A plea for a different form of Copy Protection.

[Alistic]

If a game comes with this kind of crap, well it's a game I won't buy.

And if it doesent, many more people wont buy it. They will just pirate it.

 

[Akka]

And if it doesent, many more people wont buy it. They will just pirate it.

And if it does, even MORE people will pirate it. Trust me.

 

[Commander Bello]

Unfortunately, Alistic seems to be right.

Nowadays, most people tend to think something which is availabe in electronic form will be just for free.
They get music, movies and games from the internet, put them on the harddisks and then they start burning sessions like hell.

Therefore, you just cannot blame the industry to look for some protective mechanisms. You would want to get some money for your efforts as well, wouldn't you? Or who does pay your bills?

OTOH, completely idiotic copy protections which hurt the one who has bought the game more than the one who got the unavoidable cracks should be avoided by all means.
I still think an online registration would be fine, and for those who still don't have internet access a unregular question for something from the handbook would be o.k.

 

[Alistic]

And if it does, even MORE people will pirate it. Trust me.

I dont understand the logic behind that. Look at windows 95.

I don't mind paying for the game. Pirates just degrade the quality of future releases.

Not to mention they have to license that protection out most of the time wich just adds to the price of the game in the end.

Pirates dont realize in the end, they are just hurting the games they play.

 

[Akka]

I dont understand the logic behind that. Look at windows 95.

I don't mind paying for the game. Pirates just degrade the quality of future releases.

Not to mention they have to license that protection out most of the time wich just adds to the price of the game in the end.

Pirates dont realize in the end, they are just hurting the games they play.

Simple : the more annoying the protection is, the more tempting it is to pirate. It's really that simple.
I won't bother to get a downloaded version of a game that doesn't put stupid copy protection on it, as I can simply use it in the same way as the pirated version : install the game with it, then put it safely back on the top of the shelf.
If the game has annoying copy protection, though, I'll HAVE to get a crack in addition to the original game, so I don't endanger/wear out my CD and not have to bother with the extremely irritating CD-swapping.
And if the copy is REALLY annoying, like this crappy Starforce that put viruses in your computer, I'll simply not bother with the game, be it because I don't feel it's worth the hassle of getting a specific Starforce remover, either simply out of irritation, as I find totally unacceptable that people put harmful software in my computer when I buy their game.

And I don't agree at all with your ideas about the pirates, but that's yet another debate.

 

[Sub]

I didn't read this whole thread because honestly, I don't view this as a big deal.

I say be glad that all we'll have to have is a cd key. If you wanted to play half-life or half-life 2, you would have to download a program called steam which basically runs your games, checks to make sure you have a valid version of the game everytime you start it up, checks to see if you have any hacks on your computer and bans you from every server if you do (To be honest though, I personally like steam. There are many people who hate it though). So yeah, it isn't that bad.

Bottom line is they will have copyright protection and should have copyright protection.

 

[Akka]

I didn't read this whole thread because honestly, I don't view this as a big deal.

I say be glad that all we'll have to have is a cd key. If you wanted to play half-life or half-life 2, you would have to download a program called steam which basically runs your games, checks to make sure you have a valid version of the game everytime you start it up, checks to see if you have any hacks on your computer and bans you from every server if you do (To be honest though, I personally like steam. There are many people who hate it though). So yeah, it isn't that bad.

Well, Steam is actually the sole reason why I didn't bought HL2.

Bottom line is they will have copyright protection and should have copyright protection.

Well, then they shouldn't be surprised if people are stuffed of their crap and pirate their games.

 

[CornMaster]

Well, Steam is actually the sole reason why I didn't bought HL2.

Same here.

I couldn't play my regular Half Life either when Steam first came out since someone else had already registered my CD key.....such a pissoff....

Anyway...I'm against copy protection in general for moral reasons....but I'll avoid any game which has Starforce type restrictions.

 

[Leprechaune]

I didn't read this whole thread because honestly, I don't view this as a big deal.

I say be glad that all we'll have to have is a cd key. If you wanted to play half-life or half-life 2, you would have to download a program called steam which basically runs your games, checks to make sure you have a valid version of the game everytime you start it up, checks to see if you have any hacks on your computer and bans you from every server if you do (To be honest though, I personally like steam. There are many people who hate it though). So yeah, it isn't that bad.

Bottom line is they will have copyright protection and should have copyright protection.

I didn't read your whole post because honestly, I don't view it as a valid argument.

