Warlords- What is it good for, absolutely nothing ugh!

[lord_graywolfe]

Without resolving to bashing Firaxis, but seriously: What is Warlords good for except wasting money? The mods that are available right now are amazing and give you infinitely more of everything you want for cIV than the warlords expansion, for free.

well ill buy it because at this time i cant download anything from here. so as much as id like to try some of the mods i cant unless they are going to start burning them to disk and mailing them out. another reason im going to get it is that the few mods i was able to download before never worked right. they either dont work for me at all or cause serious problems with the game. now i know that the game itself had bugs and the expantion may have a few but at least the game works and im betting the expansion will too.

 

[Zombie69]

Huh? Of course economic utility/cost-benefit analyses take morality into account.

But not the other way around. Morality and legality have no regard for value. Since i'm talking about morality and legality here (not economics), value is irrelevent.

And selling defective products isn't illegal, at least in the U.S.

Never said it was. But selling defective products and then refusing to fix them is illegal, and this is the case we're facing here. It's just that in the video game industry, they let it go because almost everyone does it. In any other industry, something like this wouldn't fly.

 

[DaviddesJ]

However, what most of us are stating is we bought a game that is not worth the money paid out.

This is certainly not true. The overwhelming majority of people who have expressed an opinion on the quality of the game think that they got a great deal for their money.

 

[DaviddesJ]

But selling defective products and then refusing to fix them is illegal....

No, it isn't. There's no requirement to fix defects in products that you sell. The only requirement, in general, is the implied warranty of merchantability: i.e., that the product is suitable for the purpose stated. I.e., if you opened the Civ4 box and it didn't have a CD in the box at all, or the CD couldn't actually be read by a typical computer, or the CD had cake recipes on it instead of a computer game, then the manufacturer would have to fix that or refund your money. But if the box does contain a computer game, and the game just isn't as much fun as you personally would like it to be, or you don't like the particular algorithm that it uses when computing how many hammers a pop rush will yield, that's not a violation of any law, and you have no legal recourse.

 

[naterator]

Anyway, you can always return it if you are really unhappy with it.

is this just an english thing or what? it must be nice to be able to return opened software. in america, if i tried to return my civ IV the day after it came out, opened, they'd probably give me $5-$10, considering it nothing more than a used game.

 

[Zombie69]

No, it isn't. There's no requirement to fix defects in products that you sell. The only requirement, in general, is the implied warranty of merchantability: i.e., that the product is suitable for the purpose stated. I.e., if you opened the Civ4 box and it didn't have a CD in the box at all, or the CD couldn't actually be read by a typical computer, or the CD had cake recipes on it instead of a computer game, then the manufacturer would have to fix that or refund your money. But if the box does contain a computer game, and the game just isn't as much fun as you personally would like it to be, or you don't like the particular algorithm that it uses when computing how many hammers a pop rush will yield, that's not a violation of any law, and you have no legal recourse.

How about when the game won't play at all because it doesn't support one of the most popular graphics cards out there? I certainly didn't hear about Firaxis refunding those people.

 

[Zombie69]

Well then you are a fool. I would rather pay 40$ for a buggy but enjoyable game, where buggs get fixed after a few months, then 2000$ for a bug free game. Why? I don't have that kind of money to spend on video games.

Why is it that some people still don't understand what i'm talking about? The point is that no matter how much money you paid for it (which obviously should be based on how much you're willing to pay, but the actual amount is irrelevent), you should be entitled to a product that actually works.

It is not hard to predict that new games will have buggs, although I admit that 1.00.000 Civ4 was very buggy, and if you want a bug free game then wait a few months before buying it. Anyway, you can always return it if you are really unhappy with it.

It's been almost a year and it's still buggy. So waiting a few months doesn't seem to be good enough where poor-customer-support Firaxis is concerned.

 

[DaviddesJ]

How about when the game won't play at all because it doesn't support one of the most popular graphics cards out there? I certainly didn't hear about Firaxis refunding those people.

