2 Noob Q's: Gypsy Wags and Gen. Strat. Guide?

[Rhaego]

So I just joined the FF2 bandwagon and after quick a break it has resurrected my lov for all things Civ. Of course I do have some questions though.

First, I love the Balseraphs mainly because I find having a high culture to be so valuable. So I built some gypsy wagons, send them off to rivals' cities, fortify them...and then what? How do I know/see that they are really sucking up some of my rivals' culture and gold? I'd like to measure the value of this tactic.

Secondly, I know there is a wiki out there, but is there a general strat. guide or has everyone learned strategy through trial and error. Any tips on where to look would be most helpful. Thanks in advance!

 

[Miloe]

is there a general strat. guide

ooh thats a good idea i dont think there is one yet

 

[Bringa]

I don't think you can directly see the Gypsie Wagons' effects, unless you look at your gold before and after moving one into an enemy's city. I find them a little bit ineffective against HUMAN players though; I'd like them to be a little different, somehow.

You know where to find the wiki, right? civ4wiki.com, just in case. Don't think there's a general stratguide; that wouldn't make sense for FFH2 in any case. There's plenty of strategy hints for different civs.

 

[Nikis-Knight]

There was a strategy thread for different civ play styles, that was actually incorporated into the "dawn of man" text when you start a game.

 

[katika]

Fall from Heaven wiki. That has a few strategy tips for certain civilizations, but in general you'll have to learn by playing. Usually you'll want to get a religion early, round off the "basic" techs (for improvements and useful buildings) and then specialize down a "line" of techs (melee, recon, archery, etc.) to get access to a powerful unit.

 

[Rhaego]

Thanks y'all. I'm pretty familiar w/Civ 4 strategy I'm just having trouble figuring out how to best implement magic and I am finding out how effective the Balseraphs UUs are. This game seriously rocks, and when I love a new game I immerse myself in it so the more info. I can round up the better. I do still wish there was a way to see how useful the Gypsy wags are though. Thanks!

 

[QES]

Thanks y'all. I'm pretty familiar w/Civ 4 strategy I'm just having trouble figuring out how to best implement magic and I am finding out how effective the Balseraphs UUs are. This game seriously rocks, and when I love a new game I immerse myself in it so the more info. I can round up the better. I do still wish there was a way to see how useful the Gypsy wags are though. Thanks!

I like your name Raego. Say Hi to Danaerys for me.
-Qes

 

[jwin]

If you have a unit that can look into an opponents city screen(like Loki or I believe shadows) you can see the gypsy wagon's effect. I've seen a few places that they are broken, so they hurt your opponents but you are not getting the gold or culture. I'm not sure if that has been fixed or not.

 

[Bringa]

I've actually been thinking about the main differences between FFH and Civ4 vanilla, and if you leave aside magic, I think this is the big one: you MUST specialize on one branch of the military tree. Trying to get all techs before moving on is very dangerous. Also, if you haven't felt that yet, promotions are GOD now. A well-promoted hero can easily destroy an entire civ by itself (based on my experience on Monarch)--but this should change at some point! Hopefully when we get to that point in our AI minimod and teach the AI the value of heroes, so that it doesn't use its own heroes carelessly anymore and so that it will consider actually suiciding a bunch of units if that gets rid of the hero.

 

[marioflag]

Gypsy Wagon will be fixed in 0.22, now they are bugged

 

[Nikis-Knight]

I've actually been thinking about the main differences between FFH and Civ4 vanilla, and if you leave aside magic, I think this is the big one: you MUST specialize on one branch of the military tree.

In vanilla, there really isn't any such thing as specializing. The military is interspersed with all the other techs. In each era, you have a choice of what type of unit to get first, but later era units generally beat early units as much or more than in FfH2.

 

[xanaqui42]

I wrote this up a while ago; unfortunately, I haven't updated it much this year, but it still may be a lot better than nothing.

I just updated it.

 

[xanaqui42]

First, I love the Balseraphs mainly because I find having a high culture to be so valuable. So I built some gypsy wagons, send them off to rivals' cities, fortify them...and then what? How do I know/see that they are really sucking up some of my rivals' culture and gold? I'd like to measure the value of this tactic.

I found Gypsy Wagons to be pretty weak, partially because eventually your opponents are likely to target and destroy them (with Hidden Nationality Units). I mostly used them to build carnivals on new cities or newly captured cities.

 

[Arathlan]

Hmm - I found Gypsy wagons work vs. AI. They actually let you see into the city screen - so if you open up your opponent's city you'll see a 'Gypsy Camp' that leeches 3 gold and 1 culture a turn (I think), although that gold goes straight into your treasury without affecting the +/- figure.

And last I checked they weren't hidden nationality?

 

[slowcar]

they don't work right now. the AI tends to destroy them with hidden nationality units -> not the gipsy wagons are hidden nationality but the attacking units.

Imo they need to be a lot stronger. You can use them on prince-level eventually but on emperor+ every enemy city has an obelisk by the time you can build them. I think they should be able to go after cities with 3 or less culture/turn, i.e. they should be upgraded to grab 3 culture/turn. Or stack with itself so that you can use multiple gipsy wagons on a city.

I loved the concept and it is much fun to play it, i was never able to flip a single city with loki though as i never found cities without any culture.
According to the civs description you should be able to fight culture wars, i never found the possibility to do so and i doubt it will be possible even IF they gypsy wagons do what they are intended to.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

Maybe Gypsy Wagon's (and Loki's) cultural effects should be greater based on how much of certain mana types you have, similar to the way affinity works. That way it wouldn't be overpowered in the early game, but you could make it more effective later on.

 

[Arathlan]

I don't play higher than Noble generally (or the one below prince - whichever that is), and Loki is very useful if you get him out early. If the city hasn't expanded past 9 tiles, it flips easily. And then you have the wonderful option of razing it if you're trying to boost the armaggedon counter... Besides, I thought the most useful thing about the gypsy caravans was the money boost.