A Semi-Immortal Walkthrough

[lilnev]

A Semi-Immortal Walkthrough

by lilnev

Howdy folks. Like many others, I've enjoyed acidsatyr's demonstration of an immortal game, and I hope to see it finished. Myself, I've been struggling to make the step up from emperor with limited success, and the Warlords patch has set me back a half step. Still, I find I can win about one game in three with somewhat-easier-than-standard settings (see below). Hence the "semi-immortal" in the thread title. So in the hope that it will be educational, I figured I'd do a demonstration game of my own. Settings:

Immortal
Normal speed
Small pangaea, high sea level, random climate, random shorelines
Random leaders, including me
No options checked, all victory conditions enabled

Small pangaea is significantly easier than a continents game. You're guaranteed four neighbors to support tech trading, Wonders and "race techs" (e.g. religions or Liberalism) are a little easier to get, and most importantly, all your opponents are near at hand. No worries about the other continent teching away with nothing you can do. I also think that high sea level helps a bit. There's less space for barbarians, your nearest victim is likely to be close, and the AIs have less total space in which to build. On immortal, I usually can't build more than three cities myself anyway because the maintainence costs are so steep, so it doesn't hurt me as much as it does them.

Note that I make no promises to win this game. I have played far enough to believe that I have a good shot in this game (many of my losses come early, when I'm playing it close to the edge for efficiency and I'm too small to have resiliency if something goes wrong). But even if (perhaps especially if?) I do eventually lose, it should be educational. Questions, comments, and suggestions are welcome in the forum, though it's being run more as a demonstration game than a collaborative effort like the ALC or EMC threads.

And let's roll the RNG ....

Wang Kon of Korea. Financial (good) and Protective (not so good). The Hwacha (catapult, +50% vs melee) is quite strong, though the Seowon (university, +35% beakers) may come too late to be useful. Mysticism isn't one of my favorite starting techs, but Mining is. In the screenshot, I've already moved the warrior (he started on the Wine). I'll move SW to settle, losing fresh water but gaining two hills. Turns out there's Wheat there too, so four food resources for my capital. Climate is arid, which doesn't play so well with Financial (fewer grasslands to cottage), but oh well.

<initial turns listening to Carl Orff's "Carmina Burana">

Research Fishing while starting a worker. As soon as possible, switch to a workboat and research BW, working the unimproved clams to maximize research. First hut popped a scout, the second was Hunting. Met Stalin in 3760 BC. He's on the west coast, just to the south of what's visible here:

No more food this side of the jungle. Not even a river to irrigate. Not good. Fogbusting....
Brennus (Hindu) came by in 3400 BC. BW in 3240, one turn after Seoul grew to size two. No Copper, of course. Slavery immediately and whip the boat. Overflow into the unfinished worker. Research AH.

(

My worker is done a turn early, so I'll pre-chop a bit before improving the Sheep. Build a settler. I may plant him just north of the Marble, poaching the Sheep from the capital.

The nearest Horses are down by the Rice. Research Polytheism. The Marble makes me want the Oracle (probably for MC?). Poly is 2 turns slower than Meditation, but sets up Literature later. And Meditation is easier to trade for. Neither of the neighbors I've met is particularly Wonder-Happy (Stalin is Industrious, but not religiously inclined), so I think I've got a good shot.

... and then I changed my mind and decided to grow to size two (sinking a few hammers into the second boat) before building the settler.

Better. Polytheism's not done, but I switched to the Wheel first to make sure my worker stays employed. After chopping the settler, I mined the hill and set up the road. Toku showed up. I don't like him, as he'll never trade, but at least he's far away. Researching Masonry. The fogbusting scout adjusted slightly after the second city was founded:

Seoul built the second boat, grew to size three, then built half a settler before switching to the Oracle when Priesthood was finished. Meanwhile the worker quarried the Marble. Research Pottery. Once I'm size four, I may whip the settler for NNW of Bananas. A poor spot in the short term (though the best I've got), but decent long-term prospects.

