Will Civilization Revolution end up making Civilization V more complex?

[ChrTh]

How did this become a "future of PC gaming" thread?

 

[Healz]

But that can be the same with the consoles too. Therefore, there is just as much potential risk of piracy with consoles as there is with PCs. Also another thing is, gaming preferences decide whether you want a console or a PC. I like strategy games like Civilization, C&C Zero Hour and the like, which really don't play that well without the keyboard and mouse... Therefore if Strategy Games are put out that are really seen as good, we will see an increase in the number of PC Games. PC Games always seem to look to sell well at stores such as Harvey Norman. If you look at the space devoted to PC Games and Consoles they look to be about equal in Australia, if not the PC Games having a bit more space. Throw in the few Mac Conversions and things have never looked brighter for the complex games. Flight Simulators and Strategy games have always been something PC has and will always do better than the console, unless you are buying a mouse and keyboard to add your computer. Add to that the fact that computers have more potential use, including as word-processing and internet accessing, that consoles aren't good at, and I think this is a little bit like the naysayers always talking the patient down. True, there are problems, but I think the patient is basically sound...

 

[Patak]

I bought PS3 to my son two weeks ago and it was a huge disapointment for me. I remember previous playstations and it was something which at the time was offering a cool easy multiplay with friends. Now all the games are the same, the difference is that PC is more expensive to buy (but I have 3 of them at home which are connected in network and all of them are less than one year old), but the games (in my country) are much cheaper for PC. One PS3 game is app. 80$ and the same for PC is 35$. Bottom line is that my son is still using PC (he is not used for PS3 joustick) and I wasted 800 $ for something which has the same games like PC.

In regards to CIV REV and CIV, i think that there is no danger for CIV from simple versions of it. You had colonization long time ago and it did not changed the mechanisms of civilization. The only game that I can play because it is not simple. If I want simple I will buy any of the shelf games and finish it for a day. If I want to spend time and rellax I will play civ.

 

[Healz]

Yes, very sad though Colonization. I can remember having the original and looking at the forum for Colonization II and being so disappointed. It didn't sell well unsurprisingly so I doubt we will see another Colonization game for ages due to its flop...

 

[Badtz Maru]

I used to build my own gaming PCs and be a PC gamer almost exclusively. I bought a console a couple of years ago, and the next computer I bought was a $400 Gateway with integrated video (NOT a gaming machine). Many PC gamers are moving to consoles as their capabilities increase. It's sad that a whole genre of gaming may shrink into a small niche market (like flight simulators have become), but that appears to be the way it's going.

I don't really NEED a Civ5, though. Civ4 is a very rich, complex, and fun game, and Civ5 probably would require me to upgrade my PC to play it if the current trend in system requirements continues. With the modding community, Civ4 could continue to entertain for many years to come (I'm hoping that some of the better ideas from CivRev will be added to mods to Civ4).

 

[Badtz Maru]

But that can be the same with the consoles too. Therefore, there is just as much potential risk of piracy with consoles as there is with PCs.

That used to be the case, and piracy is still possible if you have no desire to play online, but since the online component is so integrated into the current generation of consoles (except the Wii, I guess) modding your console to allow you to play pirated games introduces a very real risk that you won't be able to play online at all anymore, or that future games may not work on your system if there's a firmware upgrade.

 

[squadbroken]

Piracy is a total red herring anyways. Game designers create buggy, uninspired, unnecessarily expensive games and then blame piracy when they go out of business.

As far as potential sales go, piracy only costs publishers sales if the pirate was going to buy the game in the first place.

 

[Badtz Maru]

Piracy is a total red herring anyways. Game designers create buggy, uninspired, unnecessarily expensive games and then blame piracy when they go out of business.

As far as potential sales go, piracy only costs publishers sales if the pirate was going to buy the game in the first place.

Piracy is a huge factor in game sales. Since the 1980s the PC games that set records on sales are not necessarily the most popular ones, but the ones that were well-reviewed and had hard to beat copy protection. F-15 Strike Eagle was one of the best selling PC games of it's day, and it had a lot to do with the game having a new copy protection format that was tough to crack. Dungeon Master was considered uncrackable for a while, and also sold very well.

