Will purity be the best affinity in MP?

[jaldaen]

The Xenoswarm isn't any faster.

Battlesuit (assuming tectonic scanner)
Genetics, Genetic mapping, Physics*,Bionics**, [free tech servo machinery](and a quest)

*less expensive than Robotics and Alien sciences
**Just as expensive as tactical robotics/Alien Ecology

Don't you still need Engineering to "mine" Titanium? I thought Tectonic Scanner only allowed you to see these resources and not make use of them. If you can't mine Titanium before you get Engineering, then that's another tech Battlesuits require.

Also, you have to take the time to build an Institute and then wait for the Institute quest to pop before getting free Servo Mach.

Lastly, Xenoswarms are technically faster to produce. Every 3 Battlesuits (160 production each) you produce is 4 Xenoswarms (120 production each) the other player can produce.

 

[ggmoyang]

Don't you still need Engineering to "mine" Titanium?

No. Titanium can be improved with basic mine, and gives +5 hammer when improved. It's a major benefit of Tectonic Scanner.

Edit: +5 with latest patch

 

[jaldaen]

Ah good to know (also means Tectonic Scanners are a lot more powerful than I thought)... so that does help speed things up, although you still do need to build the Institute and get its quest before grabbing servo mechanics, which is a step the other affinities don't have to take.

 

[ggmoyang]

Ah good to know (also means Tectonic Scanners are a lot more powerful than I thought)... so that does help speed things up, although you still do need to build the Institute and get its quest before grabbing servo mechanics, which is a step the other affinities don't have to take.

There's difference in tech costs, Purity needs least research thanks to the free tech. Purity needs more production due to institute though... Maybe other players can attack in that time period.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

There's difference in tech costs, Purity needs least research thanks to the free tech. Purity needs more production due to institute though... Maybe other players can attack in that time period.

Not really, Purity Total tech is the cheapest (counting Free tech), but only by about 250-300 rp (Robotics or Alien Science v. Physics)

Harmony gets a Free 450 rp from its building quest.. which means it is technically the quickest by ~150-200 rp

Supremacy is slower, but gets planes, mine production boost, unit production boost, manufacturies, Titanium (without tectonic scanner) and tanks along the way

 

[ggmoyang]

Not really, Purity Total tech is the cheapest (counting Free tech), but only by about 250-300 rp (Robotics or Alien Science v. Physics)

Harmony gets a Free 450 rp from its building quest.. which means it is technically the quickest by ~150-200 rp

Supremacy is slower, but gets planes, mine production boost, unit production boost, manufacturies, Titanium (without tectonic scanner) and tanks along the way

I thought Bionics cost is same with other T2 techs, but it looks like Bionics costs more.
Given that science boost building requires Harmony level 2, Xeno swarms would be come in similar timing with Battlesuits then.

 

[MadDjinn]

Not really, Purity Total tech is the cheapest (counting Free tech), but only by about 250-300 rp (Robotics or Alien Science v. Physics)

Harmony gets a Free 450 rp from its building quest.. which means it is technically the quickest by ~150-200 rp

Supremacy is slower, but gets planes, mine production boost, unit production boost, manufacturies, Titanium (without tectonic scanner) and tanks along the way

and more production/energy+another trade route.

 

[ggmoyang]

It looks like Alien Adaptation gives only 18xp. This means two techs + one quest is not enough for level 4.
So harmony player will need might virtues or a lucky expedition, or Battlesuits will come faster.

Same with supremacy, Tactical Robotics is 18xp tech.

 

[thedrizzle02]

if you are indeed beelining for battle suits you will be just as slow as any other player getting their respective affinity units. While you may hit affinity level 4 first and be able to build the unit, you are relying on luck..... first you need a good workable source of titanium, second you will only have 1 city since you apparently do not take pioneering......

The main problem with this build is that you need to build the institute to get its respective free tech quest. That is a 310 hammer building which your capital will take forever to pump out with the respective techs you have taken.... you have little to no hammer buildings coming from the prereq techs for battlesuits....

Im curious how you think you will build that building and then starting pumping out 160 hammer units this early in the game with little amounts of infrastructure..... If you take the time to make sure you have decent production/infrastructure then other affinities could easily be at lvl 4 and be able to build their respective units.

This does not mean an early battlesuit could not be incredibly powerful, but I just do not think it will be something that comes out significantly earlier than other affinity units.

Obviously in 2 weeks we can find out for ourselves!!

 

[Knut_Are_M]

if you are indeed beelining for battle suits you will be just as slow as any other player getting their respective affinity units. While you may hit affinity level 4 first and be able to build the unit, you are relying on luck..... first you need a good workable source of titanium, second you will only have 1 city since you apparently do not take pioneering......

The main problem with this build is that you need to build the institute to get its respective free tech quest. That is a 310 hammer building which your capital will take forever to pump out with the respective techs you have taken.... you have little to no hammer buildings coming from the prereq techs for battlesuits....