Longer-term, I'm looking at collecting Wonders in my capital (Oracle, Great Library, possibly Great Lighthouse and/or Colossus) and eventually converting it to a GP farm. It has good food, good production, and at most 6 cottagable tiles (the river bank has to farmed to irrigate the Wheat). Seeing as I'm on the tail end of the universe, I may someday move my capital to reduce distance maintainence and/or to better leverage Bureaucracy.

.... OK never mind. It looks like Stalin is going to beat me to my third city site. This is not uncommon on these settings. It's unfortunate that I have neither Copper nor Horse to fight my way out. I'll probably try to trade Alphabet for IW, since I hate researching it on my own. But if I have no Iron either, this game could collapse. It's a long way to Construction. On the bright side, the patch has greatly improved the AI's ability to settle on the correct tiles. I don't have to raze nearly as often. <crosses fingers>

Stalin has Writing already, so I sign Open Borders and give him crabs (heh). Wondering whether I can research Writing and Math, and Oracle into Construction.... It's a different gamble than hoping I have Iron. With Financial and double Crab, I'm teching well. I switch to unimproved Wine and coastal tiles to try it, instead of "better" tiles like Sheep and mines. But you do what you gotta, and if I don't get a competent military unit soon, I'm going to lose this game. Now I wish I'd gone the Meditation route. I wasn't anticipating needing to delay the Oracle until I could research Math.

< to be continued.... >

 

[LosBlack]

the start looks a little dry, but you did ok on resources.

thanks a bunch for trying this thread, i'll be lurking..maybe posting.

gl!

 

[lilnev]

1000 BC. After some tile and queue juggling, I complete the Oracle, choosing Construction. This gambit probably wouldn't have worked on a larger board. Now it's time to whip some hwachas and claim some land. Researching Alphabet. Hopefully I can trade to backfill my tech tree. Now that Stalin has moved close, I don't need to fogbust. I've taken the opportunity to explore his lands. He is large, of course. Welcome to immortal. My scout and warrior set off in search of the elusive Fourth Neighbor. Note the mine in the desert by Yaroslavl. Methinks there's Iron afoot.

<Rush, "Permanent Waves">

The details of micro-whipping are important, but too tedious. Balance unhappiness against growth against commerce (must reach Alphabet) against production, etc. General rules: whip for two pop at a time, don't whip before the last unhappiness has worn off. Try to maximize hammers and commerce, and even cottage maturation, under these constraints.

I found the fourth victim (er, neighbor). Kublai Khan. He and Toku are Buddhist. One of the big differences I've noticed between emperor and immortal: I seldom adopt a religion on immortal. The advantages (building with OR or units with Theo, friendly co-religionists) just aren't offset by the cost of having someone hate you. Better to be no one's target, and get to choose your wars as you please.

Stalin built the Pyramids in Moscow in 775 BC. Excellent. That makes up for the insult of stealing my third city site.

OK, I talk big. I had meant to whip for two last turn, but I got sloppy and missed it. Now I've got less than 30 hammers to go, so I can't. If it were possible to voluntarily remove hammers from an item in the queue, I'd do it. When you're whipping in a small city like this, the limiting resource is the time to work off unhappiness. That's why it's essential to whip for two, exactly ten turns apart, and tile-juggle or queue-swap to make it work and get the most done in the meantime. Oh well. Red wine never was good for my game....

Brennus is rather large, and centrally located. He's leading the scoreboard, and looks to be the most significant long-term competition. Kublai is to the SE, Toku has lands in both the NE and SE.

I'm not going to attack before Alphabet. The board seems rather linear, so I'm going to have to fight Stalin until he's dead. I should get what I can in trade first.

Stalin and Toku won't trade, but I got Monarchy from Kublai and IW+Ag+Archery from Brennus without[\i] trading away Alphabet. It's not always possible to hold a monopoly for long, but it's worth trying. I switched to HR and traded Crab to Brennus for Silk. Note that the settler and library being built in the following screenshot didn't last, I went back to Hwachas. And now it's time for ... WAR!!!!

