A Score of Zero...

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You can use the nice little "EDIT" button in the lower right part of your post. One of its uses is to avoid double-posting. Try it when you get the time ;)

And if you say that Bush "did not lie" about weapons of mass destruction being present in Iraq, then that concludes the discussion, and we can both let the public judge the credibility of our arguments =)
 
You can use the nice little "EDIT" button in the lower right part of your post. One of its uses is to avoid double-posting. Try it when you get the time ;)

And if you say that Bush "did not lie" about weapons of mass destruction being present in Iraq, then that concludes the discussion, and we can both let the public judge the credibility of our arguments =)


Really?








"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998.

"Iraq is a long way from [here], but what happens there matters a great deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear, chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest security threat we face."
Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998.

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18,1998.

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998.

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999.

"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies."
Letter to President Bush, Signed by Joe Lieberman (D-CT), John McCain (Rino-AZ) and others, Dec. 5, 2001

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandated of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them."
Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002.

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002.

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002.

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002.

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I b elieve that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002.

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Jay Rockerfeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002.

"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has refused to do"
Rep. Henry Waxman (D, CA), Oct. 10, 2002.

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weap ons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002.

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002.

"[W]ithout question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his contin ued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real ..."
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003.



Sorry, but George W. Bush wasn't exactly the only one who thought Saddam had WMD's.

Thank you, come again.
 
The exact same thing wiped out one of my recent games. In 2625BC the Vedic Aryans appeared just outside of my capital. I had a warrior in the capital and an archer 3 spaces away, on his way to my next city site when 5 barb archers appeared. My warrior managed to take out two archers while making a valiant defense, but alas, he fell to the third. My archer was one turn away when the city fell. If he'd been once space closer I might have survived.

I think this particular random event is a bit too harsh. Almost no one is ready to handle 5 archers at this early stage. Looking at the replay of the game, I can see that none of the AIs had settles a second city at that point. Either you beeline archer and build 3 archers before building anything else, or you are vulnerable to this event. And if you do start like that, you're hopelessly behind, so of course, you don't start with that kind of defense. So if this event does happen, it's "game-over, dude!".

Either limit it to after 2000BC, or else make it weaker. Or scale it with time, so at 3000BC it's just 2 archers, at 2500BC it's 3, and so on. I mean, how did the barbs get that many archers that early anyway? :)
 
Enough with the politics already - there are plenty of other places for you to give voice to your tribal instincts elsewhere at civfanatics.

Back OT:

When I ran some tests back on Warlords I noticed that barbs placed in the WB tend to go wherever there's something to destroy (Me Smash!! :trouble:), but otherwise seem just to move around at random.

I don't know anything about the random event barbs, but if they work in the same way, this was just a case of double bad luck. Commiserations.

Still, if you're gonna get ruined by a random event, it's better if it comes early.
 
He wasn't the only one, so he didn't lie?
What kind of flawed logic are you convinced you're using, here?

You asked when he lied, i answered simply: when he said that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, he lied. That's a simple fact. The fact that others, and not only from the US, were wrong or lying as well doesn't change the fact that he lied.

As for your long list of politicians who were seemingly mistaken, i would kindly ask you to point out which ones have declared war on Iraq and sent troops over there.


Thank you. Please, do come again.
 
He wasn't the only one, so he didn't lie?
What kind of flawed logic are you convinced you're using, here?

You asked when he lied, i answered simply: when he said that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, he lied. That's a simple fact. The fact that others, and not only from the US, were wrong or lying as well doesn't change the fact that he lied.

As for your long list of politicians who were seemingly mistaken, i would kindly ask you to point out which ones have declared war on Iraq and sent troops over there.


Thank you. Please, do come again.



/facepalm

I'm done with you.
 
Yeah, that's what people usually say when they're pointed out the flaws in their logic ;)
 
He wasn't the only one, so he didn't lie?
What kind of flawed logic are you convinced you're using, here?

You asked when he lied, i answered simply: when he said that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction, he lied. That's a simple fact. The fact that others, and not only from the US, were wrong or lying as well doesn't change the fact that he lied.

As for your long list of politicians who were seemingly mistaken, i would kindly ask you to point out which ones have declared war on Iraq and sent troops over there.


Thank you. Please, do come again.
There is a distinction between a lie, and a mistake - in order for a false statement to be a lie, the person making the statement must be aware that what he is saying is certainly, or probably false. There is no evidence that President Bush thought that at the time of the 2003 Iraq Invasion, meaning any assertions that he lied instead of merely being mistaken are simply speculative.

That said, there's a great Off-Topic forum where I post a lot for discussing these things....
 
Okay time to answer some questions/comments/curse words...

Oh, yes. Barbarians can come inside your borders :) I can send you the replay. :) At the time I thought they couldn't so I didn't even move my worker. Only two of the five archers entered my borders. I dunno where the others went. But a worker was my first (and to that point) only build, so the pair of archers marched right up to my palace. I threw rocks at them from my window, but they deposed me anyway.

