A visual experiment: Would you like Civ3 to look like this -->

[Colonel Kraken]

I agree with Dragon King.

 

[Steph]

Here is today's job result : 10 new formations

I will add 3 more formations of 6 units


The onde mae by Kryten (falnking unit at the front)
__O_O__

O_O_O_O


The same, with the flanking unit at the rear

O_O_O_O

__O_O__


The same, with flanking unit in the middle (interesting to put to cavalry unit on the flank, with infantry in the middle?)
__O_O__
O_____O
__O_O__


I need names for these formations.

 

[Kryten]

Marvellous Steph!

As for names, here are some quick guesses.....

Originally posted by Steph
The one made by Kryten (flanking unit at the front)

...."line with reserves", or, "pike & shot"?

The same, with the flanking unit at the rear

...."line with skirmishers", or, "reverse pike & shot"?

The same, with flanking unit in the middle (interesting to put to cavalry unit on the flank, with infantry in the middle?)

...."circle"? (interesting to put some slighty reduced scale cannons on the flank, with infantry in the middle? ).

These are just off the top of my head.
I'm sure someone else could think of better names.

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by Kryten
Marvellous Steph!

As for names, here are some quick guesses.....
...."line with reserves", or, "pike & shot"?

...."line with skirmishers", or, "reverse pike & shot"?

I would prefer something more geometrical. Because your names give an hint about th way they are used.
But a line of 4 and a line of 2 may not always be pike & shot, it could have cavalry for instance. And line with reserve will not be right if the second line is made of archers?

About your idea of reduced size canon : I think the manned canon of PTW are a lot better than the standard one. So if you reduce them, you also reduce the guy manning them, and it should look strange beside normal size unit.

I think the size reduction should be used for all the units at once

 

[Kryten]

Hmmm....I think we might have trouble trying to fit 3 cavalry in a tile in any formation other than a line or triangle....but you are quite right about size reduction and my limited names (see, I told you that I was sure someone else could think of better ones! )

Oh! I just thought.
We can't use figures from PTW, so if we want 'manned cannons', then we will have to convert some foot soldiers to fire them.

And thinking about it, this may not be a bad thing.
A converted Musketeer figure to man 17th century guns....
A converted Tricorne Hat figure to man 18th century guns....
A converted Napoleonic figure to man 19th century guns....
....all with slightly different stats.

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by Kryten
We can't use figures from PTW, so if we want 'manned cannons', then we will have to convert some foot soldiers to fire them ourselves.

Oh we can.Nothing prevent you to build the munits with my tool on you own computer, as long as you don't share it.

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by Kryten

A converted Musketeer figure to man 17th century guns....
A converted Tricorne Hat figure to man 18th centry guns....
A converted Naopleonic figure to man 19th centry guns....
....all with slightly different stats.

I'm very happy to see you have just volunteered to make the crew of 3 new guns

 

[Lab Monkey]

When do you think that this utility will be complete?

 

[Steph]

I would say end of next week end. I have 3 more 6 units formations to add, then perhaps and 8 units formation for square.

Then, I still have several features to add.
- Waiting delay at the end or the start for death/ fortify
- Rotation of unit (to make square)
- Centering offset
- Global variation, that can affect all the figure at once to save time : global centering, and global "spreading"

 

[Lab Monkey]

Can't wait. I'm looking foward to putting some of these units together. Then Civ3 will look like it's supposed to!

 

[Rickhan]

Kryten said,
"So the best compromise that I can come up with is to have the 'standard-bearer' behind the units in all directions except when facing N/NW/NE, when he will be in front of the units......"

I can live with this compromise. As to a historic reference, Banners were carried at the front some/most of the time.

Question, is it possible for someone with artistic talent to create Roman Eagles, Mongol Yak tails, other "national" flags for each civ? To be used with that Standard Bearer?

Once again, THX Kryten, ur the best.

 

[Scipio Africanu]

This wide range of unit formation brings up an interesting concept. For ancient scenarios, instead of having a large variety of different units you could have few unit variety with a large variation in formation. Therefor an inverted V formation unit could be a defensive unit while the wedge formation would have an increased attack ability. For some reason I'm probably guessing this has already been talked about but this thread blew up so fast its hard to keep up with.

