750AD - Golden Age, or discover Taoism?

[Cadmus]

Howdy all; I just alt-tabbed from my game and signed up here because I don't know what to do

It's 750AD, I am Stalin, standard fractal map, on Noble (which I am 0-2 in so far, and just purchased Warlords). I am not at war with anyone or close to it, I have a good economy going and am leading in points. I have a great artist and a great prophet, and through those two I could either start a Golden Age (most of my building are making courthouses and banks), or discover Taoism through Philosophy, and research Theology (although Christianity was just discovered). So, what would be best? How effective is a Golden Age at this point in the game?

Thanks!

 

[carl corey]

A golden age is pretty much useless at that point in the game. It boosts your economy and production, but do you have enough stuff to be boosted by it? Remember, a Golden Age used now means that the next one will use 3 Great Persons. You might want to reserve use for a Golden Age if you're going for a Space Race for example.

As for how to use the GP and the GA. What can each of them research at this point? If I understood you correctly, the GA gets Philosophy and the GP Theology?

Anyway, do you have any religion's holy city? If so you could build a shrine in it with your GP.

As for the GA, either use it for research, depending on what it gives you. If it's Philosophy you can switch to Pacifism to get even more Great Persons that you don't know that to do with. Or use him for a cultural bomb if you can really benefit from a certain city's expansion. If neither thing is interesting, consider saving it for later use.

 

[Cadmus]

Good to know about the Golden Age, and the next one requiring 3 GP. Very good to know. I will discover Philosophy with the GA, and Theology with the GP. I already placed my Confucianism holy building in the holy city a while back.

Thanks for the advice!

 

[MrCynical]

Golden Ages I generally find to be a poor use of great people except in the very late phases of the game. A well placed culture bomb or a couple of superspecialists would be a better use of them at this stage, even if there aren't any good possibilities on the hurry tech front.

 

[carl corey]

Well then, there's no reason to research Theology, that won't give you Christianity. Discovering Philosophy and founding Taoism means you can use the GP to found the Taoist shrine instead. But you'll also have to spread that religion too if you really want to make use of it. I guess this would be the most interesting path.

By the way, welcome to civfanatics! I'm quite new here too, but I've found lots of interesting stuff already.

 

[Cadmus]

Well then, there's no reason to research Theology, that won't give you Christianity. Discovering Philosophy and founding Taoism means you can use the GP to found the Taoist shrine instead. But you'll also have to spread that religion too if you really want to make use of it. I guess this would be the most interesting path.

By the way, welcome to civfanatics! I'm quite new here too, but I've found lots of interesting stuff already.

Thank you! And yes, I totally missed your point about making the Taoist shrine with the prophet. That is what I have done. Now, I have a bit of a follow-up question about religion - I have discovered both Confucianism and Taoism, with their respective shrines, so now the main benefit of that is making money by having more cities have both of those religions? Does it matter what state religion you are, or my rivals are, as far as me making money off my religion? The rest of the world seems to be Hindu at this point (800 AD), so I guess I should just spread my two religions around my cities?

 

[Toshiro126]

Hello, Cadmus. Welcome to the Forums. Good group of people on here. Taught me a lot about the game.

You can make money of the shrine even if it isn't your state religion. At the very least spread Taoism (and Christianity if you discover that too) to all your cities. The more income the better.

I've found it's worthwhile to spread your religion around the globe. You will make more money and if a civ has your religion in enough of his cities, you can sometimes convince them to convert to your side.

Just be aware of two things when sending missionaries to other cities:

1) if they are using the Theocracy civic, your missionary won't work. Theocracy prevents any non-state relgions from spreading.

2) the more religions a city has, the harder it will be to spread your religion there. if a city has 2 or less, it should be successful. Once a city has 3 or 4 religions, there is a higher rate of your missionary failing. So you may have to send multiple missionaries to those cities for your religion to be spread succesfully.

Good luck!

 

[Welnic]

Thank you! And yes, I totally missed your point about making the Taoist shrine with the prophet. That is what I have done. Now, I have a bit of a follow-up question about religion - I have discovered both Confucianism and Taoism, with their respective shrines, so now the main benefit of that is making money by having more cities have both of those religions? Does it matter what state religion you are, or my rivals are, as far as me making money off my religion? The rest of the world seems to be Hindu at this point (800 AD), so I guess I should just spread my two religions around my cities?

Another benefit of a religion that you have the shrine of is that if it is your state religion you can see around all of the cities that have that religion. So you should really try to spread the one that you are going to have as your state religion.

If you can get enough cities converted in another civilization you can ask them to change to your religion, and then you'll have a new buddy!

 

[Toshiro126]

Originally posted by Welnic:

Another benefit of a religion that you have the shrine of is that if it is your state religion you can see around all of the cities that have that religion.

I forgot about that. So you can see units and land surrounding the cities, but you can't see inside the cities right? is that the way it works?

 

[Tennyson]

Found the religion, spread the religion, build temples and monasteries, reap happy faces and research. No contest.

 

[Welnic]

I forgot about that. So you can see units and land surrounding the cities, but you can't see inside the cities right? is that the way it works?

You can see the same things as if you had a unit in the city. You can see the city garrison and the surrounding tiles. In order to actually see into the city you need a spy.

 

[Toshiro126]

Originally posted by Welnic:

You can see the same things as if you had a unit in the city. You can see the city garrison and the surrounding tiles. In order to actually see into the city you need a spy.

Got it! Thanks.

 

[Sisiutil]

Using a Great Person to discover Philosophy has another side benefit: since Philosophy is a pre-requisite on the path to Liberalism, it gives you a boost in the race to be the first to Liberalism and its free tech.

 

[pigswill]

If hinduism is the main religion of your neighbours don't take confucianism or taoism as a state religion unless you're getting ready for fighting. Spread them liberally for the gold (and if you spread them then maybe your neighbours might convert) but stay no state religion until the picture is clearer.

 

[Cadmus]

If hinduism is the main religion of your neighbours don't take confucianism or taoism as a state religion unless you're getting ready for fighting. Spread them liberally for the gold (and if you spread them then maybe your neighbours might convert) but stay no state religion until the picture is clearer.

Great advice, thanks very much. I haven't proceeded any in the game yet, still at just before 800AD, so this is all very helpful. Civ IV is my first Civ game that I've really gotten into; prior to this I was just too overwhelmed by the depth. However this has really grabbed my attention, and I love the new leaders in Warlords, so I think I'm here to stay. I'm reading Sisiutil's guide, so hopefully that will clear up some issues about strategy. Thanks everyone for the tips!

 

[Sisiutil]

If hinduism is the main religion of your neighbours don't take confucianism or taoism as a state religion unless you're getting ready for fighting. Spread them liberally for the gold (and if you spread them then maybe your neighbours might convert) but stay no state religion until the picture is clearer.

I second this. Adopting and spreading a State Religion is one of the most important strategic decisions of the early game, with huge implications for diplomacy, production, happiness, and military. Before adopting a SR, it's best to wait until you have a clear plan of action in mind vis-a-vis the neighbouring civs: who you want as friends, who you want as enemies.