<Tad, "Salt Lick". I suspect that most of you are unaware of this album. In my opinion, it's the best thing to come out of the early nineties Seattle-grunge movement. No offence to Nirvana, they wrote some fine music, but not as simple and angry as the unheralded Tad.>

Lost two hwachas taking Yaroslavl, one more than expected. 400 BC, I traded Alphabet to Kublai for Sailing + Meditation. He was willing to trade Monotheism, but wouldn't give a better deal on Alphabet. That means he's researching it, so I should get what I can now. I'll leave Brennus in the dark as long as possible.

My hwachas are just north of Novgorod. It's defended by two city garrison archers and an axeman, on a hill. I haven't decided yet whether to storm it, or just bypass it and go to Moscow. For now I'm shelling it while reinforcements catch up. Longer term, the plan is to keep Moscow and St. Peterburg, raze Novgorod and Yakutsk, and plant new cities accessing the Fish, just west of Horse, and just north of Iron. That seems to capture the most best tiles.

<Jimi Hendrix, "Live at Winterland">

I'm going to go ahead and attack Novgorod. It'll cost me a couple of hwachas, but it has to be done eventually, and I could use the pillage money. I trade Sheep to Brennus for 4 gpt. Seoul will become unhealthy, but I need the money. I drop research to zero, hoping to buy Calendar from him for Alphabet + cash. A lucky roll, and I raze Novgorod at the cost of just one hwacha. Still, Brennus won't trade Calendar for Alphabet + 209. He's likely working on Alphabet himself.

A few turns later I took this deal. Monotheism may or may not be a dead tech, but I felt it was the best I could get for Alphabet. And I march down to Moscow, and I find it poorly defended? OK with me.

I took it the following turn, at the cost of two hwachas. Not even bothering to knock down the cultural defenses, I just wanted the job done. Pyongyang is still whipping (swordsmen now), as I want to take St. Petersburg and possibly raze some smaller cities before I sue for peace (hoping for Currency, but we'll see). Seoul is building a library, prelude to the Great Library. With the Pyramids to provide Representation, the GL becomes an even better deal. Still, I have to admit that I'm a sucker for the whip:

How could I let those turns of unhappiness-wearing-off go to waste? I promise I'll spend the overflow responsibly. Actually this probably wasn't a good whip. With my higher happiness cap, I should let this city grow and work some actual tiles.

Here I've whipped a library for two. The overflow will go into the Great Library. Yes, my capital is momentarily size two with a happiness cap of seven. I'll grow into it, I swear. Note that whipping wonders directly is prohibitively expensive. Each whip produces only half as many hammers if they're applied to a wonder directly. But you can whip something else to generate a large overflow, and then apply that overflow to a wonder at full value. This works best with axes, swords, or catapults, things that cost only a little more than 30. Eight turns of wonder building, one turn to put the first few hammers into the unit, then whip for two with almost 30 hammers of overflow. Rinse and repeat. You don't actually get the wonder faster than if you were working mined hills at max size. But you get it almost as fast, and you get units in the meantime. Plus you don't always have mined hills, in which case it's an efficient way to convert food into hammers. In this case, I needed the library anyway before I can start on the Great Library, so I have no qualms about whipping it.

Stalin is putting the question to me. There's two swords, an axe and an archer in that stack. I could put my overflow hammers into an axeman or hwacha and upgrade the warrior to an axe. Or I could sue for peace, regroup, and hit him again in ten turns. He won't give up useful tech, but I might get 140 gold from him. I'm going to call it a night and make that decision next time. But first, a couple of screenshots to show how far behind I am.

Kublai lacks CoL, and Toku lacks both CoL and Mono, but there's no trading to be had at the moment. Once I've got a good lead on the GL, I'll offer CoL+Lit to Kublai.

At least Brennus isn't running away on the power graph. Like I said, he's the longer-term threat.

Hey, number one in imports and exports! Score.

More seriously, I'm happy with the game so far. I've got four cities, Stalin has been dealt a significant blow with the loss of his capital, I've captured the Pyramids, and I should be able to build the Great Library. Pillage and tech selling have kept my research slider high, so I'm not too badly behind despite having two non-traders in this game. Now I need to push Stalin back a bit more, then spit out a couple a settlers and some workers to clear jungle and put up cottages.

