Why does Firaxis still use BC and AD?

[Vandlys]

Isn't it strange that a game embracing so many different cultures, and one that allows a rewrite of history, still uses BC, instead of a different counter?

I wouldn't mind seeing the counter start at 0 and tally up till 12.000, or simply them changing BC to BCE and AD to CE, just to forego the obvious connection to Christianity.

What do you guys think?

 

[TheSpaceCowboy]

As a non-Christian myself, I’d have no problem if they used the full unabbreviated “Before Christ” and “Anno Domini.” The only reason the so-called “Current Era” has its epoch in 1 CE is because the birth of Jesus of Nazareth was calculated as around then, so why both mincing words. If it were really a concern the whole dating system would be altered.*


*Admittedly, I sometimes do use an alternate dating system, B.T. and A.T., “Before Thériault” and “Anno Theri,” with my birthday as its epoch. My friends have gotten used to my eccentricities by now.

 

[Duuk]

Correction, "CE" is "Common Era".

And Civ4 used to have an option to just display turn number, which I liked since the years don't actually mean anything. I mean, if you can't win with a space race before 1500 AD you're still a nub. (I'm still a nub)

 

[bbbt]

Change it so it shows the year for each civilization relative to the 'birth' of the great prophet of the majority of religion in their civ?

I think shaking it up general might be a good idea with the number of complaints about how the date doesn't match the 'progress' of the game.

 

[iammaxhailme]

Not christian, don't care.

 

[Archon_Wing]

It's there to maintain a comparison to our timeline.

It's the same reason why plenty of fiction has our years for alien worlds, because the later wouldn't really mean much to people.

 

[Patine]

Let's look at the alternatives:

The Islamic Calendar - has before and after the "Revelation to Mohammed by Allah of the first part of the Quran;" I believe that one puts us in 1300-something.
The Judaic Calendar - starts at the arbitrary year of the "Seven Days of Creation," with no acknowledgement of time previously; I believe that puts us at 5400-something.
The Thai Royal Calendar - I can't remember it's inaugural event; I believe it's currently at 2200-something.
The Old Chinese Calendar - Not only goes back to sometime in the 4th or 5th Millennium BC (or BCE), but groups years into units of twelve (the Chinese "Zodiac" years), not a simple progression.
The Maya Long-Count Calendar - a very accurate and precise count of over 4000 years of time (inaugural event not clearly known), but it ended it's official count five years ago.
The Punjabi, Persian, and Classical Greek and Roman Calendars also come to mind, and I'm sure there are many others I'm less familiar with.

However, in all of these cases, it's not nearly as simple as just renaming BC(BCE) and AD(CE). Many of these calendars are still officially lunar, not solar, to boot.

 

[Perseus Gold]

We should be around the Year 12800 PMWP (Post Melt Water Pulse 1A) since the fall of the last cycle of Civilizations who were the ancestors of the builders of Gopeki Tepe.

 

[Kimiimaro]

I'm an atheist and I have no problem with BC and AD

I mean, if you can't win with a space race before 1500 AD you're still a nub. (I'm still a nub)

You can be a nub even if you win the space race before 1500 AD. But you have to play as Nubia

Btw. I'm also nub

 

[Temppu]

The turn to year coversion in somewhat arbitrary in Civ, because the temporal comparison of a Civ game and the real life is very difficult. Overall, considering the length of time of different events in game is often quite mindless, for example, ancient wars may take some thousands of Civ years. With this in mind, the calendar system could be made such that it is simply another historically and culturally interesting additonal aspect of the game.

In Civ 5 the Mayans had a special calendar, which was quite interesting. I wouldnt mind if many civilizations that use a different calendar in real life could have that particular calendar used in Civ games, like the Mayans did in Civ 5. For example, the Chinese could have their Zodiac calendar and Persians their own system. Such a system could in the best case provide passive learning of the calendar systems of different cultures and nations.

 

[Babri]

Let's look at the alternatives:
The Islamic Calendar - has before and after the "Revelation to Mohammed by Allah of the first part of the Quran;" I believe that one puts us in 1300-something.

Actually it is Before/After Hijrah. Hijrah refers to the migration that the Prophet (SAW) & his companions made from Makkah to Medina in 622 CE. The length of Islamic year is also about 10 days shorter as months are decided based on the sighting of the moon (29-30 days per month).

I agree with the OP, I would prefer BCE/CE as well instead of BC/AD, especially the Anno Domini part.

 

[Talcove]

It is a bit silly how, in game, the Aztec measure time in relation to some middle eastern guy they've never heard of.

The Maya Long-Count Calendar - a very accurate and precise count of over 4000 years of time (inaugural event not clearly known), but it ended it's official count five years ago.

Well yeah, what do you expect? The world ended five years ago. For the sake of whatever we're living in now, they could just extend the calendar.

 

[Perseus Gold]

Well yeah, what do you expect? The world ended five years ago. For the sake of whatever we're living in now, they could just extend the calendar.

