• Civilization 7 has been announced. For more info please check the forum here .

4-point Victory Guide

fortytwo

Chieftain
Joined
Mar 12, 2005
Messages
64
(I posted this in the Strategy forum, so if this is inappropriate for this forum, please simply delete it.)

The objective of this guide is to give good, essential information without prescribing an EXACT formula for what to do at any given time. You can use this for any game type, any world type, any size map, etc. Again, this is mostly essential or easily-overlooked information that can make-or-break a game.


4 POINT GUIDE TO VICTORY.


1. CITY PLACEMENT AND MANAGEMENT.

Be aware of this pattern:

Code:
 XXX 
XXXXX
XXXXX
XXXXX
 XXX

(A) DO NOT OVERLAP. If you fear a city may grow too fast, don't worry, that's what the slavery/nationalism civic is for. Build the National Epic and cater to farming/commerce.

(B) KNOW YOUR RESOURCES AND SPECIALIZE CITIES. By far the best bonuses are health bonuses because it allows your cities to grow bigger than they could otherwise, thus support more specialists. Be sure your city will work a resource, even if it means an otherwise undesirable location. Some resources add $$, that is your commerce-specialized city. Don't sweat anything but commerce buildings and merchant specialists. Have Bronze/Iron and stone/marble nearby? Try to settle a city that can work both, but make sure it will also have the food to support, coastal squares are helpful for food with lighthouse. Hello Hammer City! Have Great People Prophets join this city.

(C) MAKE A STAR. Probably the most crucial aspect of the game. Cities in a 'star' formation or ring around the capital will have, at worst, at -5 upkeep without a courthouse. If your start location prohibits this because of coastline, well, get ready for a big challenge!

(D) SQUISH YOUR OPPONENTS BORDERS. They'd do the same to you! This gives you a good reason to make a culture-specialized city. You might not get a conversion, but you will have an easy means to stage a war from the border of this city. Don't bother squishing their capital unless you intend to take it. It will squish you.

2. RELIGION.

(A) FOUNDING. If you found an early religion, spread it to peaceful or weaker neighbors to discourage war. This allows you to minimally protect bordering cities with this neighbor. Free Religion is a great civic for making friends.

(B) CONVERTING. If you don't found, convert to the relgion of the peaceful or otherwise weaker neighbor. This is especially difficult if they never spread it to your civ. Be patient. Consider Taoism or Islam later for the eventual commerce bonus. If you have an aggressive neighbor, or powerful neighbor, don't bother converting to their religion. You will simply have to take them out.

(C) RELIGIOUS WONDER. If you get the special wonder for a founded religion, have a city dedicated to churning out missionaries and spreading it absolutely everywhere. +1 gold for every city with it. Make the city with this wonder a commerce specialized city.


3. WAR.


(A) KNOW THE BIGGEST THREATS. An aggressive or likely-to-win-the-game neighbor (Mansu, Asoka, somebody with lots of land) should be your first target for war, and it should take place prior to Machinary. Don't bother with the little guys, as easy as they are to take out. War is just too time consuming to be pointless. It goes without saying, don't invade Civs that are not bordering you.

(B) KNOW YOUR COMBAT ODDS. Catapults are essential to evening the odds. It is easy to know what you will go up against before the war. Before you've even decided/found out who you will fight, give every unit City Raider upgrades. If you are growing a big army you shouldn't have to worry about being invaded yourself. Once you know your opponents units, you may find you do not want a diversified army after all. Going against Archers/Bowmen? Upgrade against arrow units. Melee units? Upgrade vs. Melee and remember that axemen are better than just about every other unit against melee for their era. Opponent has horses? Can you pillage them easily? Otherwise, spearmen. Pillaging is mostly pointless.

(C) STACK UNITS. Never fight multiple fronts until you've clearly anihilated your enemy. Stack stack stack!

(D) KNOW WHERE TO BEGIN. Sometimes the easy-pickin's cities are not best. Cripple your opponent by taking their capital first, then clean up the little cities. If the city has too much border with another Civ, or will overlap your own, consider destroying it. Stage your attacks from forest, if beside a city. Never have to cross a river to attack a city. Attack fast! A good time to begin, if you are cautious, is right after they discover Iron Working because they will still need 8 turns to get their Iron resource, or to at least start building such units.