Two more notes: A Mongolian settler is moving into the space between me and Stalin. That's unfortunate. I don't want to antagonize him, so I may have to adjust my forecast cities around him. And Toku won't attack anybody because he "already has enough on his hands." Usually that means he's about to attack someone, hopefully Brennus.

Next update later this week. Thanks for reading.

peace,
lilnev

 

[Eggolas]

Fascinating. Keep up the good work.

When you send in the SoD siege weapons, do you bring along any melee or archer troops to garrison the city or to protect against mounted troops?

 

[lilnev]

In this case I didn't. Partly because I couldn't (no metal) and partly because hwachas beat up on melee troops, so the only thing to fear are cavalry. Stalin hasn't hooked up his horse yet, but he has now shown an elephant. In the future I'll try to keep a Spear handy. And yes, I'll send an archer or two (or whip them in the conquered cities).

peace,
lilnev

 

[LosBlack]

i like the idea that you went for the UU with the Oracle. not having horses or metal around is tough. i was surprised Stalin had such poor garrisons in his cities. nice run with the SoD.

when will you make time to build courthouses and other infrastructure?

*edit* will you try to maintain scientists in Seoul whilst whipping the city? my current Monarch game has proven this to be difficult.

 

[futurehermit]

very tough start! so far so good though. it will be interesting to see this progress...

 

[Shawnosaurus]

This is a lot of fun to follow. And I won't even go into how much I have learned so far

Thank you!

 

[mscellaneous]

Great thread, lilnev! Very educational. You provided me with some valuable whipping tips.

Thanks for the effort!

 

[lilnev]

i was surprised Stalin had such poor garrisons in his cities.

Me too. Maybe he spent all his hammers on that Big Stone Trophy?

when will you make time to build courthouses and other infrastructure?

*edit* will you try to maintain scientists in Seoul whilst whipping the city? my current Monarch game has proven this to be difficult.

Moscow will whip a courthouse the moment it comes out of unrest. They'll also be priorities (probably after granaries, maybe before or after barracks, definitely before libraries) for any other captured Russian or newly planted cities. Pyongyang and Yaroslavl won't need them, but do want libraries soon. I may never get around to building some of the later infrastructure (markets, aquaducts, etc). We'll see.

Seoul is done whipping for the foreseeable future. In fact I may have whipped too much at the end there. It'll have to regrow before I can work good tiles towards the GL. Not sure what I'll do with it once the GL is completed, and a bit more infrastructure. Extra scientists, mined hills, or more whips are all options. But as you point out, largely exclusive.

peace,
lilnev

 

[cabert]

Did you raze confucianism holy city on purpose?
Or is it just a side effect?
Novgorod was quite big (big enough to whip 3 hwachas ) + on fresh water + had iron and other resources + holy city.
I wonder why you razed it...

 

[sylvanllewelyn]

He didn't want to garrison Hwachas. He wanted the big stone trophy NOW. And in CIV, now is usually more important than later in higher difficulties. Besides, why bother with a Confucian holy city when most of this small world is Buddhist or Hindu? You get like, what, 4 gpt after the shrine, if you even get the great prophet to build it?

Plus, a big city usually isn't so big after a while, because the unhappy citizens usually starve away and you have to whip courthouses and units anyway. With the hapiness limits, any city you keep will be a size 3 city for a LONG time. Unless you have the big stone trophy, in which case your new cities will be a lot happier and a lot more prosperous.

 

[futurehermit]

I think the fact that Moscow also has iron might have had something to do with his decision...

 

[Tyrant Roger]

I would have kept Novograd. With four resources and a population of 8 it was worth retaining even without the fish.

Now, Yakutsk needs to go and be relocated. The other two Russian cities can be kept in Round II when another three Russian cities are captured.

 

[lilnev]

Heh, the truth is a bit embarassing: I had it in my head (don't know why) that St. Petersburg was the holy city.

