I was a fan of squares, although there isn't really all that much difference between the two. It will be interesting to see how they handle the conversion from one to the other in terms of commerce, production and food (assuming they are all in it), although that shouldn't be a major problem. What I really don't want to see is cartoon-ish exaggerated curve on the map.
What We Must Need In Civ 5
- Thread starter Ahovking
- Start date
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
Dude i had no idea thanx you bro
Dodecahedron? They're made of pentagons, not hexagons, and they have only twelve sides. That'll make an interesting game
Perhaps we should call it something like pseudosphere or something.
CORRECTION: Actually, dodecahedron can also be also composed of other polygons than pentagon, but it always has 12 faces.
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
here are some picture
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
To Me this post is now dieing
Kullervo
Mahler/Sibelius Freak
The problem is, we know that they're coming out with something already, so what we post won't change what's being put out. I think that everyone will wait until the version comes out, and then start discussing again. Possibly this will be the most fruitful course of action.
Just throwing one thing out there that REALLY annoys me: XP loss when upgrading. In my recent game, I was playing as Kublai Khan, and I got a GODLY Keshik. I declared war on Sury, who didn't have Ivory, Copper, or Iron (but every luxury resource except wine and ivory). It was an empty declaration: He was tied up in a war against Hatshepsut, who was my closest ally, and I just declared and figured he'd ask for peace in about 30 turns. During that time, I sent 2 Keshiks to harrass him.
It was brilliant. One Keshik died early. The other one won with 3.2% odds and gained 16 XP points from 4 combats. I did not lose or retreat from a single combat out of maybe 20 that I did. I captured 2 cities with him and pretty much destroyed all of his infrastructure. I must have pillaged about 500 gold from his towns and cottages. By the end of the war, I had a 45 XP Keshik. The trouble is, I had no Great General, and suddenly Julius backstabs me. I need soldiers fast, so I streamline Guilds and upgrade all my Keshiks... including that one. I lost 35 XP just like that. I sort of understand the reasoning behind losing the XP (adapting to new weaponry, cavalrymen can't fly choppers from day 1), but this I think is a bit of realism that the game could lose. It's just too frustrating.
Just throwing one thing out there that REALLY annoys me: XP loss when upgrading. In my recent game, I was playing as Kublai Khan, and I got a GODLY Keshik. I declared war on Sury, who didn't have Ivory, Copper, or Iron (but every luxury resource except wine and ivory). It was an empty declaration: He was tied up in a war against Hatshepsut, who was my closest ally, and I just declared and figured he'd ask for peace in about 30 turns. During that time, I sent 2 Keshiks to harrass him.
It was brilliant. One Keshik died early. The other one won with 3.2% odds and gained 16 XP points from 4 combats. I did not lose or retreat from a single combat out of maybe 20 that I did. I captured 2 cities with him and pretty much destroyed all of his infrastructure. I must have pillaged about 500 gold from his towns and cottages. By the end of the war, I had a 45 XP Keshik. The trouble is, I had no Great General, and suddenly Julius backstabs me. I need soldiers fast, so I streamline Guilds and upgrade all my Keshiks... including that one. I lost 35 XP just like that. I sort of understand the reasoning behind losing the XP (adapting to new weaponry, cavalrymen can't fly choppers from day 1), but this I think is a bit of realism that the game could lose. It's just too frustrating.
Brownsfan02
WWII Buff
needs the ability to to be able to colonize planets, I know it sounds like a lot but it would be awesome. More techs would be nice also. More civs why can't we have Israel?
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
CivV update 1
-http://au.pc.ign.com/articles/107/1074732p1.html
US, March 5, 2010 - Earlier this week we had the chance to visit Firaxis to get a look at the newest version of Civilization. We'll be talking a lot about the specific features of the game next week, but today we're taking a look at some of the inspirations behind the sequel and how lead designer Jon Shafer and producer Dennis Shirk are hoping to change or reclaim some key franchise concepts. Jon's previous experience as a modder in the Civilization community has given him a healthy sense of what's possible in the world of Civilization, while his work at Firaxis on Civilization IV and its expansions have helped him keep his innovations consistent with the overall franchise.
