1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

AI attitude

Discussion in 'Civ3 Strategy Articles' started by Bamspeedy, Feb 19, 2003.

  1. Bamspeedy

    Bamspeedy We'll dig up the road!

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2001
    Messages:
    7,691
    Location:
    Amish Country, Wisconsin, USA
    Just to make sure people understand this correctly:

    You can accept lump sum, techs, or maps IF they are also paying you gpt (or giving you a resource) in that deal.

    Example:
    Instead of selling horses for 500 gold and their world map, sell it for world map, 480 gold, and 1 gold/turn. That 1 gold/turn ensures that they are also taking responsibility of making sure the deal is held for the full 20 turns.
     
  2. hotrod0823

    hotrod0823 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2001
    Messages:
    2,753
    Location:
    Connecticut
    How are military alliances, MPP's and ROPs effected?

    In a recent game I was warring with Carthage and brought the Arabs into the war with them giving a luxury in the deal, recieving nothing except the alliance in return.

    It was a race to capture the last Carthage city and I defeated the last NuMerc captured the city. This ended the alliance 5 turns early and the attitude with the Arabs went from cautious to annoyed IIRC. I don't recall if I was shut out from gpt deals later because they were the next target :hammer:. Just wondering for future games.

    Hotrod

    One more thing: In GOTM21 I had a lux for tech deal go south. I traded incense for Lit to a civ connected only by a harbor. 3 turns into the deal I noticed an extra incence I didn't have and turns out the road from the harbor town to the capital was pillaged. I was giving the 20 turn lux for hard goods and was branded for the rest of the game. I was unable to get techs on credit and greatly effected my tech pace. NOW having read this if I had accepted 1gpt, and Lit for my lux I would've not had the black mark for the entire game?
     
  3. Bamspeedy

    Bamspeedy We'll dig up the road!

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2001
    Messages:
    7,691
    Location:
    Amish Country, Wisconsin, USA
    I haven't studied these yet. My tests only had 1AI.

    If you did get the lesser of the attitude hits (+1), they would still go from cautious (0) to annoyed (+1). The bigger attitude hit, would be annoyed (+4), so you can't really tell just by looking at the attitude rank, unless a civ went from the low end of the polite range (-3, -2 or -1) to annoyed (+1, +2, +3). If you finished the game and still have some saves around, could you try loading some old saves and test if you can still make deals or not? I'd be curious to get verification on what happens. Do you remember what was included in the alliance deal?

    That is what my initial tests are showing. If anyone can find examples of where this doesn't work, please let me know.
     
  4. WackenOpenAir

    WackenOpenAir Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2003
    Messages:
    3,124
    Location:
    Eindhoven, the Netherlands
    can anyone explain me why:

    i start with opponents annoyed (on deity, logical)
    - i give them a tech for free, they are polity
    - i do nothing except for more trades, no war, nothing military, new governements arent even invented yet by anyone (its 3000BC)
    -the get back to anoyed again.

    seems there are either more negative things, or the gifts are temporary instead of permanent like stated.

    Is this all changed in some patch or anything?
     
  5. CellarDweller22

    CellarDweller22 Alive And Kickin'

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2002
    Messages:
    150
    Location:
    Kansas City
    Because I felt like this was a legitimate question on page 6 (posted in July), I thought I would repost it:

    How much DOES rep matter? Are trades with a gracious civ any more to the human's benefit than trades with annoyed civs?

    Great work here! :goodjob:

    -- From The Cellar :smoke:
     
  6. Grille

    Grille panel insect

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2002
    Messages:
    2,709
    Location:
    Kiel, Germany
    For attitude (not rep!) dependent trade revenues/investments, take a look at Zwingli's study.
     
  7. CellarDweller22

    CellarDweller22 Alive And Kickin'

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2002
    Messages:
    150
    Location:
    Kansas City
    Great thread! Thanks, Grille! :cooool:

    So..... in all your spare time, do you guys actually get to PLAY the game?? ;)

    -- From The Cellar :smoke:
     
  8. Bamspeedy

    Bamspeedy We'll dig up the road!

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2001
    Messages:
    7,691
    Location:
    Amish Country, Wisconsin, USA
    Yes, gifts are temporary. I had changed this in my first post, but I think the War Academy might still say this is permanent (I can't edit the War Academy, only Thunderfall can). Gifts de-value at the rate of 10 gold/turn. So if you give them 1000 gold, they will stay at the maximum happiness (-10) for 90 turns, then lose 1 point each turn for 10 more turns so that after 100 turns the 1000 gold is completely forgotten.

    The starting techs aren't worth much (100 gold or so), so that usually won't keep them polite for very long.
     