Bottom line is they don't need copyright protection since anyone with the computer required to use their software is MORE than capable of bypassing their copyright protection if they so wish to do so.

 

[Herr Doktor]

what country is that ?

Maybe a drill platform over the Atlantic?

 

[Sub]

Well, Steam is actually the sole reason why I didn't bought HL2.

Well, then they shouldn't be surprised if people are stuffed of their crap and pirate their games.

I can understand people not wanting to buy half-life 2 because of steam, but I can't understand people wanting to pirate games because of less annoying anti-pirate devises. I mean, it just doesn't make sense to me to think the reason people are pirating games is because there is software on the games designed so people don't pirate them...

 

[FireZ]

Well, then they shouldn't be surprised if people are stuffed of their crap and pirate their games.

I think you may have a problem with any pc game that is shipped out. They all have some sort of copywrite protection on them. The point is, your going to miss out on a potentially great game because "it has copywrite protection".

Battlefield 2 has copywrite protection that requires the cd. I also have a mini image from Game copy world that is always loaded that gets by the protection and I don't have to worry about it. Get a grip here, there will be copy protection always. There will always be a way to get around it. Work with it or miss out. your call.

 

[Leprechaune]

I can understand people not wanting to buy half-life 2 because of steam, but I can't understand people wanting to pirate games because of less annoying anti-pirate devises. I mean, it just doesn't make sense to me to think the reason people are pirating games is because there is software on the games designed so people don't pirate them...

There are pirates who "SELL" for profit cracked games, which is theft without any grey area.

There are pirates who make games that are copy protected downloadable for free by anyone who wishes to do so.

What are the later pirates gonna do to a game with NO copy protection?

Why are people paying for games they can easily DL for free right now?

Why would they suddenly stop paying when the game can be DL for free without copy protection?

Lastly... There are pirates who wear patches over one eye and have pet parrots on their shoulder. They don't play games at ALL!

P.S. ( I never said I was against ANY copy protection, I simply said there are much friendlier and more effective ones available.)

 

[FireZ]

Bottom line is they don't need copyright protection since anyone with the computer required to use their software is MORE than capable of bypassing their copyright protection if they so wish to do so.

Um...this doesn't make sense. Theres lots of people that buy the game rather than mess with copywrite protections. When you pirate a game, every patch breaks your game, you have to wait for a "fix". Game day, unless your terribly lucky, there will not be a crack for civ 4. If you wanna play it from release you have to buy it. There are also several people that don't understand how to get these cracks that could now just "borrow" a friends cd.

I'm sorry the "I'm just not putting copywrite on my game cause its going to get pirated anyhow" just gets your profit margin owned.

 

[Akka]

I can understand people not wanting to buy half-life 2 because of steam, but I can't understand people wanting to pirate games because of less annoying anti-pirate devises. I mean, it just doesn't make sense to me to think the reason people are pirating games is because there is software on the games designed so people don't pirate them...

I think you may have a problem with any pc game that is shipped out. They all have some sort of copywrite protection on them. The point is, your going to miss out on a potentially great game because "it has copywrite protection".

Battlefield 2 has copywrite protection that requires the cd. I also have a mini image from Game copy world that is always loaded that gets by the protection and I don't have to worry about it. Get a grip here, there will be copy protection always. There will always be a way to get around it. Work with it or miss out. your call.

I think you both missed half of my post, and should perhaps reread it a bit...

 

[Leprechaune]

I'm sorry the "I'm just not putting copywrite on my game cause its going to get pirated anyhow" just gets your profit margin owned.

I don't see it... Music is an example of an industry that has had to make adjustments. Do you see pimp doodle (Any random hip hop artist) wearing copper instead of gold and diamonds because of their reduced profit margins?

Big businesses are always complaining about how the people (who would have never PAID for their product anyhow) managed to afford themselves a free copy. While the customers they've always had are still happily paying away.

Um...this doesn't make sense. Theres lots of people that buy the game rather than mess with copywrite protections. When you pirate a game, every patch breaks your game, you have to wait for a "fix". Game day, unless your terribly lucky, there will not be a crack for civ 4. If you wanna play it from release you have to buy it. There are also several people that don't understand how to get these cracks that could now just "borrow" a friends cd.

That's EXACTLY what I'm saying! The MOST basic of copy protection is MORE than enough to make a REAL customer want to pay for the real deal rather than using the crack. No stinking disc check, no stinking starwhatever... Just a simple cd key on installation and free from then on is all anyone needs to use. Anything more, makes the pirated version more and more attractive.

