A use for Fusion Reactor

[swordoflight86]

How many tiles would 100 energy get you? That is the best use I can think of, if what you say about 100 energy being so little is true. Buy a tile, have a little energy in the bank.

 

[Soffacet]

I do think the bonus should be upped a bit (maybe 150?), but at the same time I don't think it's as weak as you are making it out to be.

Remember, the Fusion Reactor goes in the "Spaceship" slot, which is about information about the planet and arguably the weakest slot (or at least "most likely to be weakest"). You're not comparing the 100 energy to a worker or soldier or clinic. You're comparing it to knowing about the coastlines of your planet, or knowing where terrestrial strategic resources are early, or other similar bits of knowledge. Taking the Fusion Reactor is basically saying "I don't need or want that energy, I can do just fine with a classic Civ start with no knowledge of the world and explore manually" and getting some bonus resources for it.

In short, it's the min/max or munchkin option, the Civ equivalent where the guy in your DnD game trades the ability to speak for +1 strength. You forgo your early knowledge of the planet to try to get a building or worker or soldier up for cheap later. I still It does need to be bufed a bit, but it's not nearly as weak as people are making it out to be.

While your comparison is apt, it seems incredibly likely that the "information" perks will almost always convert into better bonuses than 100e. Knowledge of the coast or nest locations directly leads to more efficient/safer scouting. If that leads to 1-2 extra resource pods or saves the life of even one explorer, it was worth it.

 

[Alkyon]

Which is why I'm saying that, even when not comparing it to the cargo options and comparing it to the ship options correctly, it still feels a bit on the weak side.

 

[gunnergoz]

Another way to handle the Fusion Reactor is to include other bonuses with the +100 Energy like +50 research +50 production or something like that, the argument being they dismantle the reactor upon landing, gain tech from reverse engineering it, production from leftover components. Obviously the numbers might need balancing, but it would be like completing an instant quest when you land.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Another way to handle the Fusion Reactor is to include other bonuses with the +100 Energy like +50 research +50 production or something like that, the argument being they dismantle the reactor upon landing, gain tech from reverse engineering it, production from leftover components. Obviously the numbers might need balancing, but it would be like completing an instant quest when you land.

Nice, but I generally prefer a specialized bonus to a generalized one. Increase it to whatever amount of gold is balanced (10 is UP, 1000 is OP.. so there is a balanced amount in between)

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

I noticed on Maddjinn's Livestream that tiles in the second ring cost 50 energy as long as they aren't rough terrain. At some point I will try starting with the Fusion Reactor and a free worker and see how much of an advantage it would be to start with 2 extra basic resource tiles.

 

[OldEarthRelic]

I noticed on Maddjinn's Livestream that tiles in the second ring cost 50 energy as long as they aren't rough terrain. At some point I will try starting with the Fusion Reactor and a free worker and see how much of an advantage it would be to start with 2 extra basic resource tiles.

If it's like BNW, the second tile costs 5 more, so 55. But by the time you get your second pop, you'll probably have an extra 5 energy.

 

[Magma_Dragoon]

Another way to handle the Fusion Reactor is to include other bonuses with the +100 Energy like +50 research +50 production or something like that, the argument being they dismantle the reactor upon landing, gain tech from reverse engineering it, production from leftover components. Obviously the numbers might need balancing, but it would be like completing an instant quest when you land.

That's an enormous plot hole from SMAC. You arrive on another planet in a fusion powered ship, then spend half the game learning how to build fusion plants. How can you reverse engineer something you already know how to build?

I noticed on Maddjinn's Livestream that tiles in the second ring cost 50 energy as long as they aren't rough terrain. At some point I will try starting with the Fusion Reactor and a free worker and see how much of an advantage it would be to start with 2 extra basic resource tiles.

That sounds like what Firaxis intended us to do with it.

 

[Seek]

Other alternatives to the fusion reactor more in line with the other options:
View all mountains (and craters and/or canyons?)
View all dig sites (though I can't think of a handy term to justify this)

 

[Umbral Reaver]

View all dig sites (though I can't think of a handy term to justify this)

Scan for artificial structures?

 

[gunnergoz]

That's an enormous plot hole from SMAC. You arrive on another planet in a fusion powered ship, then spend half the game learning how to build fusion plants. How can you reverse engineer something you already know how to build?

