[WIP] 3rd Unique Component Project

[mrc2022]

I had a similar idea for a mod, but I haven't had the time to work on it. Some ideas I had:

(1) England should get a Player's Company or Player's Guild to replace the Ampitheatre. This would be good as it reflects Britain's long history of theater and the cultural impact it has left. The problem with the "Textile mill" is that EVERY industrial country that makes clothes has textile mills. An industrial-era building for the English would be good though.

(2) The Aztecs should not get a scout unit, but either switch the Jaguar Warrior with a classical/medieval unit and give it Aztlan warrior to replace the warrior. Another idea is the Calmecac http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calmecac which could replace the barracks.

(3) France should get the Lycee to replace the public school, which would give culture as well as science. France could also just get the Foreign Legion which they had in Vanilla.

(4) Mayans should not get the ball court as a UB. Ball courts were a ubiquitous part of Mesoamerican culture and not something unique to the Mayans. There are plenty of alternatives, such as the Caracol to replace the observatory (could be an observatory which does not need to be next to mountains). Another idea is the milpa which is a method of farming the jungle which the Mayans perfected. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milpa

(1)This would have to do with points of view. After finishing the initial phase of the project I'll consider add some alternative uniques because there are lots of suggestions. Perhaps dig deeper and get uniques that not only fit the civ but also fit the theme idea of the civ.

(2)I disagree, the Eagle and the Jaguar were the elite of aztec army and a pillar to their warfare. However I can announce that I'm about to introduce some changes to the Eagle making it more unique.

(3) Same as (1)

(4) Also same as (1) although I'm inclined with giving them another unit, possibly the holkan or so

A simple suggestion - would you consider giving the Japanese Dojo a different, more unique bonus than the extra culture? Perhaps something more aggression oriented like "units built in this city gain certain promotion" or something like that? Would make them more interesting. Thanks in advance.

I'll look into it. As this is an experimental version I still haven't played through all uniques and as I've imported this unique from whoward69 I didn't think on making changes to it

 

[Pheonix56]

IMO Eagle Warriors should remain Scout replacement considering Scout replacements are rare and that makes them unique. Making them yet another generic warrior replacement would seem bland.

Similarly perhaps unique Settler/Worker replacements could be added in the future if possible. A few more unique person replacements could also help bring in more depth and variation to gameplay. Ofc all of this depends on how well they fit the Civilization they are being added to. Just my two cents.

 

[jabbawackybacky]

(2)I disagree, the Eagle and the Jaguar were the elite of aztec army and a pillar to their warfare. However I can announce that I'm about to introduce some changes to the Eagle making it more unique.

Well in a way that's precisely it - that's why I don't think that the Eagle should replace the Scout. It's already undignified enough that the Jaguar warriors replace the lowly Warrior unit, especially considering the Jaguar warriors fought the Spaniards and in some cases did quite well for themselves up until the point that the Spaniards would use their cavalry charge.

 

[Pheonix56]

Well in a way that's precisely it - that's why I don't think that the Eagle should replace the Scout. It's already undignified enough that the Jaguar warriors replace the lowly Warrior unit, especially considering the Jaguar warriors fought the Spaniards and in some cases did quite well for themselves up until the point that the Spaniards would use their cavalry charge.

I can be wrong but IMO which unit an unique would replace isn't determined by how effective they were historically, it's determined by the level of technology of that unit's equipment.

Now the Jaguar and Eagle are armed with a club with obsidian shards, obsidian spears and cotton armor. It would be pretty weird to see the elite of your army using these after your civ has discovered discover iron works. The thing is Aztecs didn't discover wheel properly when they had the Jaguar and Eagle. So it's reasonable that the Jaguar replaces a unit from before Wheel, same for the Eagle. How good they were in battle is represented by their stats and abilities, not by what they replace.

Not to mention every unique in the game was the backbone of their respective army. If Jaguar or Eagle is moved because it was the backbone and was damn impressive then many other units like Phalanx, Elephant Archer, Hunnic Horse Archer etc would also need to be moved by that logic.

 

[kaspergm]

(4) Mayans should not get the ball court as a UB. Ball courts were a ubiquitous part of Mesoamerican culture and not something unique to the Mayans. There are plenty of alternatives, such as the Caracol to replace the observatory (could be an observatory which does not need to be next to mountains).