And again what you just said is a perfect illustration of what I've been saying all along. People WILL pay regardless of the availability of a pirated version. So don't piss those people off.

 

[FireZ]

I don't see it... Music is an example of an industry that has had to make adjustments. Do you see pimp doodle (Any random hip hop artist) wearing copper instead of gold and diamonds because of their reduced profit margins?

Big businesses are always complaining about how the people (who would have never PAID for their product anyhow) managed to afford themselves a free copy. While the customers they've always had are still happily paying away.

I know a lot of people, myself, that are going to buy the game so we can play big games without pc's. I have 4 friends that I know, myself, that wouldn't fork over a dime to play if it had "no" copywrite protection. I also know several people who will buy the game because they aren't competant enough to find and swap out an exicutable file, let alone know where/how to get the crack in the first place. All those people who, now are going to buy the game, don't. Thus lose profit margin.

Copywrite protection isn't a prevention, its a hinderance. It annoys many people into actually purchasing the game so they don't have to deal with it. Yes people will pirate software, no matter what you do to it. Many people, however, will buy it so they can play it without doing anything to it.

Oh and the reason big music business still has cash to throw around is that they aren't getting ripped off as much as they play out to be. They still make millions on their CD's. Their version of copywrite protection is putting the ownus on CD buring companies and download services to put copy protection on their products. Oh and not to mention suing every person they catch distributing files.

 

[DiamanteLouco]

I am going to buy Civ IV, but that´s the first game I will be going to buy in years, I don´t know this is valid as an excuse, but, you pay 50 dollars for a game, I pay 150 reais, in the case of the preorder, I will pay 255 reais because of all the taxes both countries have, and yes, I am the only brazilian I know that will actually buy the copy, not only of civilization, but of any game that isn´t a MMORPG. Would you pay 255 dollars for a game?
Not blaming you for the crappy economy in my country, just saying that most of the times I don´t have the choice to buy the game, CIV is worth a little more then a week salary for me and I am actually eating less and going out less so I can buy it, but I am just doing it because I´m a hopless addict, no other game deserves such a blow in my pocket.
(point of this post: Protect all you want, no protection all these years stopped me from downloading a game 2 days after its release, if all, it just annoyed the people who actually bought the thing as for crack sites are more then ready to deal with protection)

 

[Leprechaune]

I know a lot of people, myself, that are going to buy the game so we can play big games without pc's. I have 4 friends that I know, myself, that wouldn't fork over a dime to play if it had "no" copywrite protection. I also know several people who will buy the game because they aren't competant enough to find and swap out an exicutable file, let alone know where/how to get the crack in the first place. All those people who, now are going to buy the game, don't. Thus lose profit margin.

I don't understand how you're going to "play big games without pc's."

But those friends I have to assume are buying the game so they have a copy of their own so you can play MP games? If there is only a client based server system for the MP portion of this game, they'll be able to use pirated versions to play. And that is proof that very little copy protection is needed to deter a person from going the pirated route.

The people you've pointed out that can't locate an exicutable file are also not going to be able to burn a copy of a "Slightly" protected game disc. They'd be paying even if there were no protection because they don't know how to do otherwise. And if they can have a friend burn them a copy, they can have that friend swap the executable.

Both of the above example continue to verify that no extensive protection is required to keep happily paying customers.

Copywrite protection isn't a prevention, its a hinderance. It annoys many people into actually purchasing the game so they don't have to deal with it. Yes people will pirate software, no matter what you do to it. Many people, however, will buy it so they can play it without doing anything to it.

Don't you see? The copy protection is having the EXACT oposite effect on many more people. It annoys many people into getting the hacks.

Oh and the reason big music business still has cash to throw around is that they aren't getting ripped off as much as they play out to be. They still make millions on their CD's. Their version of copywrite protection is putting the ownus on CD buring companies and download services to put copy protection on their products. Oh and not to mention suing every person they catch distributing files.

It's cost them more to fight it than they ever lost to it... I'd bet my left ___ on it.

 

[SonicX]

Why don't they do a protection similar to the one of Galactic Civilizations (which even was available for download )
Given enough support, patches and updates and very good multiplayer system, I think it's reasonable. And those who download it, usually are the ones who weren't going to pay for it anyway, or the ones who just don't want a localized version or can't get to it (if they live in New Orleans or Haiti f.i.)