I can think of several sci-fi scenarios that answer the question:

"The colonists are in deep sleep during the flight and a number of casualties happened due to cryo pod failures. Unfortunately, bad planning led to many of the expedition's physicists sharing the same electrical circuit in the cryo room and the failure took out 3/4 of them all at once, greatly diminishing practical experience in the science team."

or
"Arriving on the planet, the colonists find out that the fusion plant's design specs and digital blueprints were archived in a set of servers that suffered a massive fault in their cooling circuits. A sleeping watchstander aboard the mothership had failed to note the problem and the heat buildup in the server memory cores spread to nearby backup server cores, (ill-designed by the lowest IT bidder back on earth,) causing them to fail as well. Reverse engineering the fusion reactor was the only way to obtain the tech specs necessary to replicate it for other cities."

See? Problem solved.

 

[Seek]

Scan for artificial structures?

Good enough for me!

 

[gunnergoz]

Scan for artificial structures?

Oooh, I like this.

 

[Magma_Dragoon]

I can think of several sci-fi scenarios that answer the question:

"The colonists are in deep sleep during the flight and a number of casualties happened due to cryo pod failures. Unfortunately, bad planning led to many of the expedition's physicists sharing the same electrical circuit in the cryo room and the failure took out 3/4 of them all at once, greatly diminishing practical experience in the science team."

or
"Arriving on the planet, the colonists find out that the fusion plant's design specs and digital blueprints were archived in a set of servers that suffered a massive fault in their cooling circuits. A sleeping watchstander aboard the mothership had failed to note the problem and the heat buildup in the server memory cores spread to nearby backup server cores, (ill-designed by the lowest IT bidder back on earth,) causing them to fail as well. Reverse engineering the fusion reactor was the only way to obtain the tech specs necessary to replicate it for other cities."

See? Problem solved.

Cept SMAC is full of lore and nothing explaining the tech disparity ever comes up. I could see mobile fusion reactors being a ways into the tech tree, because those are some crazy forces to put into a backpack.

The fusion core perk is an abstraction of bringing the equipment necessary to pull the ship's reactor apart, bring it down, and put it back together on the surface, and some tanks of helium-3. Those things take up space and mass that could have been a geological survey satellite or a topological survey satellite.

 

[gunnergoz]

Hey, as the pilot said after he crash landed, "I didn't design the &^%-$%^+ thing, I just fly it."

Lets stop getting sidetracked over lore and get to the nitty gritty, i.e. what do you think of a mixed reward for fusion reactor as I was suggesting above, i.e. a flat +50 Energy, +20 Beakers, +20 Hammers? No matter how you justify its presence, it would be a fine 1st turn bonus to choose from.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Hey, as the pilot said after he crash landed, "I didn't design the &^%-$%^+ thing, I just fly it."

Lets stop getting sidetracked over lore and get to the nitty gritty, i.e. what do you think of a mixed reward for fusion reactor as I was suggesting above, i.e. a flat +50 Energy, +20 Beakers, +20 Hammers? No matter how you justify its presence, it would be a fine 1st turn bonus to choose from.

I'd prefer it be unmixed at say 150-250 energy.
(Enough for early tile buys or early unit/building buys)

 

[gunnergoz]

(As an aside, I like how learning that the designers pay attention to the forum's polls, has sharpened and intensified relevant debates around here, maybe even enhanced their focus on practical game changes.)

 

[OldEarthRelic]

You're welcome

 

[Monado]

Other alternatives to the fusion reactor more in line with the other options:
View all mountains (and craters and/or canyons?)
View all dig sites (though I can't think of a handy term to justify this)

I like these two options much more than the flat energy. It didn't seem to fit in with the rest of the spacecraft options. Out of the two, I really like the "view all mountains, craters, and/or canyons option!

 

[Magma_Dragoon]

I think they intended us to use the gold to buy space wheat/space stone tiles. All of the other ship perks are about the map. Wider area to choose for the capital, see strategics, see coastline, see alien nests. I don't think they should or want to turn fusion core into a economic perk by boosting the energy quantity to the point we'd be tempted to save up for a worker or something. I like the idea of giving the player enough money to buy a tile in the third ring on turn one.

If it turns out you get a great landing site and don't need it, good for you. But there is significant value in being able to place the capital in a better long term location while getting those tiles that might otherwise force the capital into a good short term/bad long term location.