 

[Steph]

Originally posted by Rickhan
Kryten said,
Question, is it possible for someone with artistic talent to create Roman Eagles, Mongol Yak tails, other "national" flags for each civ? To be used with that Standard Bearer?

Creating army variation with every national flag is a GREAT idea!

And it could be possible to make the flag era specific.

Like for France :
- Ancient : use a boar, like gauls warrior
- Medieval : Fleur de lys flag
- Industrial : Napoleonic flag, with Blue- white -red with a diamond pattern
- Modern : current French flag

 

[Kryten]

Originally posted by Steph
I'm very happy to see you have just volunteered to make the crew of 3 new guns

Hey, I didn't NECESSARILY mean created by ME!
And as for national army flags for every period....
....."I'll leave it with you".
(We could however have a Roman Aquilifer carrying the Legion's Eagle as the centre figure in the back rank of the Legionary unit, or a flag carrier instead one of the Pikeman in the rear of a Spanish Tercio unit......)

To Rickhan,

I think that for the moment I'll just leave the Civ3 army 'standard-bearers' as they are, as I have soooo much to do and I really want to move on.
I, or someone else, could always change and improve them in the future.

To Scipio Africanu,

Yes, anyone could make any formation they liked....but I for one would much rather use 'multi-figure' units with true historical formations rather than fictitious ones.
Still, as I said before, "free choice for all!"
(The Goths, Alamanni, and various other Germanic tribesmen were very keen on 'wedges', as were the Vikings. And Thessalian Greek Cavalry plus the Macedonian Companion Horseman traditionaly fought in 'wedges' as well, although we may have trouble trying to get more than 3 horsemen in a tile)

 

[Tweedledum]

This may have been posted already (if so, sorry, but I'm far too lazy to read the whole thread ), but how about some mixed formations...

I mean something like Pikemen flanked by Muskets, which would give a good Tercio unit for Spain, or Cannon flanked by Muskets (for the Swedish Infanteri).

Just a thought...

 

[Grey Fox]

Originally posted by Rickhan
Question, is it possible for someone with artistic talent to create Roman Eagles, Mongol Yak tails, other "national" flags for each civ? To be used with that Standard Bearer?

This is not possible with civ3 or PTW as it is.

As the Army unit is only 1 unit that is set under the "Build Army-Unit" in the editor under General Settings.

Although...

Maybe if the army unit would upgrade to another army unit and that to another army unit etc... and each army unit would only be buildable by 1 nation... although on 2nd thought, I don't think that's possible...

 

[Volker]

Is this something I can Download? I would not mind making all of my units look like that. Are the Guys that made Civ3 doing this? Will it be a Patch or something, or just something to DL on the Fourms?

 

[Neomega]

Originally posted by Grey Fox
This is not possible with civ3 or PTW as it is.

As the Army unit is only 1 unit that is set under the "Build Army-Unit" in the editor under General Settings.

Although...

Maybe if the army unit would upgrade to another army unit and that to another army unit etc... and each army unit would only be buildable by 1 nation... although on 2nd thought, I don't think that's possible...

yes it's possible. Just make it civ specific and give it the "army" flag, although I doubt it will fill the "standard bearers flag" correctly, it will still be built and used by the AI just the same.

 

[Redking]

by other formations, but Shaka Zulu's implementation of his Impi is somewhat unique:

A main body, flankers on either side, and a reserve that faces away from the battle (so as not to become too excited/nervous).

 

[Scipio Africanu]

I for one am for true historic formations also, but since only up to six units are involved at a maximum some formations would have to resemble rather then be highly accurate dipictions of their real life counter parts.

For example, I'm interested in creating a Punic War scenario, (hence the name Scipio Africanus, the missing s was a typo ) the Carthaginian warriors using an elipsed rectangular formation - so that the right and left flanks stood further out then the center - prooved highly effective in holding the Roman lines at the battle of cannae. The inverted V formation looks somewhat similier to that, so I'd use that for a defensive Phoenician Heavy Infantry.