That said, I don't know that I care. I think shrines are often way overrated. In a case like this, where I'm not going to push Confucianism and no one else is either, the shrine probably wouldn't even return as much as a settled great prophet. And the return on missionaries just to boost your shrine income -- 40 hammers for 1 gpt -- isn't particularly good.

Should I have kept it, just on its virtues as a city? Maybe. Mostly I razed it because I knew I wanted the Fish (food resources are scarce on this map) and felt that relocating it would make for a better long-term site. Though looking at it now, I'm not sure how much better. Plus I wanted to keep my stack moving towards Moscow, and I didn't have garrison troops coming any time soon.

Update coming soon....

peace,
lilnev

 

[lilnev]

Round 2

<Howlin' Wolf, "The Chess Box Set," disc two>

I decided not to ask Stalin for peace just yet. I can build a hwacha, upgrade a warrior to an axe for 80 gold, and recall a couple of the southbound swordsmen to play defence. My main concern is losing a die roll or two and having the Marble pillaged, screwing up the Great Library. But even if that happens, I can probably sue for peace then. And I'm afraid that in ten turns he'll have longbows, making further conquest significantly more expensive.

As it turns out, the RNG favored me this time, as he sacrificed three units to barely damage my troops, then ran away with the archer. Meanwhile my Stack o' Doom has moved against St. Petersburg, finding it, too, lightly defended. Note that Novgorod has been rebuilt under new management as Vladivostok. So I get another chance at it, although it's no longer holy, and not as large.

I took St. Petersburg for one hwacha. A Great General appeared and joined Pyongyang as a military instructor. Revolt to Representation. My defenders from Pyongyang move SE to engage the Russians.

125 AD. I traded CoL+290 gold to Kubai for Currency. I should be able to recoup the gold in a few turns by selling him Lit. Stalin built the Big Chicken in Rostov, which will make further conquest just a bit more difficult. Unless of course I take Rostov next. Man, I'm getting cocky. This game has really sold me on hwachas, I'll say that. They're not praetorians, but nothing is (except praetorians, of course). Right now they're vying with redcoats for second on my list, which is pretty high praise.

Converging on Yakutsk from multiple directions. Brennus has set up a city (Verlamion) in an unfortunate spot. Kublai finally planted his settler on the west coast to access Fish. I wanted that spot.

It's funny, the "Enter screen shot name" box doesn't normally show up in the screen shots, but sometimes it does. Anyone know why? Also, is there a way to get the cursor to appear in screenshots? It might help clarify which stack is being listed.

Mono to Toku for 170 gold. Tech trading is one of the essentials of immortal. In a good game, I can keep my research at 100% virtually the entire game, gathering gold by pillage or tech sales. I must[i/] keep my research at 100% virtually the entire game, or I'll end up too far behind, with nothing worth trading. I'm researching Civil Service, and unhappily surprised to see that Brennus has it already. He's really got too much land. There's a high danger of him running away with the game before I'm in a position to attack.

Moscow now comes out of revolt, and I whip away most of the populace before they can starve. Note: it's very important what the top item in your queue is when you transition from unrest to no unrest. That item will get a turn's worth of hammers (at least one, even if everyone is unhappy). That means that you can whip it at normal cost. All other whips that you do immediately will suffer the 50% penalty for whipping an unstarted item (i.e. 20 hammers/pop instead of 30). Therefore the most expensive item you plan to whip (in this case the courthouse) should be at the top of the queue before the city comes out of unrest. Once you've applied the whip, you can rearrange the queue however you'd like, so there's no requirement that the most expensive item actually be built first. Here's the before and after:

Ugh, Brennus has sent a settler to try to claim some land. He's lurking just north of Moscow. I could raze Yakutsk easily, but I don't have a settler ready to claim the spot I want (west of Horses), and I'm not willing to disrupt Seoul's production schedule to finish the now-decaying settler there. So, I'll leave Yakutsk for now and march on Rostov instead.