While it would need a balancing of the observatory in order to not make Maya imbalanced on Science (in fact, they already borderline are with their Pyramid which is pretty insane in itself), this is actually a pretty good idea also. I don't mind the ball court, but the Mayans were pretty famous for their observatories, and since Yucatan is pretty much flat as a pancake, that would justify the no-mountain requirement. On the other hand, I guess the science bonus of the pyramid is supposed to reflect these observatories?

 

[jabbawackybacky]

I can be wrong but IMO which unit an unique would replace isn't determined by how effective they were historically, it's determined by the level of technology of that unit's equipment.

Now the Jaguar and Eagle are armed with a club with obsidian shards, obsidian spears and cotton armor. It would be pretty weird to see the elite of your army using these after your civ has discovered discover iron works. The thing is Aztecs didn't discover wheel properly when they had the Jaguar and Eagle. So it's reasonable that the Jaguar replaces a unit from before Wheel, same for the Eagle. How good they were in battle is represented by their stats and abilities, not by what they replace.

Aztecs and Mayans DID have wheels, they just didn't use them for industry or transport. They usually used them for toys, or for religious and calendrical purposes.

Mohawk warriors require iron working, yet in RL the Iroquois did not have iron until the Europeans came either. They "fixed" that by just making the mohawk warrior not require iron. The game isn't historically perfect in that respect and might never really be so perfectly, but it seems to make more sense in the context of the actual Aztec military to make them more powerful than the warrior. Civ 3 or 4 (I can't remember) had the same problem with the Zulus - your fierce Impi hordes would be fairly weak spearmen, which is quite unimpressive for an aggressive military powerhouse.

As for the issue of obsidian and cotton armor - well that's a good point, and making the jaguar require iron to build would be silly, but those obsidian weapons were quite a bit more lethal than your average stone weapon and cotton armor had its own advantages in the Mexican climate.

Not to mention every unique in the game was the backbone of their respective army. If Jaguar or Eagle is moved because it was the backbone and was damn impressive then many other units like Phalanx, Elephant Archer, Hunnic Horse Archer etc would also need to be moved by that logic.

Would these units really need to be moved by this standard though? The Phalanx is era-appropriate for the spearman, and the elephant archer and hunnic horse archer seem ok as they are as well (granted i havent played the huns so i wouldn't know).

 

[mrc2022]

Big changes coming up!

The next update will bring 5 new uniques, 1 unique updated and 1 unique to be replaced, so 7 alterations.

The long announced Austrian Gebirgsjäger, Egyptian Khopesh Swordsman, Persian Clibanarii and Polish Uhlan are finally coming up.
The updated unique is the Eagle as I've previously announced and the rest is a surprise

1st post and 2nd post will be updated soon

 

[meowschwitz]

China

Fire Lance; replaces Musketman
Has a defensive first strike (unit attack this unit takes it's damage before damage to fire lance is calculated and applied)
10% cheaper (China got Musketmen first, if longswordsmen weren't so close I'd simply want them to come to China at an earlier tech)
15% Bonus vs nations with less total techs than China

For Russia I think that you should either look instead for another UB or go for a Kievan Rus' unique unit.

 

[mrc2022]

China

Fire Lance; replaces Musketman
Has a defensive first strike (unit attack this unit takes it's damage before damage to fire lance is calculated and applied)
10% cheaper (China got Musketmen first, if longswordsmen weren't so close I'd simply want them to come to China at an earlier tech)
15% Bonus vs nations with less total techs than China

For Russia I think that you should either look instead for another UB or go for a Kievan Rus' unique unit.

Not sure about that, I'm really into the Junk Ship

As for Russia I'm not sure about that. I was thinking in adding a modern unit

 

[Pheonix56]

Not sure about that, I'm really into the Junk Ship

As for Russia I'm not sure about that. I was thinking in adding a modern unit

Katyusha then? You wouldn't get that many modern Russian units more iconic than the Katyusha.

And maybe some kind of unique settler for the Huns that portrait their nomadic lifestyle?

 

[mrc2022]

It took some time but is up and ready, new upload with six new uniques and one updated.

Let's start with the last.
The Eagle, when first launched it come with a promotion that the Jaguar has, heals if it kills an enemy, well that has been removed and given place to a new promotion. Now if your Eagle dies in battle its experience points are converted into faith.

To the new six, three were more than confirmed, the Khopesh Swordsman, the Clibanarii and the Uhlan.
The Gebirgsjäger has been changed to Landwehr. Still pretty much the same as the Gebirgsjäger but with a bonus defending national lands.

