Agenda Tweaks 1.2

[ChocolateShake]

ChocolateShake submitted a new resource:

Agenda Tweaks - An attempt at fixing some of the annoying aspects of agendas

My goal with this mod is to fix some of the annoying aspects of agendas, like having Cleopatra and Trajan complaining about things that you can't possibly fix in such a short time-frame.

I've found a way to make it so that agendas don't get enforced as early as they were in the base game. This is done by tweaking one of the agenda requirements, called "Requires_met_10_turns_ago". This requirement is listed on quite a few (if not all) the leader-specific agendas, even though it doesn't...

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[alexanderyou]

Looks interesting, I'll give it a try

 

[ChocolateShake]

Thanks! At the moment it's a crude solution, I figured it would be more realistic and more fun to have them start enforcing their agendas after waiting for some time. I'm looking at tweaking the actual numbers for agendas later, ideally I want to reach a goal where they start slow and work their way up to denouncements.

Some of the agendas may be hard-coded (the only actual requirement I was able to find for the "Queen of the Nile" and "Optimus Princeps" agendas was that they had met the player for 10 turns), but I'm looking for a way to either modify or recreate them using the tools available.

 

[Candido Rondon]

Thanks for addressing this. I loved the ideas of AI agendas, but I think they were poorly executed.

 

[Leyrann]

Any chance you can also change, for example, Kongo's agenda, where it's X turns since you've founded a religion before he can dislike you for it?

 

[ChocolateShake]

ChocolateShake updated Agenda Tweaks with a new update entry:

Enthusiastic Disciple Update - Changes the 10-turn founding delay requirement to 30

The Enthusiastic Disciple agenda has a requirement called "REQUIRES_RELIGION_NOT_RECEIVED" which by default was triggered by the player having not spread their religion 10 turns after founding it. This update changes the 10 turn requirement to 30. The value can be changed in the "newExclusiveAgendas.sql" file.

Along with the mod changing the "REQUIRES_MET_10_TURNS_AGO" to 50, this should now lead to the following behavior:

• If the player founds a religion a couple of turns after...

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[ChocolateShake]

Thanks for addressing this. I loved the ideas of AI agendas, but I think they were poorly executed.

Glad to help! I agree with you, agendas are a great idea, unfortunately it seems they didn't have enough time or couldn't devote enough resources to ensure an effective execution. I think with enough tweaks and changes agendas could make the game much more immersive than previous entries to the series. I like the role-playing aspect of civ, and was quite disappointed to see the AI start behaving in a way that made the game less immersive.

Any chance you can also change, for example, Kongo's agenda, where it's X turns since you've founded a religion before he can dislike you for it?

Thanks for the suggestion! In the process of trying to track down this requirement I learned quite a bit more about how to modify agendas, and I think it could lead to more sophisticated tweaks I found that previously he waited only 10 turns to complain, that number is now 30, you can tweak it further if you'd like by changing the value in the SQL file. If you think I should change that value to something else please let me know. Hope you like it!

 

[Gort]

Out of interest, can you see if the REQUIRES_MET_10_TURNS_AGO stuff changes depending on game speed? 10 turns can be a lot of game on Online speed, but nothing at all on Marathon.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

would this be compatible with quo's fewer AI tantrums?

 

[ChocolateShake]

Out of interest, can you see if the REQUIRES_MET_10_TURNS_AGO stuff changes depending on game speed? 10 turns can be a lot of game on Online speed, but nothing at all on Marathon.

Based on some testing I did today, it seems like the game speed doesn't affect this requirement. I'm still testing out the interaction between this requirement and others on different speeds.

I'm determining whether it'll be possible to automatically change this value based on the game speed, if you have any ideas as to what the default values should be based on the speed I'd be happy to try them out. Thanks for mentioning it, it's definitely an important factor to consider.

would this be compatible with quo's fewer AI tantrums?