(E) KNOW WHEN TO DECLARE PEACE. Cripple an opponent down to 1-3 cities to prevent them from thinking about future retaliation, which is just annoying. With 1-3 cities they can operate as a pretty nice buffer to other invasionary forces. Make sure you leave cities forming a buffer! Give them resources and techs that will allow them to defend their tiny empire. Convince them to stop trading with aggressive Civs. Aggressive neighbors will usually destroy themselves and be non-factor by late in the game.

4. VICTORY TYPE.

(A) CONQUEST. If you build or take a city with the Pyramids, consider a conquest victory. You may have to rush (Universal Sufferage) courthouses, otherwise you'll stick with Police State the whole game. Commit to this Victory type totally, there may be no going back, and no reason to slow down. After Cavalry, your priority is Communism and State Property, military wonders. Otherwise just build military units. Know what civs you will have to take and which can remain in order to give you 65% land. Enlist others in your war effort against those you need for victory.

(B) SPACE RACE. If there are only a few Civs as tech leaders and/or they are not trading techs, the Space Race could be out of reach, don't let this catch you off guard, you could lose a Time Victory. Don't be too eager to get to Rocketry. You will need a powered factory before you even begin the Apollo Project. Take your time and consider Environmentalism for the health bonus. You'll need it anyway. Iron Works is essential, as is turning farms/cities to workshops and Windmills to mines.

(C) CULTURE. Forget about it unless Creative, determined, and sucessful at building ALL the culture wonders. Know that a culture victory comes VERY late in the game, most likley. Using the culture slider essentially destroys your odds at a Space Race Victory.

(D) DIPLOMACY. If your conquest or culture victory fell short and you'd just rather not win the Space Race, which you can easily do with a large empire and proper city specializing, consider rushing the UN. You'll have the lion's share of votes. You can then bribe other CIVs into voting for you, but your biggest opponent will just vote for themselves. It's a tough victory.

_____

Enjoy and post your feedback!
 
Yes! Civ is all about life, the universe and everything!

I've tested this on Prince and I win everytime. I've been ratcheting up the challenge, small map, 7 AI opponents, and I still come out on top. I can see where on a large map maintaining a world's-largest empire can be counter-productive. But then again, even with few AI opponents, I see no deficit to holding the largest amount of land. You have the best odds of holding all the resources, and you have more flexibility to specialize cities.
 
It is always nice to read a guide. Many good points! Got a few things, though:

-- (A) DO NOT OVERLAP

Actually AIs overlap tiles all the time, and they still manage to do pretty well. The key difference is not to avoid or purposely overlap, but to make the best use of tiles as population grows. The experienced players know what a city will look like at pop 1-20, and have plans for the exact sequence of tiles to improve on. The difference of 4 x pop 15 cities and 3 x pop 20 cities isn't that large, plus sometimes a CREATIVE AI (man I hate them) will pop a city within your holes, even if it overlaps with your cities like hell.

-- (C) MAKE A STAR. Probably the most crucial aspect of the game.

Generally speaking, the upkeep due to distance is about the same as the upkeep due to city number. And the sum of them is about the same as your Civic upkeep. Making a good choice of capital saves you some $ in 1/4 of your total upkeep cost. It is not that large. The upkeep money you see on the city info screen is adjusted by population size, so a distant city with a larger population will look horrible.

-- (D) SQUISH YOUR OPPONENTS BORDERS.

I think military > culture. Your existing border is going to become your inland city sooner or later, so I would develop it into whatever its terrain fits. However, if you are aiming for culture victory or want to play peace (almost impossible for Emperor and above), then cultural border cities will be an excellent idea. A Great Aritist accompany a wipe-out action is never wasted.

-- (A) FOUNDING. If you found an early religion, spread it to peaceful or weaker neighbors to discourage war.

I agree with the "weaker" part, but disagree with the "peacful" part. A "weak but aggressive" mate is the ideal friend. Peaceful neighbors will never attack you, and they usually tech very much, so the more you trade with them, or bribe them to go after others, your situation worsen. On the other hand, aggressive neighbors who are weak (fall behind in tech) can be bribed to attack tech runners with no bad consequences.

-- (B) CONVERTING. If you don't found, convert to the relgion of the peaceful or otherwise weaker neighbor.

Again, it is usually better to make friend with the aggressive but weak Civ and bribe them to go after others. If there are more than one potential enemies and I am not powerful enough, usually I convert to the stronger side, and do whatever I can to block/kill off the weaker side. This will give me a longer peace time to develop.

