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A Simple Poll: Pyramids or Colossus?

Discussion in 'Civ2 - General Discussions' started by Andu Indorin, Jun 15, 2001.

  1. Andu Indorin

    Andu Indorin Retired Druid

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    We've all seen postings on "who likes what Wonder." This is a little more specific. Of the ancient wonders, people usually vote for either the Pyramids or the Colossus.

    And recently, Alan Nicolls, in his "How I Play Civ2," gave high marks to the Pyramids, and ranked the Colossus as a bad investment. I, on the other hand, have made the Colossus the foundation of my approach to the game, while relagating the Pyramids to a "luxury" item better captured later on than built early.

    So, my question is this: Of the Ancient Wonders, which would you build first: the Pyramids or the Colossus?
     
  2. CornMaster

    CornMaster Romulan Commander Retired Moderator

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    First off....I don't regard either with a high regard.

    The whole "Global Granary" has no interest to me because I don't build Granaries to start with. Probably because I don't understand what they do. Anyway....ingorance aside.....if I had a major science or trade city..then I'd go with the colossus. BUT, if I don't have a trade city then I'd spend the shields on settlers and knights. Anyway.....

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  3. infoman

    infoman Warlord

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    I usually build the Colossus first to boost early trade. I then build the pyramids just so I don't have to build granaries in my cities. I would rather build other items (marketplaces & temples) in the cities than granaries to boost trade and keep people happy. Other people will probably build The Great Wall first or maybe even the Oracle depending on their strategy.
     
  4. Smash

    Smash Super Lurker Retired Moderator

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    Collosus anyday.Collosus+Gardens=easy win

    I'll probably use "we love" for growth.The only use a granary would be is to get me to size 3 in new cities faster.Food caravans or settler/enigineer joining city works much faster for that.
     
  5. Kemal

    Kemal Tough Bureaucrat

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    I'd say Pyramids any day. True power is obtained by many cities. Pyramids won't help you if you stick to 4 cities, but if you build 20+ pyramids is a big help. This is also true on deity level, but then you'll need hanging gardens the most! Hanging gardens definitely rule if you want to cope with civilization size unhappiness.
     
  6. Alan_Nicoll

    Alan_Nicoll Chieftain

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    Andu Indorin sez:
    Not strictly correct. The Pyramids I rank as a bargain when you're playing deity level against the computer. When you're going for early Republic at double production/king level, the Pyramids are unnecessary.

    The Colossus I do rate as a loser or close to it. The little extra trade you get isn't worth the 4 Caravans worth of shields. Make Caravans for trade instead! Or make 5 more Settlers. Either is a better bargain.
     
  7. Warlord56

    Warlord56 Warlord

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    Pyramids, your cities can grow faster.
     
  8. Julie_Delpy

    Julie_Delpy Chieftain

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    I'm for Colossus..cause I prefer trade to unhappy people. I feel happy when I see high luxuries on my ditribute window.
    I don't like red-cheeked people dunno why they always are mad at me
    I don't care for my civ to go down to primitiveness at multi-playing. just boldly waiting for other human offering to me , while setting luxury rate high probably 1on1 game might be another.
     
  9. woke25

    woke25 Prince

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    In monarchy, Hanging gardens = colussus, because the city will celebrate, and that gives +1 trade.

    so collussus is overruled by the hanging gardens everytime.
     
  10. BlueMonday

    BlueMonday Can I Kick It?

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    I say Pyramids. They last forever, so you never have to ever build a granary which saves you countless resources and spares all the time to build them (particularly since I build granaries early before I have high production rates, giving me 10-20 turns to build something else). Also, enemies usually build granaries, so when you conquer you can sell them off for extra ca$h.

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  11. Sir Isaac Newton

    Sir Isaac Newton Chieftain

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    What's with all this "which one to build first" debate? Build them both, simultaneously, and the problem is moot.

    But seriously, I usually build the Colossus first. This is mainly because I like to research Bronze Working as early as possible, for a couple of reasons. First, I like phalanxes over warriors as city defenders, so I try to get them quickly. Second, Bronze Working leads to Currency and Iron Working, which let me do my two favorite things: building MarketPlaces for big bucks and bulding Legions to send out to conquer all the nations of the earth! Yay!

