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A Soaring Spirit ToTPP conversion

Discussion in 'Civ2 - Scenario League' started by McMonkey, Jun 14, 2017.

  1. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    The attack bonus from Napoleon uses the activateUnit trigger to make changes. This can't work defensively. However, the bonus I used is in the resolve combat trigger, so I can check if the square is shared at the time of combat. However, once combat has started, you can't change the attack and defence of the units in question (I think I tested that at some point), so I damage the units directly instead. We could change attack and defence values during combat if we calculated the combat with lua, and simply set the winner's health to what it 'should' be, and the loser's health to 0. I don't think it would be too hard, but I didn't want to do it.
     
  2. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    I'm hoping to be finished this shortly, then I'll take up @JPetroski on his offer for a quick playtest. I'll play through at least once myself first.

    There's definitely more that can be changed about this scenario, but for me this wasn't meant to be a big project. If someone else wants to play around with it, they're more than welcome. There are both lua and non-lua stuff that can be done.

    Some of the latest changes are:

    On AI turns, rich village defence value is reduced to 0, and the role is even changed to diplomacy. Despite this, the AI is reluctant to attack them. They do sometimes, but not as much as you would expect. Hopefully they'll still attack enough to make things interesting for the player(s). Strategos are also given a monster attack value on AI turns. I'm not going to try to make the AI competent, but at least it shouldn't ruin the experience either in single player, or in multiplayer where a couple tribes are not claimed, by building cities in incorrect spots or anything.

    The effects of Twin Monarchies (communism) change over time. The initial palace distance is 25, but that is reduced for each government tech discovered (by anyone, not the active player). Also, researching War Council (Empire Government, fundamentalism) increases free support from 3 to 4. This will hopefully make it a 'competitive' choice over time, rather than obviously better than tyranny (monarchy), but worse than anything else. If nothing else, it will be boosted for the players that are behind in government research.

    I've also made it so that each turn, each tribe has a chance to receive technologies for which they already have the prerequisites, and which have already been researched by someone. The chance is 1/7 for each tribe that already has the technology.

    This technology diffusion has a couple purposes. The first is to hopefully allow the tech tree to be researched within the now much shorter scenario (80 turns instead of 400). I'm hoping that if players see that other tribes are already researching along a particular path, they'll research a different area knowing they'll receive the techs along the first path eventually anyway.

    The second effect is to keep weaker players (or the AI) from falling too far behind in technology. I'm hoping that a 1/7 chance to spread technologies each turn is low enough that players will still find it worthwhile to get a tech first, but high enough to get most of the tech tree researched. I suppose that with trade still providing a science bonus, players will still do some research naturally, even if they don't want to devote extra resources to it.

    I'm a bit concerned that no one will want to race for currency (trader unit), figuring that others will do the research, and they can benefit for free, and the technology race could stall.
     
  3. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    I decided to give all players the technology for trader units from the start of the game (and the prerequisite tech also). I figured this would be everyone's first tech goal, but with the differences in research capability at the start of the scenario, some players would be at a disadvantage for no reason. This also means that the first 10-20 turns aren't spent getting to currency, which would be a bit of an issue for an 83 turn scenario. Every tribe completes a trader unit in the capital on the first turn.

    I started playing single player with the Athenians, and rapid ship movement means that the game is immediately underway, even with relatively few units. I cut the number of ship recharges available for the transports for the first 4 players, so that they can't get to all the rich villages and back immediately. Fast ship movement means that a lot of goals can be completed in one turn, rather than having to come back and figure out what you meant to do. However, I quickly noticed that Egypt was the only place I was sending trade units, which didn't seem quite right, although I suppose in the regular game, most trade flowed towards Carthage.

    While thinking about a way to limit this, I hit upon a piracy mechanic that seems pretty good. Every square records the number of times a boat that has valuable cargo (settlers and trade units) presses 'k' to replenish its movement (except in a city). When 'k' is pressed to replenish movement, there is a chance that a pirate ship appears, and stops the ship from replenishing movement and moving on. The chance increases by 1% for each replenishment (starting at -2%), and resets after a pirate appears. This will hopefully have the effect of making pirates congregate around high traffic areas, and thereby require either anti-piracy measures, or divert some trade away to less travelled areas. I'm thinking Egypt in particular has only very limited 'access' points for ships, meaning good places for pirates to congregate.