The most obvious change is the move to a hex-based map. While it was initially a bit jarring to jettison the age-old square tiles, the new format makes for maps that look much more natural. Rather than having lots of awkward right angles and confusion about whether water tiles joined only at the corner are passable, the new hexes make movement much clearer and remove the chance for diagonal movement exploits. The move to hexes was prompted by Jon's love of the old SSI classic, Panzer General. Like that game, the new Civilization will only allow one military unit per hex, which eliminates the stacks of doom that have been such a franchise fixture. And since that means only one unit can garrison a city, combat has moved away from city sieges and instead focuses on movement and position outside of the cities.
Naturally, it's not all about making war, so diplomacy has been overhauled as well. Diplomacy has a wider focus but has also been streamlined a bit. In terms of focus, the team wanted to create a game where the player's main interactions weren't always driven purely by competition. The inclusion of unaligned city states that can be used as leverage against larger powers helps move diplomacy in a new direction. By removing the religion and espionage systems, Firaxis hopes to focus diplomacy more on specific strategic situations and less on the exploitation of more arbitrary game elements.
Jon Shafer is the new face of Civilization.
The game has obviously also been influenced by Civilization Revolution for the consoles, particularly in terms of the overall interface. While the new game still maintains a level of complexity that's appropriate for the series and the PC platform, the interface elements have been folded back to reveal more of the playing area. Likewise, the game will help players focus on the information they need to see. Small icons will appear along the edge of the screen to give players notifications of important events or opportunities, and you can instantly snap to any of the relevant locations to get your own appraisal of the situation.
It's all an attempt to make the game more accessible without compromising on the depth or details. It's also a great way to communicate information to the players without drawing them out of the game world or completely stalling the game's progress. Additionally, if you haven't set a research priority or a production order for one of your cities, the end turn button will instead take you to those screens.
Of course, not all of Civilization's PC fans had a positive view of the broad style or humor of Revolution, so they'll be happy to know that the designers are moving away from the silliness of the console game to create a more somber PC sequel. The game will still have the trademark Civilization personality, but it won't be as exaggerated as in previous installments. The advisors are making a comeback, for instance, but won't be pushing each other aside or shouting over each other.
It's not surprising given Jon's background that the new version of Civilization will be even more moddable than Civ IV. All the tools have been taken to a whole new level, so the more you know about XML and programmable DLL, the more you'll be able to achieve with the game. More importantly, the game itself will contain a browser for full community interaction, so you can search for, discuss, install and rate mods all from within the game shell. Firaxis will maintain a small bit of control over this and will rely on player flags to evaluate objectionable content.
Be sure to check back with IGN next week as we reveal exclusive new details on the game design and overall content of the new game.
-http://au.pc.ign.com/articles/107/1074732p1.html
US, March 5, 2010 - Earlier this week we had the chance to visit Firaxis to get a look at the newest version of Civilization. We'll be talking a lot about the specific features of the game next week, but today we're taking a look at some of the inspirations behind the sequel and how lead designer Jon Shafer and producer Dennis Shirk are hoping to change or reclaim some key franchise concepts. Jon's previous experience as a modder in the Civilization community has given him a healthy sense of what's possible in the world of Civilization, while his work at Firaxis on Civilization IV and its expansions have helped him keep his innovations consistent with the overall franchise.
The most obvious change is the move to a hex-based map. While it was initially a bit jarring to jettison the age-old square tiles, the new format makes for maps that look much more natural. Rather than having lots of awkward right angles and confusion about whether water tiles joined only at the corner are passable, the new hexes make movement much clearer and remove the chance for diagonal movement exploits. The move to hexes was prompted by Jon's love of the old SSI classic, Panzer General. Like that game, the new Civilization will only allow one military unit per hex, which eliminates the stacks of doom that have been such a franchise fixture. And since that means only one unit can garrison a city, combat has moved away from city sieges and instead focuses on movement and position outside of the cities.
Naturally, it's not all about making war, so diplomacy has been overhauled as well. Diplomacy has a wider focus but has also been streamlined a bit. In terms of focus, the team wanted to create a game where the player's main interactions weren't always driven purely by competition. The inclusion of unaligned city states that can be used as leverage against larger powers helps move diplomacy in a new direction. By removing the religion and espionage systems, Firaxis hopes to focus diplomacy more on specific strategic situations and less on the exploitation of more arbitrary game elements.
Jon Shafer is the new face of Civilization.