I've really let up on the whip, prefering to let Seoul grow and trying to get a library up in Pyongyang. I think I whipped a bit too much earlier (heresy, I know), especially in Seoul.

<Judas Priest, "Sin After Sin">

St. Petersburg came out of unrest and immediately whipped a confucian monastary. The most cultural building I could afford. I need to gain control of one of those Gold mines. While I was shelling Rostov and gathering my troops, Stalin mass-upgraded to longbows. Oh well, hwachas against archers or miscellaneous melee troops was a lot of fun while it lasted. This lineup is pretty marginal, but I don't feel like it'll get better with time (he just sallied with a longbow to kill a hwacha; the wounded longbow would heal and probably promote if I give him a turn). I'm going to go for it. The spot SW of the city has two CR2 hwachas.

Damn. I was on pace for a while. I thought that even if I didn't take it, I would leave him with one or two deeply wounded units, whereas I would have three or four ready to gain a City Raider promotion and renew the assault next turn. But the last two favorable fights went against me. Retreat and regroup. Stalin won't give Calendar for peace, no surprise.

The Oracle finally popped a great prophet, which I settle in Seoul. The lightbulb would have been Theology, which doesn't interest me.

Kublai has Civil Service. Damn again, I'm in serious danger of losing by falling too far behind. Brennus has picked up Lit, so I can't even gain some cash that way. Toku still hasn't attacked anyone, and still won't. Meanwhile, both Kublai and Brennus have gained Metal Casting. I think they're working together, trading everything back and forth. Not much I can do about it. Kublai will give me the rest of Civil Service (240 beakers) and 40 gold for Lit, which I take. Research Paper, hoping it will have some trade value. The next turn, Brennus refuses to trade with me because he fears I'm becoming too advanced. WTH? He's at least six techs ahead of me.

I complete the Great Library in 500 AD. Brennus' settler bounced around for a while, then finally settled on the Furs south of Moscow. Maybe I can flip him culturally, eventually. I think the plan now is to take and keep Vladivostok, claiming Dye and pressuring Kublai for control of tiles, and to raze Yakutsk and replant it just south of the Horse. It's a little bit awkward, but it brings in some otherwise wasted grasslands and allows me to poach the Rice from St. Petersburg (which really doesn't have a food shortage, with triple flood plains). I've fought off some Russian pillagers at the cost of a couple of units.

Seoul resumes work on the long-delayed (and now much-decayed) settler while the formerly Russian cities build a little defense, some replacements for lost offense, then workers. Pyongyang finishes its library, then goes back to military units, but without the whip so I can grow cottages. I finish Paper. Kublai would give me MC+90 for it, but I hold out, hoping Brennus will come back to the table. I'm afraid anything I give to Kublai would end up in his hands immediately anyway.

Brennus' production graph is very troubling.

I razed Yakutsk, allowing deficit research for a few more turns and capturing a worker. Wonsan was founded just south of Horse the following turn. But Stalin is a persistant bugger -- he's sent another settler plus escort, north of the Dye. Researching Education, starting cottages in the south.

Vladivostok will fall soon. Also scattered low-level conflict. I probably want to dispose of Stalin's settler (just south of the desert Gold) before suing for peace. I've begun to despair of him ever giving any sort of tech, though. Research is momentarily at zero in case I need to emergency-upgrade the warrior in Yaroslavl (there's also a spear there, but still). Trading situation hasn't changed, except that I canceled the Sheep-for-4-gpt deal with Brennus, then got 7 gpt for it a few turns later, and I'm sending Marble to Kublai for Clams. Five turns to a great person (~70% GS) in Seoul, which is running its full complement of scientists and building the National Epic -- I should probably cancel that Marble deal, eh? Education is just about 1600 beakers away, so I'm going to switch to Philosophy. If I do get a GS to finish Education, I think I can win the Liberalism race. If not, it'll be tight. No one has Philosophy or Ed yet, but they can't be far off.

That's enough for tonight. Some summary shots:

I'm increasingly pessimistic about my chances against Brennus in a military confrontation. He's just too big, too advanced, too productive. And none of the AIs have shown any inclination to fight each other. Not even Toku.