    I suppose this might encourage players to disallow caravan deliveries to their major ports, though I suppose with the new diplomacy model, trade tariffs are much easier to implement, which can fund anti-piracy measures. I reduced the movement of the Liburnae unit to 4, so they hopefully stick around their piracy area.
     
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  4. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    Here's a beta version for anyone who wants to try this out.

    It will definitely need some documentation both in game and with a readme. I may also want to tell the player if their current science production will complete the next tech, and let them know when Oedo years are.

    I may also want some form of penalty for making a sneak attack, which might be too powerful. On the other hand, since (human) strategos don't have the monster attack anymore, sneak attacks might not be such a big deal. Also, there will be fewer ships caught in the open, with the shipping movement system in place.

    A few notes:

    You need the Master Builder improvement to build a wonder, and 4 other wonders must be built before you can start your second wonder. Choose carefully. Note that Eureka Moment (Darwin's) doesn't fall into this system (since it is kind of weak). It doesn't need a master builder, and doesn't count towards determining if you can build another master builder improvement.

    Units defeating Rich Villages are brought down to 1 hp, so they have to go home and recover (probably with the slave they captured). A strategos on the attacking unit's square cancels that penalty. Strategos do 20% damage to the victim unit when on the same square as an attacker, and does some damage to attackers when on a defending unit's square (when the unit is in danger of being killed, the strategos does 2x its firepower to the attacker).

    Press 'k' to restore ship movement points, see the fractional part of the movement to know how many more times you can restore the unit's movement in a turn. Beware not to use up that fractional movement point.

    With only 83 turns and a pretty full tech tree, you are expected to move fast. Try to achieve a tech per turn using traders. Make sure to rush stuff in your cities at least every other turn. With income from trade and village raiding, you should have the cash to do so.

    When evaluating combat situations, take into account hp and firepower. Hoplites attacking rich villages can usually win (unless the village is vet, and the hoplite isn't).

    It might actually be a decent single player challenge to defeat the Persian Invasions, but I'm not sure, since I haven't played that far.
     

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  5. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    I've given Etruscan hoplites the amphibious attack ability, just like all the other hoplites. I'm not sure if that was an oversight in the original game, or if it was deliberate. In any case, the Etruscans will be at a large disadvantage in raiding rich villages without it, so they must have it. I might give them a transport ship to start with as well. However, since they are kind of large already, and a bit remote, it may not matter if they start a turn or two behind the others in terms of trade and raiding.

    I've decided to generate 2 mercenary hoplites when a full health fortress is attacked, just to provide an extra boost to defenses (and allow the minor cities a chance to counterattack against an ill prepared foe. I've also given AI controlled tribes a science bonus so they discover a technology every turn (which should be achievable for human players with trading.

    I'm wondering if as a 'sneak attack' penalty, the tribe that is attacked should get some bonus strategos. For that matter, I'm now inclined to think that a stratego should have a chance of dying each turn, so the player doesn't accumulate them throughout the game. Or, perhaps, a human player must use a stratego against an enemy or he'll go away.
     
  6. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    I hex edited the number of cities for each tribe so that they actually reflect the correct number of starting cities. The Ionians and Etruscans seem to have been used to populate build the minor cities. The problem is that this makes these cities extra unhappy (at least until the city count is reset on the next turn to reflect the captured cities), and some stadiums were placed at the start of the game to compensate. With the correct happiness level, I was able to remove these stadiums, so they don't get sold off by the players.

    I also gave all the minor cities a courthouse (this was fairly easily done with Lua), and gave the Etruscans a transport ship, so they can start raiding on the first turn.

    As far as events go, Strategos now 'retire' after 8 turns, so they are only available for a limited time, if the player wants to make use of them. Tab tells you when the Strategos will retire. Except for documentation, and a possible sneak attack penalty (which I still don't have a good concept for), I think I've done all that I want to for this scenario.
     
