Why Korea as a Civ?

[Reboot]

Originally posted by NiteCreature
Wow...the Koreans are in, but i was very surprised to see the Inca's take the fall for it I love the inca's....

Anyway, now they are in i hope they will have the new improvement 'football field' which can produce a GL called 'Hiddink'

Cheers

Korea Fighting!!!

 

[D.Shaffer]

Better question for you to answer...why not Korea as a civilization? Are there civ's that deserve to be in the game? Yes. Does this mean the Koreans shouldnt? No. I beleive the Koreans are just as deserving a spot as all the others.

Korean achievements
A significantly unique culture that has been in existance almost as long as China. It has maintained that culture while sandwiched between two stronger nations, AND after being captured by these two nations in different points in history. The worse being the Japanese occupation during the first half of the 1900's which actively tried to destroy Korea's culture (It was a death offense to write in Korean, for instance)

Development of the first iron clad

Development of movable type

Development of the first true phonetic alphabet that also entailed significantly retooling the actual language...and making the populace use it.

Korea has had, and continues to have, one of the highest (If not THE highest) literacy rates in the world.

Major developments in rocketry...look at their unique unit. It's there for a reason. An interesting little tidbit..they had rocket powered arrows that could be fired from bows.

For much of its life, it had a three tier caste system, based strongly on confuciasm. It's also has a strong, and still existing shamanic tradition utilizing dance.

While not on the order of Japan, Korean is currently an economic powerhouse. It's populace is also a prime player of games.

With all that, how can you NOT say it's worthy of inclusion?

 

[Japher]

There is a really long and rather heated debate on this topic at Apolyton, and after reading it I think the Korean Civ is a rather good, all be it unique, idea.

check it out

 

[narmox]

Not to flame or anything, just wanted to say this...

Why you haven't heard of Korean civ in your history courses:

I've taken Ancient,

From the few ancient history courses I took, they mostly focus on mediterranean/classic civs.

European,

For sure you won't hear of Korea in European history

World,

Might've heard it here.. Might not. They probably focused on china and europe and america and russia and so on...

Canadian, and currently American history,

again, no chance of hearing about Korea here

and have never heard the country/civilization of Korea come up until the 1950s Korean War.

Did you take Asia history courses?

 

[sebanaj]

was the first to develope around 7000 BC, where agriculture appeared and pottery. They were more advanced than anyone else in everything, and constructed bic cities milleniums before the two egyptians states have been formed.
Jerico in Palestina was one of the most important cities, then Biblos in Fenicia. But that was before everything was formed. So maybe the Canaan Land (Libano, Syria, Jordan, Israel) should have a civ.

 

[sebanaj]

I'm not sure about Zeus , for Romans and Greeks he was the same god.
Only that the Romans called him Jupiter.

 

[sebanaj]

Carthago and Phoenicia are the same people! They found Carthago then they lost Tiro, and Carthago was a phoenician colony. After Phoenicia fell. Then when phoenicia disappeared as a free state, Carthago rose, and lost to Rome.

 

[sebanaj]

Argentinians are more diverse than the Americans, formed by: Spanish-Italians in a big part, then Russians, Hebrews, Germans, Polish and Welsh.
There aren't left almost any original civilization from these lands.

Maybe Americans and Argentinians could start later, in the last two centuries, the Americans starting with the advances the English had, and the Argentinians with the Spanish-Roman advances.

 

[sebanaj]

all the books i have, from high school, and ancient history, it's all about the europeans and the Near East. Where everything was supposed to start. But it is not quite known what happened in other lands.

I think the official History focused on those lands because of Jesus.
But in my books about the central indoeuropean civs of the ancient age, like the hittites, all i can found is that they were warriors, who introduced the horses and the iron to Mesopotamia.
And destroyed Babylon.

 

[sebanaj]

I'm translating from Spanish, but I may not know the names of some old tribes and small civs in English, so what I don't know I'll write them in Spanish.

The tungusas tribes (tungusas in spanish, maybe tungish in english?), were the first inhabitants of Korea, they gave them a cultural and racial identity.
Under Chinese dominance from -108 to -37.
After the Chinese, three empires were formed: Kokuryo, Paikche, and Silla. Silla beaten the other two in the VII century.
When the Silla dinasty fell in 935, the Koryo dinasty was founded.
The Koryo were weakened by the buddhist clergy.
After that, in 1232, the Mongol invaded the zone and occupied it in 1260.
The new dinasty Yi (1392-1910) adopted a rigid confucianism and installed the capital en Seul.
In 1592 they defeated a Japanese invasion attempt.
Around 1650 the chinese imposed supremacy.

After the chinese-japanese wars (1894-1895) and Russian-Japanese (1904-1905) Korea was declared a Japanese Colony (1910-1945).

