Zebra 9
Emperor
Sounds awsome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
A Better AI.
- Thread starter Blake
- Start date
Meatbuster
formerly Robo Kai
If there's something new I noticed about this special patch (or maybe it was 2.08), it's:
1. Special resources are more prevalent in all maps. (I tried a few.)
2. Your first settler can actually start on top of a resource! (Well, I had it happen only once, see screenshot for details.)
1. Special resources are more prevalent in all maps. (I tried a few.)
2. Your first settler can actually start on top of a resource! (Well, I had it happen only once, see screenshot for details.)
Spoiler You have found a source of copper under Rome. :
lol same thing happen to me except I started on wheat and had 3 other food resources in my fat cross, If i moved my settler Iand settled in any direction I'd lose at least 1 of my 2 fish. Starting location was best and fish gave me more of a food surplus then wheat... before biology anywayz.Robo Kai said:If there's something new I noticed about this special patch (or maybe it was 2.08), it's:
1. Special resources are more prevalent in all maps. (I tried a few.)
2. Your first settler can actually start on top of a resource! (Well, I had it happen only once, see screenshot for details.)
Spoiler You have found a source of copper under Rome. :
LOL at least the AI can't pillage your copper I bet Multiplayers must love those starting locations.
I've got horses popping under my capital too. I've had the message while I was watching a settler elsewhere, searched them several minutes before I decided to turn on the locator and then saw the little horses between the legs of my archers. I was Cyrus, so horses were to be connected at once. 
Arlborn
Legendary Noob
- Joined
- Jul 29, 2006
- Messages
- 1,939
Blake said:
THX! LOVE YA
Just check mine and the others sugestions in other posts on the thread, I think in the middle of it there was 1 or 2 not so bad suggestions
Waiting anxiously!
Perhaps the AI going for Cultural victory from the begining should be something quite random? Like each leader has a percentage of start the game aiming for cultural victory? Like, half of the leaders(includeing all agreesives ones)or more wouldent have any chance of going for cultural victory at all, and then others should have some chance, like Mansa Musa has 10% of chance, Asoka has 30%, Louis(well he is backstabber but France has a nice culture) 40%, Gandhi 50% and etc..?
Dunno if its possible, just a sugestion
ps: I had also a copper in the tile of my capitol...Funny hehe
phungus420
Deity
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2003
- Messages
- 6,296
Reading the posts respsonding to mine regarding agression. I see that its bothering people that in order to play the higher levels you have to be militarily agressive. Thing is, you have to be an agressive builder as well. You also have to make damn sure you're spreading your religion, really on the higher levels you have to focus on many aspects at once. I think it's more that "buider" type players notice more when thier civ gets destroyed when they've neglected the military. True, you need to invade your neighbor on Emporer, but you also better be damn sure you're building those libraries and spreading religion in your cities. That's the way it goes.
Question for blake, any idea on when the AI improvements that get the AI to go for varied victories will be out? Anything I could help on, beta testing or what not? I honestly have no problem with running 18 player games, with spys in all the AI cities and me doing nothing just to see what happens. Hell, I just did it with your last mod to see how the AI wars and builds differently. You definatly notice the AI doesn't spare the whip, at least in the early game, and it builds work boats, much earlier.
Question for blake, any idea on when the AI improvements that get the AI to go for varied victories will be out? Anything I could help on, beta testing or what not? I honestly have no problem with running 18 player games, with spys in all the AI cities and me doing nothing just to see what happens. Hell, I just did it with your last mod to see how the AI wars and builds differently. You definatly notice the AI doesn't spare the whip, at least in the early game, and it builds work boats, much earlier.
aelf
Ashen One
phungus420 said:
I don't think that's true. I think 'builder' or 'warmonger' is defined by your overall strategy. Builders tend to go for wonders, maybe beelining for their relevant techs, and tend to choose building markets or universities (etc) over units. They go to war only when they have to and often when they have a clear tech advantage. They aim for cultural, space race and even time victories. Warmongers tend to build a lot of units and go to war as often as upkeep and logistics allow them to. They don't bother with wonders and tend to beeline instead for military techs such as IW and Rifling. They typically aim for conquest and domination victories.
Anyway, I'm glad to hear that the AI's skills at war would be improved as well. I can't wait for Monarch to be truly the new Immortal.
Quagga
Former Dictator
Not sure where to post about problems with the BetterAI mod. I have a problem with crash-to-desktop. The attached save file crashes for me reliably on the next turn. Remove the CvGameCoreDLL.dll from CustomAssets and it plays through. This was using the BetterAI version 06-11-07.