  7. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    While playing, I found that shield production wasn't all that valuable, since the cash exists to rush stuff at least every other turn. Therefore, I've doubled the shield production of many terrain types, and increased the mines bonus from 3 to 9 for hills, mountains, and the shield special terrain. Now, working enough shield heavy squares can give 2 turn production, or at least a couple shield rows.

    There is a surprising amount going on in the game, even for relatively few cities. Some of it is planning what villages to raid (or at least finding healthy hoplites to make the attack), since the regeneration rate seems rather high. I'm wondering if village re-generation should only occur on human player turns. On the other hand, village raiding is kind of fun, and provides a source of income separate from trade, even if the AI doesn't do very much of it.

    I'm wondering if I should introduce 'private' colonial ventures. That is, have a small probability of generating colonies at desirable locations for the players. This would give the AI some extra help, and also create some tension between human players (either directly, or through plausible deniability).
     
  8. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    Here's the latest version. I don't expect to make many more changes, but I still want to play at least one game all the way through.

    Not sure if I mentioned this already, but AI tribes get their research boxes filled each turn, so they can progress at the same rate as a trading human.

    I reduced the chance of learning a tech from other tribes from 1/7 per tribe to 1/14 per tribe each turn. I count 70 proper techs available, so perhaps technology diffusion isn't technically needed, but I kind of like it, and it will give some time to play with stuff at the end of the tech tree.

    Rich villages are only upgraded on human player turns, since otherwise you can accumulate quite a lot of slaves.

    The Empire (fundamentalism) government now produces no scientific research, so it can only gain new technologies through the technology diffusion mechanic. There wasn't much else I could do to penalize this government (since caravans aren't affected by the science penalty) other than eliminating the free unit support, which seemed kind of contrary to the purpose of that kind of government.

    Wonders can now be built (somehow I enabled the wonders as objectives flag...).
     

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  9. McMonkey

    McMonkey ----Evertonian---- SLeague Staff

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    Hi guys, how is everyone?

    Sorry for just disappearing. After I lost most of my projects in the memory stick fiasco I was so demoralised, I just couldn't face Civ2 & instead of being here half-heartedly, I thought it was better to have a total break from the game. I was also finding it hard to keep up with all of the Lua developments. I just didn't have the mental energy to devote to the projects (which all seem amazing). I also got involved with the RTS game Steel Division 2 & am now running a Discord server with just over 300 members.

    I checked back in the other day and saw this thread & Garfield's project & it brought back so many happy memories of this scenario. If you start a game, I'd like to get involved. Preferably as my favourites, the Corinthians (if they're in the game, I can't fully remember).

    The changes you've made look ideal!
     
  10. JPetroski

    JPetroski Deity

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    Glad to see you back @McMonkey - can't blame you for needing a break after that one. Welcome back and hopefully you drop in frequently. Lots of fun stuff out there now or on the horizon!
     
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  11. Patine

    Patine Deity

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    Good to see you again, and seemingly in good health and spirits. It seems most posters here take extended breaks from time to time - we can't all be lifers like @CurtSibling and I. Hope to see more of you! :)
     
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  12. Prof. Garfield

    Prof. Garfield Deity Supporter

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    Glad to see you back, @McMonkey .

    I've attached the current version of the game, though I think the only change I made since the last upload was generating 2 mercenary hoplites in minor cities when a human unit sits outside at the end of the turn.

    I have used Lua to make this playable as single player. The AI won't really compete with you, but it won't break immersion by building cities in the wrong spot or anything. As single player, I figure the challenge is to build up enough force to fight the Persians in the condensed time frame. (Haven't played a game to that point yet.) So, start a game as the Corinthians (or, whoever you'd like), and let me know if you run into issues.

    Here is a list of changes that I can remember.
    Keys:
    Escape opens combat log.
    1 opens the 'archives', but not much will be there, since I used the legacy converter for most events, rather than re-write them.
    2 opens the gifting menu.
    3 lets you know your science progress, and when the next OEDO year is.
    K replenishes ship movement, if it is by the coast and not near an enemy warship. See the fractional movement for the ship to determine how many more recharges are available.