  9. binyo66

    binyo66 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2003
    Messages:
    820
    Location:
    Indonesia
    Very good thread!:goodjob:

    Bamspeedy I have 2 questions for you (or anybody) :

    1. I don't like using ICBMs, but if they use them first to attack my cities, I usually just launch my ICBMs to theirs:rolleyes:. Is that effecting my rep ?

    2.I am as Roman Demo. and have culture leads, and the most powerful civ, and owner of the second large continent. Before the war, every civs were polite (I trades luxs, and uranium to them), and having ROP with every civs (GR, UK, US, Aztec, and Iraq).
    I need uranium which I trade with US for 190 gpt.
    Then I signed MPP with GR (the most powerful civ on the main island), followed by UK. GR and UK become cratious. GR had MPP with US (the 3rd strongest). Then everything screwed up, UK attacked US. The status was :
    I was at war with Iraq, Aztec and US.
    GR was at war with Iraq, Aztec, and UK.
    Iraq and Aztec was at war with every civs.
    What I saw on the Foreign Screen, Iraq, Aztec and US were cautious. GR and UK were still cratious.
    The first turn after the war, Iraq and Aztec landed some units to my mainland, and destroyed my rails. So I killed them.
    The foreign Screen showed Iraq and Aztec were furious.
    In couple turned I landed in the main continents around 60 MA/MI and 4 Armies supported by carriers and bombers, destroyed Aztec, but didn't razed any city (I always took the city when the city size was at most 6, bombard them, so no much resistants). But still could not find uranium.
    I don't want to make war with GR, at least not in short turns (He has more ICBMs than me, and I couldn't make it anymore, SDI still couple turns to go).
    Already arround 8 turns, and I noted:
    GR never attacks UK (which force me to declare war on GR).
    US never attacks me (which force GR to declare war on US),
    and I didn't want to attack US either (but UK doesn't seem to bother, he keeps attacking GR, but luckily not in GR areas). I need US's uranium, is there anything I could do to trade uranium with US without my rep hit (until now, US still cautious to me)?
    3. Just for my preparations, I place bunch of MA/MIs next to GR cities which has ICBM. If either one (GR or Me) declared war each other, do I get rep lost because of putting my units in GR territory?
     
  10. Bamspeedy

    Bamspeedy We'll dig up the road!

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2001
    Messages:
    7,691
    Location:
    Amish Country, Wisconsin, USA
    If YOU declare war (or you are forced to declare war because of a MPP), then you get the rep hit for having units in their territory.

    If they declare war (or they are forced to declare war on you because of a MPP), then there is no rep hit for you.

    MPPs are tricky, because someone else could screw up your rep for you by triggering a MPP while you happen to have 1 unit in somebody's territory.
     
  11. Sarevok

    Sarevok Civ3 Scenario Creator

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    8,407
    Location:
    Vancouver, WA
  12. CaptainCivFreak

    CaptainCivFreak Arsenal Gunner

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2003
    Messages:
    206
    Location:
    Arizona, United States
    No wonder they all hate me... I always used privateers & nukes... ha ha...
     
  13. CIVPhilzilla

    CIVPhilzilla Reagan Republican

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2003
    Messages:
    4,714
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    Do you know the effects of giving them a city?
     
  14. Beamup

    Beamup Higgs boson

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2001
    Messages:
    1,318
    Location:
    Boston
    If you look a ways up earlier in the discussion, it's just like any other gift. Precise value unknown, IIRC, but easily enough to get you the maximum bonus.
     
  15. StinkBait

    StinkBait Chieftain

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2003
    Messages:
    17
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Classified
    would giving an AI 100gp/turn count as a one time gift or would it's effects last the 20 turns? :confused:

    BTW this is one of the best articles I've read on Civ3 - really learned a lot. Thanks!
     
  16. USC

    USC Unity Scout Chopper

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2003
    Messages:
    92
    Location:
    Czech Banana Republic
    What an insanely detailed article! ;-)
     
  17. Caesar_Augustus

    Caesar_Augustus in vino veritas

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2002
    Messages:
    176
    Does the penalty come from just building them, or do I have to actively attack the AI to get an attitude hit?

    What if the AI attacks the Privateer? Does that make a difference?
     
  18. Bruindane

    Bruindane Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 11, 2004
    Messages:
    92
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Is it plausibe that an enemy civ (in a declared war) could vote in your favor to become Secretary General?

    Assuming war is not an instant disqualifier, can you improve an enemy civ's attitude to polite?
     
  19. anarres

    anarres anarchist revolutionary

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2002
    Messages:
    6,069
    Location:
    www.civ3duelzone.com
    Nope. AFAIK the best you can get at war is annoyed, which you can often get after a very long "cold" war (no shots fired).
     
  20. Hygro

    Hygro soundcloud.com/hygro/

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2002
    Messages:
    21,807
    Location:
    San Antonio, Texas
    I've had cautious multiple times, and the screenshots to prove it (I think). I've heard of polite.
     

Share This Page