EDIT: Attachment deleted.
EDIT: Attachment deleted.
mnf
King
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2006
- Messages
- 659
Tried out the 1.61 one (11-07 build) since I don't have Warlords yet.
Two problems. First the background.
I put AI city under siege (choking strategy with my archer). All AI units are in the city, there are no roads or any improvements since I choked it early.
Problem one: I order my new, shining axeman to go join my choking archer. The route includes three turns movement within AI cultural border. The axeman stops just outside AI border. I order it to go direct to the choking position, but it stops every turn and I have to advance it manually.
Problem two: worker working on a plot that is just outside the AI border but within my border. The AI has no units whatsoever outside its city, which is four tiles away. The worker stops every turn, even though he is under no danger.
Two problems. First the background.
I put AI city under siege (choking strategy with my archer). All AI units are in the city, there are no roads or any improvements since I choked it early.
Problem one: I order my new, shining axeman to go join my choking archer. The route includes three turns movement within AI cultural border. The axeman stops just outside AI border. I order it to go direct to the choking position, but it stops every turn and I have to advance it manually.
Problem two: worker working on a plot that is just outside the AI border but within my border. The AI has no units whatsoever outside its city, which is four tiles away. The worker stops every turn, even though he is under no danger.
Blake, I have been playing with your AI for a good bit and its very good so far, but there is a couple things I've noticed about the workers. When you discover civil service they love to destroy towns to make them farms even if growing the city more wouldn't help too much this happens on place without floodplains or grasslands(some fishies and/or cows pigs), but it doesn't do it on true good comerce places with grasslands floodplains, ect. The other is when i was playing a highlands map. I was on one side of a lake and eventually colonized the other side. My workers eventually tried to make a road going all the way around the lake through two civs, Aztecs I had an open border with the other Japan, hah no chance. Now I didn't have the japan territory explored but there was no way for my workers to make it around when I went to the worldbuilder. Now I dunno if they would still do this if I had the area explored but it was funny trying to find all my workers when they were in a line making a super road through half the map. And all my new workers would try to do the same thing so I had to automate closest city.
I'll probably post a somewhat experimental build tommorow with combat AI improvement and maybe some cultural victory stuff. Beta testing is certainly useful and I greatly appreciate detailed feedback.phungus420 said:
The crash is known and is fixed for the next build. Thanks anyway.Quagga said:
The Warlords 2.08 AI will gleefully lay great tracts of farmland for no good reason whatsoever, I deleted the old irrigation code (because it's horrible) but unfortunately it made it back inskankerm said:
.If the latest version of my AI is doing that then I'd need to see the exact sitaution (ie screenshot), the only time the AI should willfully farm over a town is to create a short irrigation chain to an otherwise unirrigated crops resource. It will only do this if there isn't already a connecting farm/city, certainly it shouldn't farm excessively.
I can't really think of a good solution to that... it is difficult to tell the difference between a long route which needs to be roaded and a genuinely convulted route which just shouldn't be made.... there are some things I could try but they might introduce new problems... what I am pretty sure of is that the workers would've found a way around japan, even if it was something really daft like going around the back.
What I might just do is have them not bother with long treks, as long as the destination city is connected to the capital, working on the assumption it'd be quicker to train new workers at the destination.
Good news Blake, I went back to the game with the workers building a super road. I went to the world builder and dropped some spys so I could explore the remaining border of japan and once I had the border explores showing it was unpassable my workers turned right around and went back home to resume meaningfull work. And for the town destroying, I dont have the same anymore but I really only noticed it on one city where it destroyed many towns.. It had 2 gold desert hills with a cow and fish with a river 2 spaces away. They were maybe 2 or 3 desert tiles in the cross as well.. Im guessing since i wasn't financial.(i dunno if it takes that into account) that it put the farms in an would thus harvest more of the water tiles instead. I was just mad when all my beautiful towns were being flooded over. One other thing i notice is that automated workers tend to harvest all the available resources first then put roads on them later, although I usually have some workers just automated trade network so it doesn't matter that much. its usually just in the begining of the game when its more noticable
kettyo
Seeker of Reality
In my current game (latest Blake AI), with agressive AI setting on, Ragnar attacked me in the early game, while there were still free room to expand, with 2 spearmen
Glad i had 1 axeman in the city otherwise i had been in trouble.
He payed hard for that. After built an army of swords and axes and archers i captured a smaller city and pillaged his capital area to the ground (it was defended with too many units to attack).
I don't know if it's because of the mod but i remember AI normally attacked only with large numbers of units.