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  12. andycapp

    andycapp Grumpy Old Griper

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    I see both the Colossus and the Pyramids as low priority wonders. Playing at Diety level the Hanging Gardens is easily the best option, with the Great Library and the Great Wall as valuable depending on your situation in the game.

    To answer your question Andu, I would choose the Pyramids (if made to choose between the two) only on the condition I already had the Hanging Gardens (or could get it). Because with the Pyramids your cities would grow in size more quickly and at diety level this might actually be a handicap without the affect of the Hanging Gardens.

    [This message has been edited by andycapp (edited June 16, 2001).]

    [This message has been edited by andycapp (edited June 16, 2001).]
     
  13. Andu Indorin

    Andu Indorin Retired Druid

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    Alan,

    Glad you're still following these debates!!!

    The one the thing that struck me in your discussion is the number "15 cities" as being enough {my quotes for a "paraphrase"} for initial expansion. This figure more or less agrees with mine: "12-16 cities" is enough to conquer the world.

    The Pyramids or Colossus? Despite my definite preferences toward the Collosus, it only goes to show: There may be more than one way to skin the proverbial cat.

    I do RECOMMEND reading Alan Nicoll's "How I Play Civ2" ; it is well thought out, and plenty of food for thought (Regardless of a One-Line Braggadacio with the handle E***ofN****)!



    [This message has been edited by Andu Indorin (edited June 16, 2001).]
     
  14. Squirrel2004

    Squirrel2004 Chieftain

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    Pyramids. Counts as a granary in very city. A FREE granary, meaning no maintenaince cost. Also, granaries lead to higher population. If you build a lot of roads around a city, you can use the extra people from the higher population to boost trade in every city. The Colossus boosts trade in only the city it is in. I usually buil;d pyramids first, then the Great Wall or Oracle.

    Squirrel2004
     
  15. Vrylakas

    Vrylakas The Verbose Lord

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    My vote is for pyramids.

    1. They last forever.

    2. By providing a granary for every city they allow, with one step, for lots of early growth.

    3. I like the video better than the Colossus...

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  16. animepornstar

    animepornstar Deity

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    colossus, because the granaries are just usefull in the beginning, untill they starts to love me.
     
  17. Kefka

    Kefka Your local Schizophrenic

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    Yea if your playing the AI but if your playing Multiplayer you might only get one! so now chose your wonder

    I would say I would get the Pyramids because the Colossus only works in one city and it expires later on in the game wereas the Pyramids don't expire and they can really help an expanding empire!
    really what dose the pyramids have to do with storing food! I guess in the world of civ they were built to handle mass amounts of grain instead of being a tomb.


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    <IMG SRC="http://www.grworld.com/vanillacubesgames/files/kefka.gif" border=0>"Why Create things when you know they must be destroyed!"
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  18. EyesOfNight

    EyesOfNight Warlord

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    lol hey, I can't help it if Alan Nicoll is a newbie and doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.
     
  19. Fenrisulven

    Fenrisulven Chieftain

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    Hey! The answer is simple. The Pyramids. I don't even understand why you are discussing it. I consider The Colossus as one of the more useless wonders in the game. And the pyramids as one of the most important, together with wonders as The Statue of Liberty and Leonardo's Workshop. I thought that was fact. But okay, I always play rather big maps. On smaller maps where you don't have so many cities The Colossus may be more important. But on bigger maps it's no question of which one is the most useful. I mean, the key to victory is cities. Many of them and big ones. And besides that, the pyramid lasts forever, the Colossus don't.
     
  20. Simon Darkshade

    Simon Darkshade Mysterious City of Gold

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    The Colussus, even though I sense I am in the minority
    Why? Because trade allows science, then better military, then u can capture Pyramids if someone else builds them. I usually start on Wonders very early on, so getting both is no great difficulty. Pyramids are very useful, don't get me wrong, but Colussus is the first building block in the production of a Super Science City, as well as a trading hub for a lot of the game.

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