2018 NFL Regular Season!!!!

Just got back from the gym. Has Marcus Davenport been playing? If so, how has he been.
 
Light Cleric said:
Honestly I did a little bit, it's such an unbelievable record and watching the whole team celebrate with him got to me
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No fault there. I did too and he's not particularly my quarterback.

But, of course, my motives are sort of jerk motives. I want to see Brees go long enough that Brady NEVER holds any significant records, even for a day.
 
caketastydelish said:
Just got back from the gym. Has Marcus Davenport been playing? If so, how has he been.
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He drilled Alex Smith dead square in the back early on. The announcers are heavy on the 'bash Alex Smith bandwagon' because he has seriously been missing some throws, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he got broken somehow on that play. Davenport has made a lot of plays since that one as well.
 
Smith had an INT, which is unusual for him... the 2xx yds was his normal range.

By contrast... At the beginning of the game when they noted that Brees only had about 200 yrds to get the record, I was thinking... "oh please he gets that in his sleep... hope they've got the champagne on ice already"... which I'm sure they did.
 
Sommerswerd said:
Smith had an INT, which is unusual for him... the 2xx yds was his normal range.

By contrast... At the beginning of the game when they noted that Brees only had about 200 yrds to get the record, I was thinking... "oh please he gets that in his sleep... hope they've got the champagne on ice already"... which I'm sure they did.
Click to expand...

Smith was seriously spraying throws...like sailing way wide. He seemed like there was a catch whenever he tried to torque his body into a throw, and sometimes he would account for it but other times it would surprise him. He got blindsided full blast in the lower back early on and wasn't quite right the rest of the game.

Not that it would have really mattered, since Brees and the Saints were on fire. Just another day; set the all time passing record, throw as many touchdowns as incompletions, hit every receiver on the team at least once to keep everybody happy, and totally demoralize the opposing defense. By the fourth quarter the Washington defense was just going through the motions because nothing they did made any difference at all. If they covered their guy, Brees threw them the ball anyway. If they beat their block, Brees just sidestepped them anyway.
 
Alex Smith needs to go to the Jags... He is exactly what they need. With Smith the Jags could win the Superbowl. They don't need 300-4xx yds and a TD if its gonna cost them 4 INTs, including a pick-6... and they certainly can't do anything with a 1xx yrd performance. They need 2xx yards with 1-2 TD and no INTs, week in, week out. They get that, and they would be unstoppable with that Defense.
 
So, Ajayi is out for the season. The Eagles are restructuring deals to free cap space. But there's nothing but claims from all sides that they haven't contacted the Steelers or even considered contacting the Steelers. Sooooo...if not LeVeon Bell where are they looking? It's not like there's a super bowl caliber running back just waiting for a phone call. Or is there? Jamaal Charles might have one strong season left in the tank. He waited out free agency expecting that some team would need him as a lead back eventually rather than signing as a backup. Are the Eagles the team he was waiting for?

If they have to be looking for someone who is under contract to some team somewhere, as near as I can make out the only serious chip they have to bring to a trade table is Nick Foles. So, who needs a quarterback in the long term, has a super bowl caliber running back, and is in such a poor short term position that they could write off the season by making that trade? Answer...nobody. The teams looking to the future all have a supposed quarterback of the future getting started right about now.

So, gonna have to give up draft pick or picks. Who has a traffic jam in the backfield and might be interested in padding their future with a draft pick extorted from a needy team that feels like they have to plug a hole right now to take their shot while the window is open? Duke Johnson has 17 carries and 17 targets through five games. To say that he is not being used enough to justify his 15 million dollar contract is a big understatement.

I'm thinking Johnson with his three year contract might be the better solution if the price can be made right with Cleveland. The Eagles have done a lot of 'plug and play' at RB since they dealt Shady McCoy, but haven't had anyone on an extended contract that looked like a bell cow type guy who would last past the season. Charles would be another ship of that sort passing in the night, and that would be okay, but Johnson is better.

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On the LeVeon Bell front, I just heard an aspect of that which had escaped me. Among the questions about 'if someone trades for him is he just a rental?' something got lost. Obviously, his intention to be a free agent at the end of the season and the fact that no one can negotiate a long term deal until then is a scary combination for any team that trades for him.

He isn't playing for the Steelers, and it seems simple to say 'who can blame him after the Steelers have jerked him around so badly.' But as Earl Thomas could certainly explain, the big issue is that he has to get to free agency without getting hurt. He's no less likely to get hurt playing for someone else than he is playing for the Steelers. So, even as a rental for the season would he play? Maybe the Eagles could dangle 'we can win a super bowl here' in front of him as a motive, but that's a hard question to answer.
 
The thing about Bell is that his running style requires the highest caliber of offensive linemen and blocking schemes. He gets a ton of yards and fantasy points, but how "good" he actually is remains a bit of a question mark at least in my mind. Maybe that is part of why the Steelers won't pay him and nobody is beating down the door to trade for him.