The "end of the world" hype is an entirely manufactured narrative by a contemporary author, it marks the completion of a cycle.

 

[Talcove]

The "end of the world" hype is an entirely manufactured narrative by a contemporary author, it marks the completion of a cycle.

Naw man, the world is over. Look around and see for yourself.

 

[Perseus Gold]

Naw man, the world is over. Look around and see for yourself.

Spit out that desert poison, time is no linear, its cyclical.

 

[blackcatatonic]

As a non-Christian myself, I’d have no problem if they used the full unabbreviated “Before Christ” and “Anno Domini.” The only reason the so-called “Current Era” has its epoch in 1 CE is because the birth of Jesus of Nazareth was calculated as around then, so why both mincing words. If it were really a concern the whole dating system would be altered.*

^ What he said. I'm an atheist and I find the whole "Common Era" thing to be a meaningless political correction of what is still innately a Christian dating system. No point calling a spade a blunt garden instrument and pretending it's not still a spade...

 

[Kyro]

Well now, instead of crediting the Christians for giving the world an extremely useful dating system let's downplay and discredit their contribution for the sake of political correctness. Perhaps you would like to rewrite the moral code that many countries based their legal system on because it was influenced by the Judaeo-Christian world view as well.

 

[Patine]

The "end of the world" hype is an entirely manufactured narrative by a contemporary author, it marks the completion of a cycle.

I was talking about the "end of the world" hype, merely the end of the count of the calendar. I know full well a new age was anticipated. Unfortunately, no fully-versed and indoctrinated priest from the Classical Mayan religious mystery cults remained on the Earth to definitively correct us and guide us into the anticipated age that had been prophesied in the proper, so many people were left in the dark without proper information from an authoritative source...

Actually it is Before/After Hijrah. Hijrah refers to the migration that the Prophet (SAW) & his companions made from Makkah to Medina in 622 CE. The length of Islamic year is also about 10 days shorter as months are decided based on the sighting of the moon (29-30 days per month).

I agree with the OP, I would prefer BCE/CE as well instead of BC/AD, especially the Anno Domini part.

My apologies. I try to be as unbiased and accurate as possible in my views of the humanities and made an unintentional error from misremembering. No offense intended.

 

[Disgustipated]

I'd imagine the largest audience for Civ6 is older, and people like me grew up with schools using BC and AD, it's what I'm used to. But if I had to, I could get used to the other way. I'm fine either way. But I am an old fart. Back in my day, schools used BC.

It would be cool if the years switched to AD right the instant someone founds Christianity (Catholicism).

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Let's look at the alternatives:

The Islamic Calendar - has before and after the "Revelation to Mohammed by Allah of the first part of the Quran;" I believe that one puts us in 1300-something.
The Judaic Calendar - starts at the arbitrary year of the "Seven Days of Creation," with no acknowledgement of time previously; I believe that puts us at 5400-something.
The Thai Royal Calendar - I can't remember it's inaugural event; I believe it's currently at 2200-something.
The Old Chinese Calendar - Not only goes back to sometime in the 4th or 5th Millennium BC (or BCE), but groups years into units of twelve (the Chinese "Zodiac" years), not a simple progression.
The Maya Long-Count Calendar - a very accurate and precise count of over 4000 years of time (inaugural event not clearly known), but it ended it's official count five years ago.
The Punjabi, Persian, and Classical Greek and Roman Calendars also come to mind, and I'm sure there are many others I'm less familiar with.

However, in all of these cases, it's not nearly as simple as just renaming BC(BCE) and AD(CE). Many of these calendars are still officially lunar, not solar, to boot.

You left out the Imperial Japanese calendar, which dates everything from a 'start date' of the Sun God/First Emperor, so we are now in Year 4076. I believe.
Romans frequently dated things from the 'founding date' of Rome itself, many of the Greek writers dated from founding of the individual city states or from the first of the Olympic Games.
Greeks and Romans for two, used 'years' that started with the Summer Solstice, so their years actually overlap the 'Christian' dates by half.

Many, many civilizations seem to have 'dated' everything based on the ruler (or Republican Roman Consul): "X year of the reign of Z" - which is pretty arbitrary no matter how you look at it.

BUT having the game use a specific Christian dating designator for a multi-cultural game is pretty lame, even if the dating system is used almost universally in the modern world. A far better and more 'Immersive' system would be to have each Civilization start with a date based on the founding o the first city/first ruler, and later change that to the founding of the first religion/Great Prophet or some other Arbitrary date based on the development of the Civ: Discovery of Astrology, for example, might allow you to change to a Mayan or Babylonian-type calendar, a Golden Age might allow you to start all new dates from the start of the Golden Age, etc.

Oh, and as others have pointed out, the 'end of days' in 2012 was only the end of the Long Count Cycle. By design, there is no End to the Mayan calendar, it's continuously cyclic. When US archeologists asked natives of the Yucatan (Mayan) area about it, they simply said 2012 meant "It's time to get a new calendar!"