Im curious how you think you will build that building and then starting pumping out 160 hammer units this early in the game with little amounts of infrastructure..... If you take the time to make sure you have decent production/infrastructure then other affinities could easily be at lvl 4 and be able to build their respective units.

This does not mean an early battlesuit could not be incredibly powerful, but I just do not think it will be something that comes out significantly earlier than other affinity units.

Obviously in 2 weeks we can find out for ourselves!!

because as the slavic federation the cost is 400 hammers, and 0 science. so you can get more basic Techs then another player. both tier 2 Techs are free Tech choises.
you still need titanium and might 5 to build them if you want to rush them.

Still that rush can be done 40-50 turns earlier then With any other tactic. and they only cost 160 hammers for 40 strength units. that is 4 hammers per unit strength. soldiers are 5 hammers per unit strength.

 

[thedrizzle02]

because as the slavic federation the cost is 400 hammers, and 0 science. so you can get more basic Techs then another player. both tier 2 Techs are free Tech choises.
you still need titanium and might 5 to build them if you want to rush them.

Still that rush can be done 40-50 turns earlier then With any other tactic. and they only cost 160 hammers for 40 strength units. that is 4 hammers per unit strength. soldiers are 5 hammers per unit strength.

if you find a satellite haha, and goodluck when your capital might have 10 production a turn if you are lucky.... you forget that in BE production from tile yields is pretty bad till later improvements/buildings.

so you still need the institute/battle suit which is 470 hammers..... so another 40+ turns. Which will be some what faster than someone else but once your battle suits are out, I imagine other civs will be pretty darn close and you will be very behind economically.

 

[ggmoyang]

I didn't said I will skip pioneering nor neglect basic economy.

 

[thedrizzle02]

Ah okay, was just suggesting if you did a pure rush it would be difficult to produce battle suits. I do agree that the free tech from the institute allows for quicker battlesuits(which could lead to an unfair advantage), but I think both of the other affinities will be able to keep up or at least be relatively close to their lvl 4 affinities before it would be too crazy.

This is also assuming purity 1 is changed so explores cannot freely kill nests making the purity quest a joke.

 

[swordoflight86]

If you played Slavic Federation, and got the Knowledge Depth bonus(that is two? free techs, I think), and planned things out right, you could get all the key techs for free, and have the necessary infrastructure to spam them.

1. Start with Engineers, Tectonic Scanner, and Clinic.
2. Build OER. Start researching Pioneering
3. Build Worker.
4. After Pioneering is complete, if you haven't found a satellite, research the tech that gives you miasmic repulsors.
5. Build Colonist.
6. After building new city, repeat steps 2 and 3 for new city.
7. Build Trade Depot in new city. Send convoy back to capital.
8. Launch satellite.
9. Get free tech.

After that point I have nothing, but I think what was there made enough sense that you could see where I was going.

 

[ggmoyang]

Thinking about normal early game, all player will need pioneering(for obvious reasons) and physics.(for defense) Add chemistry(for stronger economy) or ecology(fence) if needed.
After this, each affinity requires

Harmony: Alien biology, Alien Sciences, Alien Adaptation, (Genetics, Alien lifeforms) - last 2 techs are required to get level 4, if the player can't get xp from other sources.
Purity: Bionics, Servomachinery(free tech), Genetics, Genetic mapping
Supremacy: Engineering, Power systems, Robotics, Tactical Robotics, (Genetics, Alien lifeforms) - same with harmony.

Purity needs least amount of research, thus fastest Affinity level 4 unit.

If you played Slavic Federation, and got the Knowledge Depth bonus(that is two? free techs, I think), and planned things out right, you could get all the key techs for free, and have the necessary infrastructure to spam them.

Knowledge free tech come with 15 virtues, so that can't be used for this. There's another free tech with 15 tier 1 virtues, this can't be used for this either.
BTW if all the player chose SF, Purity player can use the satellite first so this is another advantage.

 

[swordoflight86]

For some strange reason, maybe the fact I haven't slept in three days, I thought the free tech came with five knowledge virtues. Insomnia is so much fun.

 

[joncnunn]

Moderator Action: Thread moved to Multiplayer forum

 

[Quineloe]

Regardless of whether we're talking Xeno Swarms, Ultramarines or CDNR - the existence of these affinity level 4 units means that every single MP game you have to consider rushing affinity level 4, because if all you have is armor when you get attacked, you will instantly get walked over. Cities do not hold up against these units, Gunners do pathetic damage, TacJets just go down. I used the Purity rush to bag my Apollo achievement, a city bombard, a tacjet and a gunner got my Ultramarine down to 55 hp in the open field, so no terrain defense bonuses. Just the brute force of 40+15% I then took the city with three attacks. Not even first defensive buildings helped there.

I also succeeded in repelling a rush in Multiplayer with multiple marines, gunners and Armors simply by rushing Xeno Swarm and building another. These two and some marines stopped the attack in 2 turns and on the retreat I even took his closest city. I'd say they're too strong for their tech level compared to regular troops. They require a resource to be build, but that shouldn't justify this kind of strength