If the game doesn't work at all, on hardware that meets the specifications printed on the box, then that would appear to violate the implied warranty of merchantability and the buyer would be entitled to a refund (at least).

I haven't heard that that is the case for Civ4, but you would know better than me.

 

[Zombie69]

It was the case for people with an ATI graphics card, for quite a while.

 

[Janos]

Well i don't know a huge amount about Warlords, and it doesn't look THAT good, but as a CivIV fan, and since it'll only be £17.99 maximum, i don't mind parting with that if it improves my game sufficiently. Sure it won't be CivIV all over again, but it'll be a satisfactory expansion, i'm sure.

 

[DaviddesJ]

It was the case for people with an ATI graphics card, for quite a while.

With what ATI card, and what drivers, is the question. Certainly the game worked fine out of the box for most people with reasonably current ATI graphics cards.

 

[Janos]

With what ATI card, and what drivers, is the question. Certainly the game worked fine out of the box for most people with reasonably current ATI graphics cards.

Actually my 9600XT had problems, but that was soon solved on the evening of getting the game. However the card is relatively old, although i'd expect every game to be compatible with it seeing as it's an accomplished card.

 

[Zombie69]

With what ATI card, and what drivers, is the question. Certainly the game worked fine out of the box for most people with reasonably current ATI graphics cards.

Actually, most ATI cards, recent or not, didn't work at all. You probably didn't read the forums back then or you'd know all about it.

 

[DaviddesJ]

Actually, most ATI cards, recent or not, didn't work at all.

This is absolutely not true.

 

[Red Door]

I have an ATI and mine worked fine when I took off Blue Marble.

 

[Zombie69]

I'm talking about before Blue Marble even existed as a mod. We don't seem to be talking about the same time frame here.

 

[meatwad4289]

I'm buying Warlords... Why? because, it's bringing out some very cool items, like vassal states(which if it didnt have, i wouldnt buy) but also more civs, Military Leader, more units, and possibly many more features we have yet to learn about.

When playing a multiplayer game, I can't play any of those mods, unless I put the mods into the game creators MAIN game files. And if theres any errors along the way, We're F'd. My family enjoys playing it, and I play with with a few of my friends as well, the only time we used mods, was when I loaded ALL the files from the mod into the main of my friends and mine, because the first time we tried he kept getting an error about the copies being diffrent(prolly patch come to think of it) Anyway, it doesnt matter, fact is it adds more without the need for mods, eliminating the hassle.

Perhaps, there will be a function to allow using mods on multiplayer(IDK if its alreayd possible besides the obvious way of saving a mod over your main. )

 

[Harrier]

I'm talking about before Blue Marble even existed as a mod. We don't seem to be talking about the same time frame here.

I have an ATI AIW 9800 - it worked with the game out of the box in December last year. I could play with High Graphics settings with no on screen problems.

I did of course have problems with memorry leaks and the game slowing down. But I only remember having one Crash to Disk.

Each patch improved performance and removed those problems.

My only problem now is I need more RAM to play larger maps.

is this just an english thing or what? it must be nice to be able to return opened software. in america, if i tried to return my civ IV the day after it came out, opened, they'd probably give me $5-$10, considering it nothing more than a used game.

No - you can not return opened PC games for a refund in England. At best they will swap it for a new copy if you say the disk is deffective. At least in the majority of places.

 

[Red Door]

I'm talking about before Blue Marble even existed as a mod. We don't seem to be talking about the same time frame here.

What I'm saying is that Civ 4 worked perfectly on my ATI Video Card without Blue Marble Mod running. When I had Blue Marble running, it made my graphics work like crap.

 

[Vael]

Actually, most ATI cards, recent or not, didn't work at all. You probably didn't read the forums back then or you'd know all about it.

So you really think the complaints of a few dozen people on a message board represents "most" of the owners of the most widespread video card brand in the world? If "most" ATi owners really had problems then there would be thousands upon thousands of complaints and Civ 4 would have failed horribly.