians made peace with their respective enemies. The zulus seem to be extremely honourable when it comes to keeping their word. In all the games I've played with them, I've never seem them break a deal with me. They've sometimes started wars, but only when I refused some of their demands or otherwise pissed them off.

Anyways, if I have to give an "incentive" to a potential ally in order to seal the deal, I usually do so with a luxury resource or anything else that can be taken back if the deal is broken. That way I can just renegotiate another alliance if the other guy breaks it (because hey, if they're willing to break an alliance, it's not like they'll have any scruples about breaking a peace treaty.)

 

[Misery]

Here is a semi-related question for the experts. I am on Regent playing against 7 other civs of which I have met two. I haven't made contact with the other five but my two neighbors have.

If I break a trade, or break a ROP will my reputation been ruined with the civs I haven't made contact with?

 

[Theoden]

in the case you describe your rep would be ruined with all the civs. The general rule is that any civ that knows of your treachery will tell it to everybody they know who will in turn pass on the rumours. The only way to prevent a civ from telling of your treachery is to kill them before they meet anyone else.

 

[Himalia]

Well, the AI (like you) can sign peace treaties whenever it seems advantageous to it. The AI (like you) takes a rep hit if it does so before the MA is cancelled. Face it, are *you* going to trust the AI to hold to a deal when it just broke one?

I dont trust the AI from day one no matter what its attitude towards me is.

 

[Padma]

Ah, but attitude and reputation are two different things!

You can have everyone gracious to you, but nobody will accept a GPT deal from you - they want cash on the barrelhead - NOW!. Conversely, they may all be furious with you, but will give you very reasonable credit terms on a trade.

 

[xiaoafei]

Go back to war, and the relation will be back to normal, or somehow fix a little. If you really want a good relationship, you can send it some gifts, such as luxs, techs, etc. these will fix the problem.

Anyway, it doesn't matter too much. One civ becomes annoyed or even furious to you, then what?

Actually, even if some civ is polite to you, it does not mean it won't turn against you. The truth is, there is always a price for everything. So nothing is totally reliable. For example, in my current game, French signed a MPP with Russians. When Russia turn against me, i asked French how much it would cost to make her sign the MA against Russians. The result? she wanted ~20,000 gold for this. And I happened to have this money. So you see, don't trust anything other than your own power.