ComradeDavo
Formerly God
How do you explain Ireland then?
Would you be comfortable with a Mosque built in your neighbourhood?
- Thread starter Stacmon
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ComradeDavo
Formerly God
Well thats exactly what your doing.
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I don't have the slightest idea about that. I made a mistake when including the protestants too.
ComradeDavo
Formerly God
Don't state things at fact if in reality you actually have no idea whether what you are saying is true.I don't have the slightest idea about that. I made a mistake when including the protestants too.
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No they are not Christianity's problems: someone that kills in the name of God is not worth to be called a Christian. These were the political problems of south-western European states in the middle ages, I just pointed out there are Christians who never had that kind of problems, and you started laughing and saying I'm just living up the stereotype.
Mirc
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What's unclear in: I made a mistake when adding the Protestants too. I could not think at the moment of any conflict started by them. But yeah, I assure you I'm right about the Orthodoxes.
ComradeDavo
Formerly God
Well you are....
Funny how one side of a religion always says the other side isn't worthy when it starts killing people in the name of god.
Mirc
Not mIRC!!!
Well you are....
Funny how one side of a religion always says the other side isn't worthy when it starts killing people in the name of god.
This sounds like the other side ever started killing people in the name of God.
ComradeDavo
Formerly God
Russia is Othordox isn't it? What about the wars it started when expanding it's empire in the days of Ivan the Terriable and so forth?
Besides, the thing is that all these different sub groups are still Christian and still represent Christianity. Blaming problems on each other is a sterotypical thign they have always done.
Aptenodytes
Chieftain
No I live in a small mostly Christian some Atheist town and so that would mean people are converting to Islam. (I'm Christian)
What's interesting is that is the same type of comment we hear from Muslims regarding their radicals. They're not real Muslims but in the meantime Sunnis and Shias are killing each other in the name of Allah. Maybe they're in the process of having a reformation too and the Bahais are the only real Muslims.
Yes, but this just proves there were people that did not agree with the church - never was one of them killed, they were thrown out of the church, blamed, etc. But considering Protestantism broke from Catholicism, they had much bigger heresy problems.
Not exactly true - burning at the stake was common.
As an example, Alexios Komnus:No offense intended here, and I don't mean to put you on the defensive - Orthodoxy is too cool to blame. But it's a simple fact that the common response to suppress heresies was persecution, and the Byzantine Empire is infamous for having problems with heresies. As well, it still doesn't take into account the atrocities that Russia did when it conquered the tatar states in the 1500s. That's not necessarily based on religion, but if you go for that defense, the same defense applies toward most colonial conquests with forced conversions.
Reformation for Islam will be hard - qur'an literalism is pretty much fundamental to Islam, unlike Christianity, which prevents certain interpretations of it. As well, an extremely significant hamper is the fact that Islam has historically rejected greek philosophy, and the analogy to theology in Islam is not endorsed. The study of islamic law is different than studying the nature of god.
Mr. Dictator
A Chain-Smoking Fox
you have absolutely no business in other people's faith.
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That was not religiously motivated. Also Germany started WW2, what does this have to do with religion??
Yes the subgroups are still Christian, I repeat: there are some people who never had this kind of policies regarding people of different beliefs, and it annoys the heck out of me when nobody recognizes this!
Orthodoxes and Catholics were not killing each other, Catholics did start "holy wars" against Orthodoxes but that's exactly what I mean: they were the aggressor!
Mirc
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Not exactly true - burning at the stake was common.
No offense intended here, and I don't mean to put you on the defensive - Orthodoxy is too cool to blame. But it's a simple fact that the common response to suppress heresies was persecution, and the Byzantine Empire is infamous for having problems with heresies. As well, it still doesn't take into account the atrocities that Russia did when it conquered the tatar states in the 1500s. That's not necessarily based on religion, but if you go for that defense, the same defense applies toward most colonial conquests with forced conversions.
Yes the Russian thing is not related to religion.
And about burning on the stake: that was a political conflict. Religion was a pretext.
kulade
Deity
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I think the same can be said about all religious conflicts.
Religion is just to get the populous on your side...
ComradeDavo
Formerly God
What does WW2 have to do with thread exactly?
The problem is that if you say that Russification was not related to religion, you have a hard time relating atrocities of Catholicism and Islam with religion, either. Specifically, you wouldn't be able to link any of the New World Conquests with religion - it was used as a pretext, but the main goal was first and foremost power for the mother country - and conversion of the natives was only one step in westernizing them. You would have to say the same for the Islamic conquest of India, too.
The text says it right there - it was a theological controversy. Basil the Physician was killed because he tried to convert Alexius to [wiki]Bogomilism[/wiki] - how is that only a political conflict? That's probably as religious as you get. And as for the heresies themselves, Wikipedia clearly states that the heretics were persecuted, and that includes burning people at stakes. And as I said before, the Byzantine Empire was infamous for having huge problems with heresies.
Look, I really don't mean to hurt your feelings here, but no historical religious sect is free of guilt. More explicitly, no state is free of guilt - people are human. At the same time, to blame historical violence on mostly religion is stupid, as it has pretty much never been the sole factor - even the crusades had some political motivations.
Aptenodytes
Chieftain
Christians want everybody to be Christian so everybody goes to heaven.
That doesn't make it right. That's why I don't try and convert people, because God gave people free will for them to choose whether to have faith in him or not.
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