After WW II, the Russians occupied the North and the Americans occupied the south, taking the parallel 38 as the frontier.

1948: The south acclaimed the Korean Republic and month later the north acclaimed the Democratic Popular Republic of Korea.

1950-53: Internal tension provoked a war which involved USA and China without winners. etc

i couldn't get anything else.

 

[narmox]

Originally posted by sebanaj

Maybe Americans and Argentinians could start later, in the last two centuries, the Americans starting with the advances the English had, and the Argentinians with the Spanish-Roman advances.

so what would be the point of playing these civs?

 

[rubicon]

I believe what's most important, in this instant, is that Firaxis is giving us a choice of what the civ player might prefer in his/her game. The increasing options available on what type of civilization, map scenario or end-game goal the player may wish to chose is there to entice larger more diverse market. So the Korean and the Turks won places as a civs- good for them! I can only hope that the game designers at Firaxis can be so discerning as to include such civilizations as the Maya, the Slavs, the Hebrews and the Songhai ( an African race which dominated west Africa and was extremely fierce and gold rich in the fourteenth century ).
And what's wrong with having the Dutch, the Portuguese, Brazil or Argentina as civs. Or better still have Firaxis create a comprehensive civ customisation editor for the creation of such civilizations.

RUBICON.

 

[newfangle]

Here's an interesting tidbit on Korea. Virtually all Chinese, Japanese, Cambodian, etc.... all originated from Korea. I guess it could be considered the "mother" of a multitude of civs.

 

[Reboot]

Originally posted by newfangle
Here's an interesting tidbit on Korea. Virtually all Chinese, Japanese, Cambodian, etc.... all originated from Korea. I guess it could be considered the "mother" of a multitude of civs.

Whao. Are you sure? How far back in pre-history are we talking about here?

 

[Hamlet]

Originally posted by newfangle
Here's an interesting tidbit on Korea. Virtually all Chinese, Japanese, Cambodian, etc.... all originated from Korea. I guess it could be considered the "mother" of a multitude of civs.

First I've heard of it. I'm pretty sure that Chinese people didn't originate from Korea. Any sources?

 

[Ozymandius]

Argentina a civ:

Whoa... This is an anti-civ... you start out with a powerful civ that has everything and slowly get leaders that blow it all away with all its citizens in permanent upheaval.

This is probably the perfect civ to study in how not to run a country.
The USA: get the DNA of all the people most wanting to improve their life, split from mother countries, rise to the top and rule the world without having to conquer it country by country. Ultimate salesman and commercial civ.
Argentina: same DNA but sink to the bottom. The story of Argentina I think is the saddest in the new world because they could have had it all.

 

[sebanaj]

the chinese were there before the Koreans have been formed, as the book said there were some tribes and dinasties there, but not Koreans. Different invasions with time may have formed the Koreans.

 

[jpowers]

The Koreans are there because Firaxis created a new 'dog' food resource and needed a civilization who would willingly use it.

Moderator Action: I fail to see the humor or the purpose of this post. If you would like to make a joke, keep it clean, not racist.

Gonzo
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[sebanaj]

but we still have the potential! the lands are still there waiting to be re worked and re built.
Needs new politics to take more aggressive decisions towards the interest of the country, not just the financial stuff.

The real economy, it's not the financial economy.

First u need to support education, then u need industry, then when u can build products u have commerce.
Argentina's government is always trying to skip education and industry and want to depend of loans/credits, etc.

Another thing to do is close the frontiers, build a larger military, defend the frontiers against the neighbors who try to enter illegally with illegal drugs, weapons, etc.
Forbid the importation of products that can be produced here.
More police and army, an aggressive politic towards crime, hunt for illegal weapons, etc. Send tanks to impose zones of control in critical crime zones in the province of Buenos Aires for example.

but most important of it, defend the frontiers! and build an army who can dominate everything there.

Maybe later when the country is developing again, go to war against the drugs to hunt their centers in foreign territory.

 

[Ozymandius]

I don't understand the inclusion of the Koreans other than a marketing ploy. They are not known as an expansionist civ. It does not matter if you invent something if it does not pass into useage elsewhere. Did they have a religion adopted by people around them. Did they develop a language or literature or art that influenced China, Japan, or Southeast Asia? Having China as a buffer prevented the spread of influence on other civs.
The spread of so many civs started in the Gobi and areas around them that their influence spread much further than the Korean.
The fall of the Roman Empire was caused in large part by civs spreading westward to conquer areas further west..
The Celts were pushed by the Germanics the Goths, Huns, Mongols. The Persians came from a similar area in central asia as did the Ottomans/Turks. The Slavs were so incompetent as fighters they gave the world the name SLAVE. Only as the Russians did they become important.