What gives - Bananas?

[weakciv]

Maybe I dont know how to use the search very well but ...
Is there a reason the bananas with plantation loses the hammer from the plains tile? I cant think of another resource that loses something from its base tile when improved.

 

[charon2112]

Maybe I dont know how to use the search very well but ...
Is there a reason the bananas with plantation loses the hammer from the plains tile? I cant think of another resource that loses something from its base tile when improved.

Was a forest removed to build the plantation?

 

[CYZ]

I think the reason is pretty obvious...

You lose production because your people are busy eating bananas

 

[weakciv]

Was a forest removed to build the plantation?

nope
Banana/Jungle = 4 food
chop jungle (now Banana/Plains) = 3 food 1 prod
plantation = 4 food

(obviously building/tech bumps could alter these numbers)

 

[aatami]

I've always wondered if bananas really did anything. I forget, is there some building that let's me benefit from them? I can't trade them, at least.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

nope
Banana/Jungle = 4 food
chop jungle (now Banana/Plains) = 3 food 1 prod
plantation = 4 food

(obviously building/tech bumps could alter these numbers)

Actually its
Banana/Jungle=3 Food
Banana/Plains=2 food 1 production
Plantation= 4 food. (5 with Granary, 6 with Fertilizer)

The Plantation Adds 2 food and removes 1 production.. giving a net change of 1.. like any other improvement)

 

[AJF798]

Ill have to double check, but I'm fairly certain my banana plantations are give 5 Food. I'll check again tonight and repost

 

[ImperialSteeze]

I think the reason is pretty obvious...

You lose production because your people are busy eating bananas

Haha yes!

BTW Im pretty sure the granary now gives 1+ food for bananas, wheat and deer.

 

[weakciv]

Actually its
Banana/Jungle=3 Food
Banana/Plains=2 food 1 production
Plantation= 4 food. (5 with Granary, 6 with Fertilizer)

The Plantation Adds 2 food and removes 1 production.. giving a net change of 1.. like any other improvement)

you are correct, the city I was looking at had a granery so it added 1 to the banana (and I missed typed the 4 instead of 5 for plantation). however, I understand the net gain is 1 but I would rather the plantation only add 1 food and keep the hammer.

This is the only resource that by improving it you actually lose something from the base tile. (I dont count chopping forests as losing something)

 

[AJF798]

I used to go with the theory of more and more production was the key, but I tried to just go crazy with food on a city in my last game and got the pop up to 52 by the end using all farms and one or two lumbermills. Of course at the end of the game my production was through the dang roof, but it was also that way getting up there as well, you have to have a big population to even use all of those tiles youre improving anyway, and when you run out of tiles the specialists do great things for you... moreover, when you are out of specialist slots the unemployed citizens still give you production as well. All in all I think a 1 hammer sacrifice is worth it for 1 more food.

 

[weakciv]

I used to go with the theory of more and more production was the key, but I tried to just go crazy with food on a city in my last game and got the pop up to 52 by the end using all farms and one or two lumbermills. Of course at the end of the game my production was through the dang roof, but it was also that way getting up there as well, you have to have a big population to even use all of those tiles youre improving anyway, and when you run out of tiles the specialists do great things for you... moreover, when you are out of specialist slots the unemployed citizens still give you production as well. All in all I think a 1 hammer sacrifice is worth it for 1 more food.

how do you cover the unhappiness

 

[aatami]

how do you cover the unhappiness

By choosing the right policies, and/or playing India.

 

[UWHabs]

Of course, the other question is whether it's better to not chop the jungle to get the university bonus.

 

[AJF798]

I actually had no issues with unhappiness, I did just what the above said, I used polices to my advantage and made sure I had pleanty of happiness buildings built, plus having pleanty of different lux. items helped (with the policies as well). I actually saved the game when I won, did some math, and figured out I could get the city to 84 before the food = population on that city, but it would take forever

 

[Zyxpsilon]

This is the only resource that by improving it you actually lose something from the base tile. (I dont count chopping forests as losing something)

Try putting Mines, Camps, TradingPosts & what else... then you'll actually see that most improvements do shuffle up whatever default Yields were there.

 

[weakciv]

My games so far have been a hybrid-ICS style. The only tall city I have is my capital and most games it gets to about 20 pop. most other cities stay between 4 - 7 depending upon site.

I only ask about the banana because it seems to be the only one that takes away something when you build an improvement.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I used to go with the theory of more and more production was the key, but I tried to just go crazy with food on a city in my last game and got the pop up to 52 by the end using all farms and one or two lumbermills. Of course at the end of the game my production was through the dang roof, but it was also that way getting up there as well, you have to have a big population to even use all of those tiles youre improving anyway, and when you run out of tiles the specialists do great things for you... moreover, when you are out of specialist slots the unemployed citizens still give you production as well. All in all I think a 1 hammer sacrifice is worth it for 1 more food.

Yes... 1 unemployed citizen gives you

1.1 Gold (from Trade Routes.. if its not in your Capital... if its your Capital it is 0.15 * number of Trade Routes)
1-2.5 Science
1 Production

at a cost of 2 Food and 1 Unhappiness

Of course
Statue of Liberty->+1 Production
Freedom ->+0.5 Happiness [reduced cost]
Civil Society->+1 Food [reduced cost]
?Free Thought?->+2 Science
Monarchy->+0.5 Gold+0.5 Happiness (if Capital)
Macchu Pichu->+0.22 Gold for Non Capital, +0.03 Gold*Trade Routes for Capital

So you can get some trully significant benefits from food+happiness alone.

 

[weakciv]

Try putting Mines, Camps, TradingPosts & what else... then you'll actually see that most improvements do shuffle up whatever default Yields were there.

they dont shuffle anything. improvements have 2 steps:
1 - prep the land (remove forest/jungle/marsh)
2 - improve tile

Im talking about what happens in step 2. the only resource/improvent combination that takes something away is banana/plantation.

 

[Michl2602]

Ill have to double check, but I'm fairly certain my banana plantations are give 5 Food. I'll check again tonight and repost

Mine also give 5. So this tile feeds itself and a mine (with 1 food left) or itself and 3 lumbermills (as they give 1 food themselves) not to speak of the granary giving also +1 food. So they are excellent tiles (without the annoying probability of a citizen dying by eating them, what we had in CivIII).

Jungle tiles normally don't have production on them and it's common to lose 1 production, when chopping wood, so I actually don't fully get the prob here.

 

[weakciv]

Mine also give 5. So this tile feeds itself and a mine (with 1 food left) or itself and 3 lumbermills (as they give 1 food themselves) not to speak of the granary giving also +1 food. So they are excellent tiles (without the annoying probability of a citizen dying by eating them, what we had in CivIII).

Jungle tiles normally don't have production on them and it's common to lose 1 production, when chopping wood, so I actually don't fully get the prob here.

if you just chop the jungle you will have a banana/plains tile. that is where hte 1 prod comes from and thus why I'm asking.