I'm considering trying for a cultural victory. I generally prefer military victories, but I don't think it's in the cards this time. Wonsan and Moscow both have enough cottage land for culture, and Seoul with its Wonders would do fine. Four religions have spread to my lands. It would probably mean wiping out Stalin first, or at least taking Rostov, but I'm fine with that. Then cottages, missionaries, temples, cathedrals, and hope to keep peace long enough. Right now everyone is positively cautious or low-level pleased with me. I would stop teching after Liberalism (Free Speech) hopefully claiming Nationalism (Hermitage) and try to trade for Music, Drama, and if possible all the way to Banking (Toku favors Mercantilism). The Pyramids would help by opening up US to rush-buy the religious infrastructure. Until next time....

peace,
lilnev

 

[TheArchduke]

Hmm, Novgorod was a holy city and you razed it? Wouldn&#180;t the bad situation be offset by the possibility of building a shrine?

Or is the Monarch player that I am, showing?

 

[LosBlack]

couple of questions (and i ask these hoping for answers, not as passive-aggressive suggestions..excepting #4):

1) how would you rate your economy right now, and at what research % do you break even (oh yeah, and are you running specialists?)?

2) i'm concerned about the power graph. even if Stalin looks beefy due to his defensive units, do you think you can take him out without leaving yourself exposed to Brennus?

3) who's your buddy? do you need to cultivate a good diplomatic relation to help pull yourself along?

4) does a cultural victory attempt mean you'll be listening to Boy George while you play?

the UU seems to be quite a work-horse. i'm tempted to take advantage of the holiday offer from Amazon.com and get Warlords at a discount. all the threads i've been on lately make it seem pretty cool..

 

[lilnev]

After some more thought, I've decided I agree with y'all: I should have kept Novgorod. Particularly because I didn't have the settlers ready for the spots I wanted. I should have foreseen Kublai's land-grab, or at least its likelihood, and not opened up large swaths of prime real estate, hoping it would stay unoccupied. And it's not like it's that bad of a spot when sharing tiles with a Fish city. I guess I got my longer-range dotmap stuck in my head and didn't stop to think carefully enough. I'm still not all that excited about Shrines, though. It's a nice bonus, but unless it's a far-flung religion, not a dominant concern.

1) how would you rate your economy right now, and at what research % do you break even (oh yeah, and are you running specialists?)?

My economy has been so-so. I've been running at 100% almost the entire time since I first attacked Stalin, living off pillage money and sold techs. But I don't have a lot of cottages developed, and the heavy whipping to support the war effort has definitely hurt in that regard. Break-even is around 60%. Besides the two GL scientists, I've been running one or two manually in Seoul, but just lately (now that it's grown up). I'm starting to get workers out, and once I take Vladivostok and mop up the pillagers, it should be safe enough for them to go to work.

2) i'm concerned about the power graph. even if Stalin looks beefy due to his defensive units, do you think you can take him out without leaving yourself exposed to Brennus?

I don't think Brennus will attack me. Our relations have been pretty good. If I do decide to go cultural, I'll be switching to OR soon, which is his favorite civ.

3) who's your buddy? do you need to cultivate a good diplomatic relation to help pull yourself along?

While warring, I prefer to have only one enemy at a time. Stalin. So I haven't adopted a religion or done anything extreme to buddy up to anyone else. I think the key to cultural is to have no enemies. Everyone pleased, or at worst cautious, is better than some friendly and some hostile. If you manage to get a defensive pact, that might (or might not) deter an enemy. But I've only actually played for a cultural victory once, so I might be way off-base.

4) does a cultural victory attempt mean you'll be listening to Boy George while you play?

Heh. Not likely.

peace,
lilnev

 

[LosBlack]

I think the key to cultural is to have no enemies.

i've definitely had enemies in my cultural victories, but a nice sized military slaps that frown right off their face and puts on a nice fake smile instead. granted, the last cultural win was on Prince, and it wasn't too tough to get ahead in power..

looking forward to watching your cultural diplomacy.