Now it could be that he just really hits the film really hard and studies every detail of the matchups his blockers are facing, so that he can anticipate what gaps will open up, and already has a plan for how he will attack each type run even before the game starts... but it may be that he's doing a lot of it on instinct, muscle memory, and just improvising/adapting to each game situation in real time.

If he's studying every detail of film and player tendencies, matchups, etc., like a Peyton Manning, then maybe his running style will be portable to any team... but if he's out there improving and acting on instinct like Troy Palomalu did alot... I don't know...

The 49ers need a QB AND a running back... but they don't have much to trade besides picks. They certainly don't want to gut their defense.
 
The 49ers need a QB and a running back if they think they are going to turn their 1-4 start into something other than a very high draft position. But they actually have their designated QB and their designated running back under contract already, just on IR. They have nothing to trade and nothing to trade for, and 49er fans just need to buckle up and take another white water raft ride down the toilet.

Bell can run, and he can catch. That's portable and can be plugged in wherever he lands. If someone signs him and then sets out to play a 'downhill run, hit the hole' style with the guy who is renowned for his patience and his ability to lurk behind the line waiting for the hole to clear that's on them. I'm reminded of the Herschel Walker trade. Everyone talks about how the Vikings gave up way to much for Walker who promptly fell off a cliff from his previously astonishing production. The reality is that the Vikings got a supreme downhill runner who had lined up seven yards deep and hit holes when they were there at full blast, and blasted holes when they weren't there by just plowing full speed into the back of a lineman and blowing him through the defense. The Vikings looked at this totally proven superstar that they had traded the farm for and said "yeah, we don't do that here."
 
Bell will be starting week 8 for the Steelers. He will report during their bye week so he can get paid with little risk of getting hurt.
 
rah said:
Bell will be starting week 8 for the Steelers. He will report during their bye week so he can get paid with little risk of getting hurt.
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He will report, for sure, because he needs credit for the year to be eligible as a free agent. That doesn't mean that he will play though. Earl Thomas clearly demonstrated that in Bell's situation the PUP list is where he needs to be.
 
caketastydelish said:
I don't think ETIII got hurt on purpose.
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Definitely not. That's far from the point. Thomas is going to free agency. He wants a four year deal. How much do you think the "coming off a broken leg" is going to cost him? Ten million dollars? Twenty? He's the second player in two years that held out, then came in and played on the "oh, you come in first and then we'll talk" plan, and then left on a cart with no contract. At least he will play again, so it didn't cost him everything. But the lesson is pretty clear at this point.

When Bell comes in I find it hard to believe that he is going to be willing to risk his entire future just to play a handful of games "for the team," no matter who that team might be.
 
@tim: tbh I think bell is overrated. His style of running game is heavily dependent on a great offensive line which he won’t get most places.

Not saying he isn’t useful everywhere but teams shouldn’t pay a lot for him unless they have great run blocking o-line.
 
caketastydelish said:
@tim: tbh I think bell is overrated. His style of running game is heavily dependent on a great offensive line which he won’t get most places.

Not saying he isn’t useful everywhere but teams shouldn’t pay a lot for him unless they have great run blocking o-line.
Click to expand...

Well, over rated isn't always the same thing. There's ability, and there's hype. A guy can be over rated because he doesn't really have much ability, but even a guy with tremendous ability can be over rated if there is just too much hype. Bell has plenty of talent, but people are talking about him like he's Walter Payton plus...so, yeah, over rated.

The biggest asset he has, which is what he wants to get paid for, is that he can be in the huddle and force the defense into a run stop personnel package, then break the huddle as a wide receiver that no linebacker and very few safeties can cover. So he doesn't want to get paid like a running back, he wants to get paid wide receiver money. On some level that does seem reasonable, but Pittsburgh can't afford that with what they already have to pay Antonio Brown and Ben Rothlisberger. Maybe some team can, and will, but he has to make it to free agency healthy to find out.

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Meanwhile, today's interesting question: Will Drew Brees go down as the greatest free agent signing of all time? I say "will he" rather than "is he," because to be reasonable in "all time" discussions I normally avoid talking about active players. We don't know what will become of the Minnesota Vikings during the reign of Captain Kirk, so we could say "not if Kirk Cousins is going to bring eight championships to Minnesota" and all sorts of other speculative nonsense.

Of course, we could speculate about Brees, who I think has more than a couple years left in the tank, but even just going on what he has done so far I think he is right there. Even if he doesn't accomplish much of anything else the only guy I've heard mentioned that I think can give him a run for it is Reggie White. No one else signed as a free agent can be pointed out so clearly for having completely reversed the fortunes of a franchise. My only hesitation is that I know it would be easy to let 'quarterback bias' creep in and make me sell White short.

Anybody inclined to convince me one way or the other? Got any other candidates?
 
Timsup2nothin said:
Well, over rated isn't always the same thing. There's ability, and there's hype. A guy can be over rated because he doesn't really have much ability, but even a guy with tremendous ability can be over rated if there is just too much hype. Bell has plenty of talent, but people are talking about him like he's Walter Payton plus...so, yeah, over rated.