Today, MMORPGs and online-centric games that use online CD key authentication are the best selling PC games. This is why more and more game manufacturers are moving to the genre, because it's a way to insure that everybody who plays your game buys a copy. There are a couple of other examples to show what a big impact piracy has on sales. Galactic Civilizations II had no copy protection when it was released. It had good sales despite this, but the sales figures had a large spike when they later released a patch that required you to have a registered copy to download - people had pirated the game, liked it, and when they realized they had to buy a copy to fix some bugs and balance issues, paid for it. Likewise, Spore, which was a widely pirated game, also experienced a sales spike when they released the patch that fixed many of the problems in the space section of the game.

Piracy has always been a big drain on the PC game market, and now that there are ways to avoid it, the money is going to the consoles and the MMORPGs and the multiplayer-centric games. Unfortunately this is seriously hurting the availability of good single player games.

 

[Scoottr]

Take a look at the size of the PC game shelf vs the area devoted to console games. I have a hard time finding PC games in the store anymore..have to wander around since it keeps shrinking and being moved.

Look at the small game shops like Gamestop, they have one shelf that is for PC games and part of that contains the guide books for those games.

Love PC games (bought a Wii but rarely use it), but I think they are dwindling.

 

[Badtz Maru]

Input systems are getting better in console games, as well. One of the drawbacks for consoles when it came to gaming was the lack of a mouse. Now the Wii has that beaten with it's controls, the PS3 is going to have a similar system soon, and the XBox360 is going to have that motion and gesture sensing system based off of a set-top camera soon, which may make mice obsolete. I think that, very soon, games that have traditionally been PC based due to keyboard + mouse control system will be moving to consoles as they get similar or even better means of control. I see no reason why you couldn't play Civ4 easily on a console if it had a 16+ button controller and a pointing device.

 

[binhthuy71]

Civilization V strictly for PC will never happen. There, I said it.
In order to get enough sales to justify its cost in a dwindling market, Civ V would not have to be better than BtS - it would have to be better than what BtS has become due to the excellent and unpaid work of the modding community. It would have to have a better interface than BUG, better graphics than Blue Marble, better AI than Better AI, and better gameplay than Legends of Revolution or any of the other excellent full-game modpacks. That's a serious challenge that would take a lot of time and money to overcome.

 

[stuttrboy]

Gotta love the thread Necromancy.

I have a feeling that by the time PC gaming dies out we will be playing games in totally different ways than we are now. If Microsoft and other computer companies are smart they will make it so both PC's and Consoles will be competetive.

 

[Badtz Maru]

Civilization V strictly for PC will never happen. There, I said it.
In order to get enough sales to justify its cost in a dwindling market, Civ V would not have to be better than BtS - it would have to be better than what BtS has become due to the excellent and unpaid work of the modding community. It would have to have a better interface than BUG, better graphics than Blue Marble, better AI than Better AI, and better gameplay than Legends of Revolution or any of the other excellent full-game modpacks. That's a serious challenge that would take a lot of time and money to overcome.

I think a Civ5 might accomplish that if it had a backwards compatible mode. You could have a main game mode which was Civ5 with the new engine, new interface, and new game mechanics, and then have a Civ4 emulation mode, which would have the new engine and interface, but play just like Civ4 and would allow you to use use Civ4 mods with it. They might even be able to make it so you could combine some of the new game mechanics and stuff with the older version, with a Custom Game-type setup screen.

 

[Patak]

Gotta love the thread Necromancy.

I have a feeling that by the time PC gaming dies out we will be playing games in totally different ways than we are now. If Microsoft and other computer companies are smart they will make it so both PC's and Consoles will be competetive.

PS 2 and PS 3 are not even compatable. Hahahahah. I bought PS 3 without asking a question "will the ps2 games work on this one?". My kid likes those PS 2 games with cartoon caracters which are a) not available for ps3 or for pc. Now I have a console (and bunch of games bought the firs day) THAT ARE NOT WORING. AND I AM PISSED ON PS3 AN I HATE IT.