The game has obviously also been influenced by Civilization Revolution for the consoles, particularly in terms of the overall interface. While the new game still maintains a level of complexity that's appropriate for the series and the PC platform, the interface elements have been folded back to reveal more of the playing area. Likewise, the game will help players focus on the information they need to see. Small icons will appear along the edge of the screen to give players notifications of important events or opportunities, and you can instantly snap to any of the relevant locations to get your own appraisal of the situation.
It's all an attempt to make the game more accessible without compromising on the depth or details. It's also a great way to communicate information to the players without drawing them out of the game world or completely stalling the game's progress. Additionally, if you haven't set a research priority or a production order for one of your cities, the end turn button will instead take you to those screens.
Of course, not all of Civilization's PC fans had a positive view of the broad style or humor of Revolution, so they'll be happy to know that the designers are moving away from the silliness of the console game to create a more somber PC sequel. The game will still have the trademark Civilization personality, but it won't be as exaggerated as in previous installments. The advisors are making a comeback, for instance, but won't be pushing each other aside or shouting over each other.
It's not surprising given Jon's background that the new version of Civilization will be even more moddable than Civ IV. All the tools have been taken to a whole new level, so the more you know about XML and programmable DLL, the more you'll be able to achieve with the game. More importantly, the game itself will contain a browser for full community interaction, so you can search for, discuss, install and rate mods all from within the game shell. Firaxis will maintain a small bit of control over this and will rely on player flags to evaluate objectionable content.
Be sure to check back with IGN next week as we reveal exclusive new details on the game design and overall content of the new game.
Ahovking
Cyber Nations
Well we have seen so much cool things that Firaxis has released
So What are you waiting to hear for Firaxis
So What are you waiting to hear for Firaxis
Planet colonization isn't really what Civ is about, is it? Civ gives an alternate presentation of the history of civilization, from ancient era to near future. True, there are a few technologies that are still very much under development, like fusion, but we have a lot of information about it and we know it's possible to utilize it some day. The only really futuristic thing in Civ is the Space Race - it would almost be possible to build that spaceship with our present day technology. Stasis chambers too. Come on!
And why isn't Israel in? Perhaps because they wanted to cut some civs out instead of adding more. More isn't always better. And Israel was never a powerful civilization. All civs in Civ IV were dominant powers: Russia and America are real-life military and economic superpowers, Arabia was the centre of philosophy, science and trade while also maintaining a strong religious tradition, Mongolia created a vast empire rivalled only by the Great Britain, which was, along with Holland, Portugal, Spain and Frace an important colonial power. I don't recall which civs are going to be in Civ V, but I bet those 18 will be truly powerful world changing empires.
Jayrad
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2009
- Messages
- 136
Well what did Korea ever do that made them more worthy than Civs like Isreal or all the other civs you people want.
Wodan
Deity
There are many possible reasons to add a Civ than "doing something worthy".
Naokaukodem
Millenary King
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2003
- Messages
- 4,301
Yes but they are not good reasons.
Smart move, however today there are more then one tribe.
Meskwaki, why not take America out of any furthur Civilization developement and replace them with the Meskwaki? Use the Meskwaki in ragards to how everything operates currently. Well during war and maritime and business and maritime and homeland security. Spy planes who can capture photos of flags as indicators and distribution of furthur sales - i think its alot wiser that enemies dont chalk up inside information on civilizations that had past beef with you. What you never heard of that? Capture the Flag? There has probably been many lawsuits on firaxis or might be soon. I look at all the mods being created, yet none of those original games care about safety. Its designed to produce sales even if it were to be in the hands of terrorist that dont like you or anybody except the sales. Yet, why have they not done this with all those civilizations?
Meskwaki, why not take America out of any furthur Civilization developement and replace them with the Meskwaki? Use the Meskwaki in ragards to how everything operates currently. Well during war and maritime and business and maritime and homeland security. Spy planes who can capture photos of flags as indicators and distribution of furthur sales - i think its alot wiser that enemies dont chalk up inside information on civilizations that had past beef with you. What you never heard of that? Capture the Flag? There has probably been many lawsuits on firaxis or might be soon. I look at all the mods being created, yet none of those original games care about safety. Its designed to produce sales even if it were to be in the hands of terrorist that dont like you or anybody except the sales. Yet, why have they not done this with all those civilizations?
Wodan
Deity
I'm not going to debate on why Korea/<insert name of nation that never was that powerful here> should stay, but rather on why I think they shouldn't add Israel.