The biggest asset he has, which is what he wants to get paid for, is that he can be in the huddle and force the defense into a run stop personnel package, then break the huddle as a wide receiver that no linebacker and very few safeties can cover. So he doesn't want to get paid like a running back, he wants to get paid wide receiver money. On some level that does seem reasonable, but Pittsburgh can't afford that with what they already have to pay Antonio Brown and Ben Rothlisberger. Maybe some team can, and will, but he has to make it to free agency healthy to find out.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Meanwhile, today's interesting question: Will Drew Brees go down as the greatest free agent signing of all time? I say "will he" rather than "is he," because to be reasonable in "all time" discussions I normally avoid talking about active players. We don't know what will become of the Minnesota Vikings during the reign of Captain Kirk, so we could say "not if Kirk Cousins is going to bring eight championships to Minnesota" and all sorts of other speculative nonsense.

Of course, we could speculate about Brees, who I think has more than a couple years left in the tank, but even just going on what he has done so far I think he is right there. Even if he doesn't accomplish much of anything else the only guy I've heard mentioned that I think can give him a run for it is Reggie White. No one else signed as a free agent can be pointed out so clearly for having completely reversed the fortunes of a franchise. My only hesitation is that I know it would be easy to let 'quarterback bias' creep in and make me sell White short.

Anybody inclined to convince me one way or the other? Got any other candidates?
Click to expand...
I'm not saying that these candidates are "better" than Reggie White or Drew Brees in this category but they are worth mentioning... First of all I'd like to shamelessly homer for the 49ers and mention Neon Deion Sanders as a franchise saver... granted, the 49ers were already pretty good when he came onboard, but he sustained them, turning what would have been post Montana mediocrity into continued viability. I can only hope the Pats will be as lucky.

The next on my list is a cheat because its two guys... Shannon Sharpe and Rod Woodson to the Ravens... there's no denying that it was this duo that helped cement their status as a solid franchise and Superbowl contender. Rod Woodson to the Packers is another that I think deserves franchise-rescuing honors... one more that isn't necessarily a "franchise saver" as much as a (successful) last ditch effort to keep the franchise relevant is Kurt Warner to the Cardinals. One more name I'd add is Adam Vinatieri to the Pats... sure hes a kicker but he made a profound impact.

Finally... Tim... No love for Rich Gannon?
 
Sommerswerd said:
I'm not saying that these candidates are "better" than Reggie White or Drew Brees in this category but they are worth mentioning... First of all I'd like to shamelessly homer for the 49ers and mention Neon Deion Sanders as a franchise saver... granted, the 49ers were already pretty good when he came onboard, but he sustained them, turning what would have been post Montana mediocrity into continued viability. I can only hope the Pats will be as lucky.

The next on my list is a cheat because its two guys... Shannon Sharpe and Rod Woodson to the Ravens... there's no denying that it was this duo that helped cement their status as a solid franchise and Superbowl contender. Rod Woodson to the Packers is another that I think deserves franchise-rescuing honors... one more that isn't necessarily a "franchise saver" as much as a (successful) last ditch effort to keep the franchise relevant is Kurt Warner to the Cardinals. One more name I'd add is Adam Vinatieri to the Pats... sure hes a kicker but he made a profound impact.

Finally... Tim... No love for Rich Gannon?
Click to expand...

Gannon is a good mention. I just never gave him much credit for anything and still consider him 'just another journeyman that hit a bright spot.'

Sanders and some others you mentioned there are, IMO, disqualified as mercenaries. I think that a truly great free agent signing has to be someone that you sign and make a part of something that lasts, not just a hired gun that brings a moment of success and then moves on.
 
If the criteria is that the FA has to have an impact for many seasons, then there isn't much past Reggie and Drew.
Mack might be, but it will be a while before that question is answered.
 
Serutan said:
If the criteria is that the FA has to have an impact for many seasons, then there isn't much past Reggie and Drew.
Mack might be, but it will be a while before that question is answered.
Click to expand...

Mack wasn't a free agent.

Many seasons may seem unreasonable, and White only played six seasons in Green Bay. But if we submit Deion Sanders as a candidate we then have to ask "which signing?" I'd say that Dallas did a better job of signing him than the 49ers did with their one year wonder...maybe. Signed and then released halfway through the contract because the salary cap couldn't bear the weight doesn't seem very good either.

So the difference between signing Sanders and signing Reggie White is more than just longevity. Signing Sanders got Dallas a championship they may very well have gotten anyway, but set them up for their subsequent collapse into salary cap purgatory. Signing Reggie White transformed Green Bay into a destination to be considered by future free agents, which helped build the team into a contender and eventually into a champion. Admittedly, acquiring Brett Favre had a lot to do with that too. It also came at a critical time in team history, since the Packers were facing a grim financial reality with Lambeau Field falling into disrepair and their contract to split games between there and Milwaukee coming to a bitter end they needed to do a stock issue (their community ownership plan is unique) and selling stock in a franchise with their most recent successes buried under 25 years of failure wasn't going to go well.
 
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