-- (C) RELIGIOUS WONDER. If you get the special wonder for a founded religion, have a city dedicated to churning out missionaries...

At any time you can have 3 missionaries of the same religion in the world, so you can have 2 cities training missionaries. No. 1 is walking to his destination, and No. 2 and 3 still being trained.

-- (A) KNOW THE BIGGEST THREATS. ..., and it should take place prior to Machinary.

Not in every game you have the oppurtunity to wipe your biggest threat out that early. However, if you grab machinery + civil service first, your axeman can be instantly promoted to maceman. Plus all the catapults and elephants (anti-horse archer) you were making in the meantime, you will have a good time wiping out a Civ or two.

--- (E) KNOW WHEN TO DECLARE PEACE. Cripple an opponent down to 1-3 cities to prevent them from thinking about future retaliation...

I don't think it is always a good idea to leave your enemy one city or two. Sooner or later you will have to kill them, and give their friends another "You declared war on our friend!" -1 modifier. If you really want a buffer, wipe out the opponent, and "give" the last cities you capture to a low-power friend you have in a distant land. Your friend may lose the city to a neighbor due to culture, though. If you can forsee this (a neighbor city with a huge culture), then just raze it to ashes. :) The best buffer is made through bribes... make your neighbors busy so they don't even bother looking at you. :cool:
 
fortytwo said:
(A) An aggressive or likely-to-win-the-game neighbor (Mansu, Asoka, somebody with lots of land)

Pillaging is mostly pointless.

(C) STACK UNITS. Never fight multiple fronts until you've clearly anihilated your enemy. Stack stack stack!

(C) CULTURE. Forget about it unless Creative, determined, and sucessful at building ALL the culture wonders.
So this is a satire right?
 
probably not but especially the thing bout cultural victory is wrong. Neither a creative civ is needed, nor are the cultural wonders particulary important - well spread multiple religions is the way to go.
 
I play Prince level... your city placement suggestions would have been absolutely awful for me in the game I am playing right now, had I founded cities in a star formation I would have had no horses or copper and the AI on my continent (Asoka) would have had a great chance to establish himself as the stronger.

Early city placement should be based on:

a) gaining a key military resource - copper, iron, or horses
b) denying the same to opponents
c) claiming land
 
ownedbyakorat said:
Early city placement should be based on:

a) gaining a key military resource - copper, iron, or horses
b) denying the same to opponents
c) claiming land

I second this. Don't get me wrong, fortytwo's points are pretty good, but if you go for the star formation and forsake that lovely iron mine, then you are royally in HUGE trouble.
 
Drakonik said:
I second this. Don't get me wrong, fortytwo's points are pretty good, but if you go for the star formation and forsake that lovely iron mine, then you are royally in HUGE trouble.

I was not implying that you would fit them like puzzle pieces, certainly skip over the desert, look to work as many bonus tiles as possible. It's just that the maintenace savings are critical.
 
Lord Chambers said:
So this is a satire right?

Originally Posted by fortytwo
(A) An aggressive or likely-to-win-the-game neighbor (Mansu, Asoka, somebody with lots of land)

Pillaging is mostly pointless.

(C) STACK UNITS. Never fight multiple fronts until you've clearly anihilated your enemy. Stack stack stack!

(C) CULTURE. Forget about it unless Creative, determined, and sucessful at building ALL the culture wonders.

O.k. I'll qualify these remarks.

Pick Mansu or Asoka to wipe out first. They tend to get ahead in technology because they skimp on military.

Pillaging any old tile appears pointless to me. Of course you want to take our their iron or their horses, but not if it means fighting your way deep into their territory.

There are some modifications from CIV3 to CIV4 that discourage the unit stack, but it is still the best military strategy.

About the Culture Victory - sure you could specialize three cities, dedicate them to building culture enhancing buildings. Depending on the total size of your empire, and I play on the small map, about 7-10 cities, that may or may not be a big comittment. As I have experienced it, even with the Sistine Chapel, even with Creative Leader Trait, and even if you have 4-5 religions with all the culture-boosting buildings, you won't get a city generating 300+ culture per turn until the 19th century.

The point is, unlike other victory conditions, you have no other incentive to build culture in cities that could otherwise build something else, except for the Culture Victory. Converting cities by culture is about all you get as a bonus. And then, with all the artists, you get Great Artist Great People, their only use is for building culture.
 