Firaxis was very "generous" in Civ IV - even smaller empires were added (plus one empire that never existed). I think Israel would still be on the edge. They never were a political, militaristic or financial superpower.
With Civ V, Firaxis is obviously going for a different approach. They probably realized that more civs isn't necessarily good, so they decided to have "only" 18 civs. How do they pick the 18 ones to add? The answer is simple: Pick the 18 strongest and most influential empires possibly biased a bit to make sure there's not too many civs from a certain region. If I had to pick the 18 powerhouses, I wouldn't pick 17 nations that have made the rest of world shriek in terror and a single one that, although having a strong culture, never became a real world power.
One more thing that possibly might have an impact on the decision of not adding Israel is their controversial status in the Middle East. I personally wouldn't find it offensive, but I understand there are many people who are sensitive about the current state of Israel.
On conclusion, I'll note that while Civ V has only 18 civs, there's a "city state" system that probably includes many less powerful civilizations. Considering Jerusalem's cultural significance, I'd be more than glad to see it as one of the city states to be allied with or conquered without mercy.
Firaxis was very "generous" in Civ IV - even smaller empires were added (plus one empire that never existed). I think Israel would still be on the edge. They never were a political, militaristic or financial superpower.
With Civ V, Firaxis is obviously going for a different approach. They probably realized that more civs isn't necessarily good, so they decided to have "only" 18 civs. How do they pick the 18 ones to add? The answer is simple: Pick the 18 strongest and most influential empires possibly biased a bit to make sure there's not too many civs from a certain region. If I had to pick the 18 powerhouses, I wouldn't pick 17 nations that have made the rest of world shriek in terror and a single one that, although having a strong culture, never became a real world power.
One more thing that possibly might have an impact on the decision of not adding Israel is their controversial status in the Middle East. I personally wouldn't find it offensive, but I understand there are many people who are sensitive about the current state of Israel.
On conclusion, I'll note that while Civ V has only 18 civs, there's a "city state" system that probably includes many less powerful civilizations. Considering Jerusalem's cultural significance, I'd be more than glad to see it as one of the city states to be allied with or conquered without mercy.
Wodan
Deity
May I ask where you came by this information? Or is this how you would do it?
The amount of civs (18) has been confirmed. Judging by the civs chosen in previous installments and the nature of the series, they'll try to include the most influental civilizations. Also, what alternatives do they have? 18 civilizations of varying importance, 18 civs that never became great but deserve another chance so they get to be in Civ? Not quite as feasible if you ask me. Firaxis has to have some criteria for their choices, and historical significance is likely the most significant, judging by their track records.
Also, 16 (at least according to a this thread) of the civs have been confirmed already. They are America, Germany, Aztec, Japan, China, Arabia, Mongolia, Rome, France, India, England, Songhai, Russia, Ottomans, Egypt and Greece. They match the criteria I proposed perfectly: They have been dominant factions that other nations feared, envied or admired. The only one of these that surprised me somewhat was Songhai, but as I said, it's likely that Firaxis wants to keep the pack of 18 diverse. Egypt as the only African civ would leave the majority of the African peoples unrepresented, and Songhai balances this a bit. However, Songhai was no weakling either - it was an important trader empire, and among the largest of African empires.
So, answer to your question: I came up with this information by studying the confirmed information about Civ V and by observing the very nature of the series. Picking strongest civs is also how I would do it myself, since I see no other way that would result in similarly pleasing gameplay.
Wodan
Deity
Actually, judging by the civs chosen in previous installments, there's a mix of the most influential and some that were not so influential (therefore they must have been included for other reasons).
"Another chance"? What's that mean?
The alternatives they have is to include a number of civs which are the most influential, and a number of civs which are included for other reasons (which have been enumerated elsewhere).
Agreed!
Agreed! The most significant reason, but not the only reasons to be included.
In addition, in IV, for example, some of the most significant civs were included in the expansions. Therefore, their criteria must include something other than a simple ranking of historical significance.
Please define "strongest". What's that word mean in this context?
Then how do you explain the inclusion of civs such as the Aztecs and Songhai over civs which had more historical influence? (I'm aware you already tried to explain the Songhai, but your explanation fell back on such things as geographic diversity and a rationalization of a regional economic impact, neither of which qualify them as the most historically significant.) Especially when compared to alternatives which could have been included instead and had more historical significance.