I think this attack was not a too smart decision of the AI.
And add to this, not much after the lost war against me he attacked Isabella too who is his religious brother.
Really aggressive and silly
Glad i had 1 axeman in the city otherwise i had been in trouble.
He payed hard for that. After built an army of swords and axes and archers i captured a smaller city and pillaged his capital area to the ground (it was defended with too many units to attack).
I don't know if it's because of the mod but i remember AI normally attacked only with large numbers of units.
I think this attack was not a too smart decision of the AI.
And add to this, not much after the lost war against me he attacked Isabella too who is his religious brother.
Really aggressive
and silly Using the warlords patch 208. As this is not your current build, it may have been adjusted already.
Playing marathon/standard map/noble.
It is the 1600 and most land has been claimed except for a patch of ice on my borders. There are no resources in this area but the AI (Egypt) has just built a city on an ice hill.
In the fat cross it will get the following:
Inner ring:
3 coast
3 ice
1 impassible
1 ice hill
Outer ring:
2 impassible
3 coast
2 ocean
3 ice
1 tundra hill
With maximum 2 food when it builds a lighthouse the only benefit of this city would be the 2 commerce from coastal tiles and the windmill/mine on the hills (That are currently in my borders.
Just seems a daft place to build a city.
Playing marathon/standard map/noble.
It is the 1600 and most land has been claimed except for a patch of ice on my borders. There are no resources in this area but the AI (Egypt) has just built a city on an ice hill.
In the fat cross it will get the following:
Inner ring:
3 coast
3 ice
1 impassible
1 ice hill
Outer ring:
2 impassible
3 coast
2 ocean
3 ice
1 tundra hill
With maximum 2 food when it builds a lighthouse the only benefit of this city would be the 2 commerce from coastal tiles and the windmill/mine on the hills (That are currently in my borders.
Just seems a daft place to build a city.
mnf
King
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2006
- Messages
- 659
Blake said:
I suppose the human player is far more capable of telling whether or not a situation is "safe". In the case I described, the AI only has warriors and archers whose promotion simply didn't allow them to sneak up in one turn from under the fog.
In that case, it's simply irritating to have to re-issue all the orders every turn. And the axeman too, don't see why he's also stopping---after all, he is a military unit.
But I can see how the current behaviour helps with the usual war. Kind of a difficult situation, it seems, when fogged tiles are involved.
cf_nz
Prince
Houman,
Follow the instructions posted by Iustus on page 7 of this thread (about halfway down), for a way of obtaining the source code.
It works well for me.
Follow the instructions posted by Iustus on page 7 of this thread (about halfway down), for a way of obtaining the source code.
It works well for me.
While I empathize with everyone on subtle AI improvements like positioning of cities etc, there seems to be a fundamental flaw in the AI which has been referred to a number of times in this tread but seems to have not gotten a lot of traction how is it fun to play an AI that is screaming ahead of you in technology.
I was/am a regular Monach player, after loading the patch (2.08) I am now facing Cavalry in the year 1280 AD one minute the AI had Knights 2 turns later in 1280AD it has Cavalry. This to me is nonsensical. At this rate the AI will launch its spaceship in the 1700s. Prior to the patch Cavalry would be obtained somewhere between 1500 and 1600 on this level. What happens on the higher levels? Rocketry by 1000AD?
Perhaps I could manage my cities a little better, perhaps I could pick city locations a little better, there are probably infinite things I could do better, but I dont see anyway I can shave 200-300 years off research and be competitive in 1200 AD against Cavalry.
Even going to war is suspect when your mace men and catapults are competing against units of strength 15.
You can make it harder for the Humans, you can smarten the AI .. just shortcutting by giving the AI express technology just takes the fun out of it.
I was/am a regular Monach player, after loading the patch (2.08) I am now facing Cavalry in the year 1280 AD one minute the AI had Knights 2 turns later in 1280AD it has Cavalry. This to me is nonsensical. At this rate the AI will launch its spaceship in the 1700s. Prior to the patch Cavalry would be obtained somewhere between 1500 and 1600 on this level. What happens on the higher levels? Rocketry by 1000AD?
Perhaps I could manage my cities a little better, perhaps I could pick city locations a little better, there are probably infinite things I could do better, but I dont see anyway I can shave 200-300 years off research and be competitive in 1200 AD against Cavalry.
Even going to war is suspect when your mace men and catapults are competing against units of strength 15.
You can make it harder for the Humans, you can smarten the AI .. just shortcutting by giving the AI express technology just takes the fun out of it.