I checked quo's mod, it's quite nice! The current version of this mod is compatible with quo's mod, I think it'll remain compatible for a while. The current version of his mod tweaks the values that the AI assigns to agenda violations while I'm currently focusing only on the underlying requirements for agendas to trigger.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

shouldn't the hidden agendas take more time to trigger to give the player time to reveal them? I think that's why fireaxis set them to 30. It might be best to set those to 50 and the historical ones to 30 imo

 

[bladex]

doesn't seem to work France still deno me cos I'm weak in espionage within 50 turns, rome deno me for not expanding etc. what exactly agendas does this tweak if any at all because the ai is still acting like a psycho deno me for still the stupid things.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

mods can only go so far without SDK, after all it's agenda tweaks not agenda overhaul

 

[ChocolateShake]

ChocolateShake updated Agenda Tweaks with a new update entry:

Tweaking the Turns Requirements for Random Agendas

Based on feedback, the following changes have been made:

• The value for the "10 turns met" requirement has been reduced to 30 from 50.
• The value for the "30 turns met" requirement has been from 30 to 50.
• Jadwiga's agenda has been changed to use the "10 turns met" requirement instead of the "30 turns met" one, bringing her agenda in line with the other leader agendas.

Since Firaxis had set Jadwiga's agenda to be "30 turns met", I think that might have been the...

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[ChocolateShake]

shouldn't the hidden agendas take more time to trigger to give the player time to reveal them? I think that's why fireaxis set them to 30. It might be best to set those to 50 and the historical ones to 30 imo

You're right, that's probably why they set them to 30. I made the changes you suggested, though I'll probably have two versions for the "10 turns met" requirement, one for 50 turns and one for 30. Of course players can change the values by going into the XML file and changing the two value fields. The first value is for the leader agendas, while the second is for the random ones.

Sadly like you mentioned there's only so much that can be done without the SDK, most of the leader agenda requirements seem to be hidden in the code rather than in the MySQL database that they allow modders to make changes to. The random agendas are in there though, and it's possible to combine their requirements to recreate the leader agendas. The next items on my agenda for this mod are to look at tweaking the tolerances for some of the modifiable agendas (Pedro, Qin, Peter and Jadwiga have decently modifiable agendas, still looking at the others), and recreating the leader agendas that can be recreated using the random agendas.

doesn't seem to work France still deno me cos I'm weak in espionage within 50 turns, rome deno me for not expanding etc. what exactly agendas does this tweak if any at all because the ai is still acting like a psycho deno me for still the stupid things.

That's strange, I'll do some more testing, so far it seems the majority of people have had it work fine? Are you using any other mods? They shouldn't affect this mod though unless they're explicitly updating the turns met requirements.

I'll check to see if maybe it's starting the turns met countdown without you having to have met them first, though that seems odd.

 

[[to_xp]Gekko]

can you confirm that the values are not affected by game speed? I play on quick so I'll have to reduce em by 33% if the game doesn't do it

 

[ChocolateShake]

can you confirm that the values are not affected by game speed? I play on quick so I'll have to reduce em by 33% if the game doesn't do it

Confirmed, I just tested it out with Trajan's agenda on quick and on marathon, he took the same amount of turns to activate it. It seems like the agendas that have additional requirements may follow different rules however, even though the turn requirement is fulfilled I think there are other factors that the game considers.

Enjoy! Please let me know if you notice anything unusual regarding the agenda timing and if you have any feedback in general.

 

[bladex]

Are you using any other mods?

quite a few

namely

Quo's Fewer AI Tantrums
Smoother Difficulty
TCS Omnibus Mod

but i was told these are all compatible with this.

 

[ChocolateShake]

quite a few

namely

Quo's Fewer AI Tantrums
Smoother Difficulty
TCS Omnibus Mod

but i was told these are all compatible with this.

I haven't been able to reproduce this issue unfortunately, but I'll keep trying. I'm going to check out the DB later today to see if there are any factors that might be changing the values.

 

[ChocolateShake]

ChocolateShake updated Agenda Tweaks with a new update entry:

Smoother diplomacy

This update marks the first attempt at changing the modifiers that result from agendas. It halves all the initial modifier values that result from agendas. I've found that this makes diplomacy more enjoyable when combined with the turn requirement changes.

My next changes will be geared towards possibly replacing some of the agendas I consider "anti-fun", such as Barbarossa's agenda that basically tries to force you to ignore an aspect of the game to have good relations with him.

Feedback...

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