Two remaining and they are Portuguese Casa da Índia and English Playhouse.
The Casa da Índia is a replacement for the East India Company, so a National Wonder, but it's very different from it. It loses the bonus +4 gold and the increase in trade output is cut in half, (instead of giving +4 to owner and +2 to target it will give +2 and +1 respectively).
However the Casa da Índia gives a bonus on naval production and increases your influence over city-states if you have a trade route from the city with Casa da Índia to a city-sate with a Feitoria. The Casa da Índia also requires to be built on coast in a city with Harbor beside the requisite that all cities must have the Market.

And now to England, but hey they already have one unique so what now?
So England is the first of some Civs where this is going to happen, do to the quantity of choices and suggestions I'll be launching a series of add-ons to the mod that can replace an existent unique, or if you chose so to add more than three uniques.
Currently the following add-ons to be launched are:

• English Steam Mill *
• English Redcoat
• Incan Quechua
• Mayan Holkan

* The Steam Mill Add-on will also have a change to switch Steam Power with Industrialization

So now to the English Playhouse, it replaces the Zoo and will give one Writer Specialist and one Great Work of Writing slot.

And for this new upload that's it.

There's also been some changes to what still needs to be done and you can find those changes here

Assyria Royal Guard Swordsman Queued
Babylon Mounted Bowman Chariot Archer Queued
Celts Carpentom Chariot Archer Queued
China Junk Ship Cargo Ship Queued
India Sepoy Rifleman Queued
Indonesia Cetbang Warship Galleass Queued
Russia Streltsy Musketman Queued
Shoshone Tipi new UI Queued
Siam Sala new UI Queued
Zulus Kraal Pasture Queued
Huns Looking for a UB
Ethiopia Looking for a UU
Songhai Looking for a UU

So as you can see only the Huns, Ethiopia and Songhai are missing what to do.
What's new there is the Russian Streltsy and the Siamese Sala.

 

[mrc2022]

So with only 13 items to go I've launched myself into drawing what they would be.
Some are done and some I'm blank towards them. I've also listed what's missing like art and stuff.

Assyria - Royal Guard
Replaces Swordsman
Cost 100
Strength 15
Free promotions: "Near Capital Bonus"
I've a suitable unit model but no remaining art

Babylon - Mounted Bowman
Replaces Chariot Archer
Cost 60
Strength 7
Ranged 10
Free promotions: "No Defensive Terrain Bonuses", "May Not Melee Attack" and "Bonus vs Mounted 25"
Still working on a unit model and no remaining art

Celts - Carpentom
Replaces Chariot Archer
Cost 56
Strength 6
Ranged 8
Free promotions: "Penalty on Defense", "May Not Melee Attack", "Bonus vs Ranged" and "Supension" (moves in terrain as if it's flat)
May have got a fitting unit model, nor remaining art

China - Junk Ship this will be a headache
Replaces Cargo Ship
Turns obsolete with Industrialization
It's strenght is equal to the weakest available ship
At Sailing, Trireme
At Astronomy, Caravel

Ethiopia - ?
What I've on table
Aksumite Javaliner
Replaces Pikeman
Can throw spears

Huns - ?
I've got nothing
I'm most likely facing that this spot will be occupied by a third UU

India - Sepoy
Replaces Rifleman
I've got a unit model
Perhaps something related with the East India Company, like cheaper to buy than to produce

Indonesia - Cetbang Warship
Replaces Galleass
Cost 115
Strength 16
Ranged 20
Range 1
50% bonus against CS
Can Enter Ocean
Moves at half speed in Ocean

Russia - Streltsy
Replaces Musketman
Cost 130
Strength 22
Can be promoted from Workers
No art

Shoshone - Tipi
New Improvement
Can only be built on plains and can't be build next to another Tipi
+1 Culture from tile
Doubles yields for nearby pastures
Units that fight on the tile gain the "Tribal Support" promotion giving a 10% fighting bonus
Leugi is working on the art

Siam - Sala
New Improvement
Must be built on roads and can't be built adjacent to another Sala
+1 Faith and +1 Culture
+5HP healed per turn to units stationed in a Sala
Boubles bonus if next to a river or lake
Leugi is working on the art

Songhai - ?
I've got nothing
All research I've conducted lead me to Mali ties so Skirmisher might be the way to go

Zulus - Kraal
Replaces Pasture
Defensive bonus of 25%
+1 Faith
+1 Food to Cattle
Leugi is working on the art

 

[meowschwitz]

Just a thought about the Huns.

