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AI culture imbalance

Discussion in 'General Balance' started by ElliotS, Feb 4, 2018.

  1. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    I like reals. Anyone care to back up their claims here with data from the handicap log? It tells you explicitly how much culture each AI is getting.

    G
     
  2. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    How can I find the thingamajig to remove/halve Culture from AI handicaps? Playing Cultural with Inspiration, God-King and Mastery while being two policies behind mere Shaka on Emperor is annoying. I found DifficultyModA/B/C, DifficultyMod thing in one sql, but I checked and they affect everything according to era, not merely Culture which is the area of AI assistance I am annoyed with. I hope changing stuff here doesn't require you to be a DLL sorcerer?
     
  3. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    I'm afraid so. It was lua code.
     
  4. Txurce

    Txurce Deity

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    Are you trying to isolate where (or if) the AI culture output separates significantly from the human?
     
  5. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    Hate to ask this again.
    Following the sticked thread on how to report on Github (https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/bug-reports-–-please-read.566461/), there's a link on how to enable logging: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/how-to-enable-logging.487482/

    But it doesn't say to enable AIlog = 1. (So I didn't), and I recall you saying there was another thing that needs to be enabled that is not in the guide.

    Could it be added to the sticked thread? Just after the link? This would help other players wishing to provide full logs.
     
    Infixo and vyyt like this.
  6. Mad Madigan

    Mad Madigan Prince

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    What surprises me about the AI and culture from the last few beta patches is not that all AI seem to be rolling out with more culture all of the sudden, but that leading AI civs that take the lead early seem to be capable of snowballing out of control very early if the human player doesn't aggressively attack as soon as possible. In my last game as Spain the two leading AI civs were The Ottomans and Mongolia (Communitas, Large, Epic, Emperor, No events) and I had to grind against them throughout the first 2/3rds of the game to match them in tech gains and culture. The Ottomans in particular were seeming to produce 2-3x as much culture as any other civ and the only reason they weren't producing more is because I allied up with Morocco who was sending ships and horsemen out to pillage the Ottoman trade routes all game (so they weren't even getting much culture from their UA). Mongolia had Inspiration as part of their religion so them producing more culture made sense, but the Ottomon religion had Mastery.

    Although it feels good to really have to fight aggressively with AI at higher difficulties or be left in the dust, I am really wondering if the AI is getting too much bonus culture (and only culture, their other bonus yields feel about right). I can imagine nightmare scenarios with an AI China or Brazil with Inspiration that could just rocket through the policy trees if left unchecked, but it is strange to see AI Civs with UAs not geared towards culture generation also managing to crank through policies so quickly.
     
  7. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    You do.

    Yes. I just like numbers. Knowing exactly how much culture is due to handicaps (as compared to, say, buildings or processes) would help us diagnose things.

    You need to yes. I don’t tell all to enable AI logging because 90% of bug reports are mod conflicts.

    G
     
  8. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    I made the modifications in config.ini, set AIlog to 1, reloaded my game, and played a few turns, but I'm not getting any new log. What can be wrong?
     
  9. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    Oh well, I better grab my wizard staff and proceed to learn how to do it then. Devilry's Loathsome Leviathan (DLL) needs to be made to serve the man's purposes, not the other way around.
     
    vyyt likes this.
  10. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    Hmm. Enable all things with logging in there except for builder logging.
     
  11. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    Egypt 265 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 1: Received Handicap Bonus (43 in Yields).
    Egypt 268 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 2: Received Handicap Bonus (29 in Yields).
    Arabia 268 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 2: Received Handicap Bonus (19 in Yields).
    Egypt 269 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 4: Received Handicap Bonus (43 in Yields).
    Arabia 269 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 8: Received Handicap Bonus (0 in Yields).
    Arabia 270 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 2: Received Handicap Bonus (19 in Yields).
    Egypt 272 CBP AI DIFFICULTY BONUS FROM HISTORIC EVENT 4: Received Handicap Bonus (43 in Yields).

    Can you make anything out of this? King difficulty.
     
  12. Enrico Swagolo

    Enrico Swagolo Deity

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    I've done it, I think. The game starts, so if anyone wants to nullify the Culture handicap from wonders/gps/etc, you can unpack it in (1) community patch for the same result without the need of messing with DLLs. I don't know how to halve it, but I bet it'd be the same equation with a / 2. No clue where to put it, so only removal. For some reason it weighs a bit more than regular despite me only removing code, which is suspicious though easily explainable by different VC versions used or something, so use it at your own responsibility. Works on my end, though.
     

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  13. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    Yup. The last number (x in yields) is the amount of culture they get.

    G
     
  14. tu_79

    tu_79 Deity

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    Is it ok to have 0 yields? If it is going to yield 0 wouldn't it better just not triggering?

    Currently in my game, Polynesia has eaten Germany and is the big warmonger, Ottomans and Arabia have fought several times, and Egypt and I (Austria) share our small continent in peace. But in those 5 turns only Arabia and Egypt are getting any handicap bonuses.
     
  15. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    0 == an invalid historic yield for difficulty, such as a dig. I want the logs of all of them so I can know trigger counts.
     
    bigcat88 and tu_79 like this.

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