    Unit attack and defense are changed to compensate for the removal of stackable terrain (I didn't re-scout for all the players, so some terrain will still show the stackable improvement until you explore it). Mountains and Shield Resource squares will kill the entire stack via events, if a unit is lost.

    Defeating a rich village generates the slave at the location of combat, and reduces the attacking unit to 1 hp, unless a strategos is on the square.
    Attacking from the same square as a strategos does an automatic 20% damage to the defender, and defending on the same square as a strategos also produces bonus damage when the unit is in danger of being defeated. AI strategos still have strong attack (but it doesn't seem to do them much good).

    Many units are now immune to bribery, but units that can be bribed are allowed to be bribed from anyone (I decided to eliminate that house rule).

    Humans now need the master builder improvement to build wonders (except Eureka Moment), and they must have less than 25% of all wonders in order to start a new master builder. The AI is under no restriction. This improvement needs art.

    Twin Monarchy improves as the more advanced forms of government are discovered (by anyone, not the active player). Initially, the palace distance is 25, which I calibrated by having roughly equal corruption under Twin Monarchy and Tyranny in Prasiae. War Council reduces palace distance by 5, and increases free support by 1, and Oligarchy and Democracy reduce palace distance by 10 each.

    Empire government produces no scientific research, and must rely on the technology diffusion mechanic (or gifts) to get more technologies.

    If a tribe has the prerequisites to a tech, it has a 1/14 chance to get the tech for each tribe that already has it.

    Only having Colonists build cities, and colonists/citizens join cities is enforced by events for the human player, not the AI. Only building cities on colony sites is enforced for everyone, and the correct city name is suggested for you. Goody Huts shouldn't produce cities, and if they do, the city will be deleted immediately anyway.

    Pirates have a chance of appearing when pressing k to replenish movement. The chance increases if a tile is regularly used for this purpose by ships carrying valuable cargo like traders and settlers.

    I've done about as much as I planned to do for this scenario, but I'd be happy to help you out if you're interested in modifying it further.
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. McMonkey

    McMonkey ----Evertonian---- SLeague Staff

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    I'm very happy with all of these changes. The condensed timeframe makes sense. I always tended towards epic lengths that were probably impractical, especially for multiplayer. I'll dig out the USB and have a look now :thumbsup:
     
  14. Fairline

    Fairline Emperor

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    Hello Drew, good to see you!
     
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  15. McMonkey

    McMonkey ----Evertonian---- SLeague Staff

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  16. gapetit

    gapetit King

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    I'm glad of your return McMonkey. It was about time 2020 brought something good ;).
     
  17. Tanelorn

    Tanelorn Emperor

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    Yes, welcome back Drew.
    :grouphug:
     
  18. McMonkey

    McMonkey ----Evertonian---- SLeague Staff

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    Thanks guys. I'll try and ease back in. I've got a lot going on at the moment, but I do miss Civ2 & the Scenario League
     
  19. Fairline

    Fairline Emperor

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    I was very tempted by Steel Division, but it seemed a lot was.going on at once and maybe a little tricky to control? I love company of heroes which is a lot smaller scale of course, and combat mission which is of course semi-tbs. Is it moddable?
     
  20. Patine

    Patine Deity

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    I have been known to dabble and tinker with the Age of Empires series, but the Age of Empires 1 and 3 and Age of Mythology Heaven forums are practically dead, and - while the Age of Empires 2 Heaven forums are a lot more active - it's all focusing and moving to a Definitive Edition from Steam I don't feel like shelling out more (with a credit card, which I don't own one of, which would mean invoking favours and deals with family members or buying those pre-paid ones that seem like over-paying) to get. I've already shelled out for a previous Steam upgrade to Age of Empires 2, and one to Age of Mythology, as well as a non-Steam upgrade to Age of Empires 1 over the last 5 or so years. They're fun games, don't get me wrong, and have cool scenario and campaign editors, but they've never fully eclipsed Civ2 in my heart.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2020

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