Why did I post this thread in the strategy/tips section? Cause originally I had planned to do a big, mock strategy post complete with screenshots and analysis that showed me getting defeated so rapidly. But when I checked back at my old saves, I found that there weren't any :( ...and then I forgot to go back to general discussion. Sorry.

Regarding the Bush comment. Opps. I didn't mean to start a political discussion. I thought that was a pretty "safe" comment because... I mean come on... Where did he lie? Did you watch his speech last night? We're bringing troops home because of our success? That's a lie right there. They were coming home regardless of success. We have overextended ourselves and some can't stay in the field any longer. In Civilization terms, our units are about to go on strike. Anyway, there's no point in debating. There's always that 31% that seemingly can't be convinced.

And now since this topic is thoroughly derailed, let's talk about Britney. Sure her performance was dreadful, but fat? No way. She just had two kids and still looked hotter than any woman I'll ever get. I think it's unfair for everyone to make fun of her weight. Her performance/talent/life is fair game. Agree? Disagree? Discuss.
 
Sadly, most conservatives are doing arguably more productive things with their lives so I'm left to deal with nothing but lefties on the internet.

Well... I guess I'm the exception - I'm conservative with nothing better to do than respond to this thread... though I am at work. ;)
 
Fact 1: More people know the name of Britney Spears' ex husband than know who their representatives in congress are.

Fact 2: Fact 1 makes me want to cry like the baby Jesus.
 
I had the barbarian event happen to one of my AI opponents. He had the Great Wall, so the Barbs wandered into my land. It was "Barb uprising near (ai city name)" and NOT one of my cities.
 
Fact 1: More people know the name of Britney Spears' ex husband than know who their representatives in congress are.

Fact 2: Fact 1 makes me want to cry like the baby Jesus.

I fail to see what this has to do with anything =) Especially not on the topic of utterly flawed logic ;)
 
As for your long list of politicians who were seemingly mistaken, i would kindly ask you to point out which ones have declared war on Iraq and sent troops over there.

The declaration of war is a congressional power - the President doesn't have that authority.
 
OKAY! back to the game, all of you...
AS I see it, a random event riggers mass barbarian spawn anywhere. Said barabrians capture worker then grab capital....

Why was your capital undefended, and did u put worker first build?
 
I like how the OP makes a cliché lefty jab at the President and no one says anything.

Someone implies that John Kerry is worse and gets chastised. "lol politix"


I don't have a problem with all these ridiculous cuts at President Bush. People have a right to say whatever stupid thing comes to their little pile of grey matter. What really irks me is that they're so happy being little sheep. It's the rampant stupidity and ignorance that I cannot stand.

Sadly, most conservatives are doing arguably more productive things with their lives so I'm left to deal with nothing but lefties on the internet.


I just cannot wrap my head around why people hate George W. Bush so much. Not a single liberal has been able to answer this for me in anything more than platitudes.

Though, shame on me I suppose. Because I've now pointed out the liberal hipocrisy and now a mod will come in and delete our posts. Speech is free until you point out how hipocritical a liberal is, then you're just hating.


Society today makes me :(

chas·tise [chas-tahyz, chas-tahyz]
–verb (used with object), -tised, -tis·ing. 1. to discipline, esp. by corporal punishment.
2. to criticize severely.

Poster was "chastised" because he was posting off topic. I don't see how "lol politix" is anything but a polite attempt to keep the posts on topic.

plat·i·tude (plāt'ĭ-tōōd', -tyōōd')
n.
A trite or banal remark or statement, especially one expressed as if it were original or significant. See Synonyms at cliché.
Lack of originality; triteness.

I guess I could make up new stuff that Bush has done but I think the stuff published and televised simply speaks for itself, repeating information received from news sources is inherently unoriginal. Using Originality as a criteria for why the majority of the public dislikes Bush's administration is foolish and...

hy·poc·ri·sy Pronunciation Key -[hi-pok-ruh-see]
–noun, plural -sies. 1. a pretense of having a virtuous character, moral or religious beliefs or principles, etc., that one does not really possess.

Liberal hypocrisy? I'd have to have some examples of this. You state that since no liberal can give an original reason to dislike Bush they must be hypocrits? I'm not following the logic here and I don't see any hypocrisy. The only thing I can see is someone who likes to use big words that he doesn't fully understand and jumps to conclusions about the nature of others simply based on his bias yet you have the gall to call others "little sheep", "ignorant", "stupid" and "hypocrits". Shame on you.

Pot. Kettle. Black.
 
Poster was "chastised" because he was posting off topic. I don't see how "lol politix" is anything but a polite attempt to keep the posts on topic.

I guess I could make up new stuff that Bush has done but I think the stuff published and televised simply speaks for itself

Have you no grasp of irony?
 
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