Their "empire" was a rather loose conglomerate assimilation of nomadic people. These people kept their own languages and customs for the most part but were still integrated into the hunnic military. That isn't uncommon, and is far more noteworthy in relation to the Mongols, but could still provide the basis of a UB (although I've wanted to see it represented as a UA for a while now)

Atilla's Court/Levy; replaces Courthouse
More expensive
Removes Science cost increase from captured city
Gives one UU of the conquered Civ when the tech unlocking it is researched

Don't know exactly how historically representative it is as a UB but it's something.

 

[meowschwitz]

For the Songhai, one thing I think could be shown a little better would be their use of war canoes on the Niger river and how religion was ultimately, at least for Askia, the main motivation for expansion since they used Jihads against other African tribes.

A unique Scout "A War Canoe" could move faster along rivers and gain bonuses to make it formidable against civs without your religion

I don't know if I like that though because making a river canoe a land unit replacer is kind of iffy.

I think instead you should just give them another UB as their are plenty of those to choose from since Mali and Songhai society was very similar and their economies based of the same principles of the region.

Imperial Treasury
keeps gold from silver
+1 and +1 from Gold, Salt, and Copper

You could also go with a Caravan/Caravansary replacement that puts faith generation onto trade routes in some way as the Saharan routes that traded that gold, Salt, and Copper were also instrumental in keeping islam dominant in the area. You could maybe change the production to faith in the Treasury to reflect this to make it less of a crazy powerful building.

 

[Pheonix56]

^Then how about giving the Songhai a unique national wonder than produces both wealth and faith and extra gold from gold, salt, copper etc? This way it would be limited thus won't become a crazy powerful building. And there isn't that many unique unique national wonders.

About the Huns - I still say some type of nomad Settlers.

India - Sepoy
Replaces Rifleman
I've got a unit model
Perhaps something related with the East India Company, like cheaper to buy than to produce

The cheaper to buy than to produce trait doesn't quite go with the Sepoy as the Brits recruited them from Indian Sub-Continent's vast, poor demographic. They could just as easily be produced (recruited) from any city pretty easily. The Sepoy are most well known for the Sepoy Rebellion, and they were quite ill treated and considered expandable. Based on that they could get,

1. Increased damage when near another friendly infantry - reflecting their combined effort in the rebellion

2. Damage bonus when attacking cities - again reflecting one of their activities in the rebellion

3. Heals at double rate when in friendly territory - reflecting how they could be reinforced cheaply and quickly

 

[meowschwitz]

^Then how about giving the Songhai a unique national wonder than produces both wealth and faith and extra gold from gold, salt, copper etc? This way it would be limited thus won't become a crazy powerful building. And there isn't that many unique unique national wonders.

About the Huns - I still say some type of nomad Settlers.

The cheaper to buy than to produce trait doesn't quite go with the Sepoy as the Brits recruited them from Indian Sub-Continent's vast, poor demographic. They could just as easily be produced (recruited) from any city pretty easily. The Sepoy are most well known for the Sepoy Rebellion, and they were quite ill treated and considered expandable. Based on that they could get,

1. Increased damage when near another friendly infantry - reflecting their combined effort in the rebellion

2. Damage bonus when attacking cities - again reflecting one of their activities in the rebellion

3. Heals at double rate when in friendly territory - reflecting how they could be reinforced cheaply and quickly

Hah. The National Treasury should already have images in the files too since it was removed in BNW.

 

[inasnapp]

I have a few different ideas for the Huns.
first move their horse archer to a composite bowman replacement and add a mounted javelin thrower. Fights like the Zulu impi perhaps. Otherwise they would benefit from a stable replacement (or compliment).

 

[mrc2022]

Alright let's leave the Huns to a final instance.

Phoenix56 I like your 1st and 3rd ideas for the Sepoy.

Regarding Songhai perhaps a item related to the Sub-saharian trade isn't a bad idea.

Any comments on Ethiopia?

I'd like to see some feedback of the gameplay

 

[meowschwitz]

I'm not sure how you feel about unique national wonders but I think their Churches of Lalibella could make an interesting Grand Temple replacement. +1faith per hill and specialist in the city in addition to the pressure and base faith could be cool.

 

[mrc2022]

I'm not sure how you feel about unique national wonders but I think their Churches of Lalibella could make an interesting Grand Temple replacement. +1faith per hill and specialist in the city in addition to the pressure and base faith could be cool.

I like it. I'll do that and add the Aksumite Javaliner as an add-on.

Regarding the Huns, a stable replacement could be something cool