The point is, unlike other victory conditions, you have no other incentive to build culture in cities that could otherwise build something else, except for the Culture Victory. Converting cities by culture is about all you get as a bonus. And then, with all the artists, you get Great Artist Great People, their only use is for building culture.
I have to disagree about no incentive for culture...a city of mine getting flipped because of inferior culture is PLENTY of incentive for some cultural improvements.
 
netbard said:
I have to disagree about no incentive for culture...a city of mine getting flipped because of inferior culture is PLENTY of incentive for some cultural improvements.
I second that - of course I don't pursue temples, but libraries + monasteries + universities give culture "on the way" to science. Also, if you ever happen to have a border with a creative civ, you will see that no culture buildings = no tiles for the city = no city at the end. If I can take him out I don't care (borders will move in a while), but if I can't (for example, because I am busy with another guy at the other end, or because I am already so expanded that economy will never recover) I never disregard the culture for the border cities.
 
Building a University and a monastary will certainly give you a small science bonus. But it will do nothing to win a culture victory.

I just lost tonight on Monarch, about 15 or 20 turns shy. I had three cities with five religions and five monastaries. After Mass Media I turned culture to 100% after rushing the Hermitage, Rock and Roll, Hollywood.

Went to Caste System just to get all the artists.

Had about 600-700 culture per turn, per city. Still not enough.
 
I think if you have at least 3/4 religions and a good 9+ to 14 cities on your island and you get the right wonders early on i see no problem with a culture win on monarchy. Just keep the military up to par. I have done 2 cultural wins on monarch. I agree on liberalism and also dont develop scientific methods. On both games the other civs lagged in technology.

Start as aggressive wipe out your rivals steal all the holy cities then switch about 1300ad to religion with your large empire. Develop temples and missionaries in cities till you reach magic 9 of each religion with nine temples. Worth using slavery to speed up some of the temples or cathedrals if culture cities run out of build items. By this stage hopefully you will have 3-4+ or so great artists by luck or planned to help the third culture city if lagging. Any city that isnt required to build a temple i have build units to help defend. Well pointless building universities or aqueducts waste of gold for a culture win if not in your 3 culture cities.

Biggest question for me is when to switch to cultural win from conquest. Also what unit do you last develop before the switch? Will Musketeers do the job? Not tried a full blown conquest yet. On my to do list!! :lol:

Worst scenario is a high tech AI civ or you fall behind on military units badly and someone invades in large numbers.

I dont see a cultural win as impossible. Not sure about on Emperor yet but this is covered elsewhere.
 
Haven't you guys read the thread "a strategy for consistent cultural wins on monarch"? Works a treat, at least on Prince which is the level I play on. Basically, you stop worrying about techs as soon as you have riflemen, emancipation and universal sufferage. You don't need any wonders and it seems to work for any civ traits. I find it much easier to get a cultural win than any other type of win, and expect I would be able to get a cultural win on monarch whereas I'm pretty sure I'd lose horribly going for, say, a space race victory at that level as I only win about 50 % of my space race games on Prince.
 
No, you don't need creative civs to get Cultural victory... I'm about to get one with Gandhi.
 
Here is my summary of benefits and diffiulties of Victory Conditions:

1. CULTURAL -

GOOD: Easiest to get, because AI isn't likely to go for it.

GOOD: Doesn't require a huge empire.

BAD: You have to stop research all together at an early time, making you vulnerable to attack by advanced military. Stop researching at Rifling/Democracy.

BAD: You must comit to this early on and spread several religions quickly. Once you've comitted to this course, you can't change your Victory Condition strategy, except for Time or Diplomatic.

2. SPACE RACE:

GOOD: Versatile. You can change up Victory strategy to Domination, Diplomatic, or Score.

GOOD: An advanced military is a good defense against attack.

BAD: Requires a somewhat large empire to build parts.

BAD: Highly competitive with AI, who gets late-game science bonus on high difficulty levels.

3. Domination/Elimination:


GOOD: AI isn't as good as a human when it comes to sensible battle strategy. They'll throw their entire army at your most obvious city to attack.

GOOD: Leads to a big empire, plenty of resources.

BAD: Must comitt to this early on, stop research at Cavalry.

BAD: High maintenace and long, tedious wars. 66% is a lot of land.

DIPLOMATIC:


Good: With a large empire, you can't technically lose.

Bad: The AI usually hates you more than other AIs, getting votes is hard.

Bad: Requires large empire for swing votes.
 
Top Bottom