[Sponsored] (7-VT) Supply Cap Rework

[Agiwan]

I love the new empire size modifier addition !

 

[Phosphoraptor]

My biggest concern is taking away coastal supply bonus. My current game had 8 cities by medieval fighting a 5 city AI, and even after building all supply buildings I was stretching my supply thin by having enough navy to bombard their coastal cities, and having enough army to eventually siege their inland capital. This particular change may make it difficult or even not viable to siege coastal cities in the early game on higher difficulties.

I think forcing coastal players to pick between land or sea is not great since they can face a strong opponent from either side (e.g shaka neighbour from land or a final boss england from sea) and get screwed when they dont “guess” the right one or have to face one type after the other.

 

[azum4roll]

Increasing supply early in this case doesn't help. You're facing two civs with their own full supply, so it's a 1v2 regardless.

The coastal supply is meant for you to have the crucial navy to defend yourself, not enough to start another war.

 

[Tekamthi]

Maybe the supply could be used independently for naval and land -- the balance between the two was the crux of the reasoning to make the naval buildings give supply in the first place iirc, so let's just silo them completely

So say you have 10 supply, you can build 10 land AND 10 naval. If you build 11 land and 11 naval you're same as 2 units over as far as current penalties go, but otherwise each counter works independently

 

[azum4roll]

Could be good, if ships and land units don't attack each other.

 

[CppMaster]

Could be good, if ships and land units don't attack each other.

That doesn't make much sense, though

 

[Stalker0]

I completed my promised example above: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/7-115-supply-cap-rework.689244/#post-16593032

 

[Tekamthi]

I think this proposal is worth voting for -- but it all feels like deja vu. We did this more supply/less supply stuff at least once before, and the problem that arose then seems like it will be the same now. Maintaining navy and land army requires x supply, but for a civ that only needs land army, x is far too much

 

[CppMaster]

Why is that a problem, though? It's not required to build army to the limit if you don't need it.

 

[Tekamthi]

Why is that a problem, though

It exacerbates the unit-on-every-tile logjams

I haven't yet settled in my mind what a truly better model will be, just continuing the brainstorm-line of thinking from other threads. I'm open to the proposal here though it strikes me as a first step not a full fix to supply and overcrowding woes.

I do feel your concern though that any flat reduction could make it difficult to maintain both Navy and army. The more I reflect on this topic the more I feel we need some other parallel constraint to supply

 

[azum4roll]

You lose a lot for not having any coastal city, including the inability to stop a runaway on the other continent.

 

[Zuizgond]

Is there any way to show how many supply each city provide? or is there a mod that provides this info?

Always had difficulties to assess how many supply and golden age points cities provide.

 

[Recursive]

I sponsor this.

 

[azum4roll]

Is there any way to show how many supply each city provide?

Not viable, because supply from each cities are first added up, then divided and rounded down.

 

[Recursive]

Proposal vetoed, asterisk asterisk. Due to the opaqueness of the internal calculations and the difficulty for users in understanding what they would be voting on, on the advice of the MAGI I will develop this as a modmod prior to the end of the Implementation Phase and it will be voted on for integration in Session #8.

 

[Recursive]

Timestamp post to arrange all the threads in a neat order.