AI too aggressive

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Volcanon

Prince
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Messages
302
I've had a hard time getting very far into the game because the AI just insists on endlessly attacking me and not stopping until I completely crush them. And then I have a rediculously huge empire and just smash the rest of the factions easily.

And if I ratchet down the difficulty then I just auto-win anyway.

Any patches for this?
 
Hi Volcanon!

That's always been a complaint about the game, that the AI attacks you even if it doesn't make sense. There's no patch that addresses this issue. A couple of suggestions:

1. When you start a new game, go into Custom Game Rules and make sure that Intense Rivalry: Opponents More Aggressive is not selected. Or if it's not selected, turn it on and see what happens. I seem to recall a theory that turning on this option will make the AI more aggressive towards each other so perhaps they'll leave you alone. Can't remember if that actually works, though.

2. Play on larger maps. The further the AI is from you, the harder it is for them to attack.

HTH

Petek
 
Huge map does help, though the game seems to like to lump nearly everybody on the same continent anyway.

And yeah, the AIs do seem to be irrational in attacking. Or sometimes they do when it makes sense and take a few cities but when I get the upper hand they refuse to sign peace even when I've overrun half their bases. If they eventually over a submissive pact, its only when their capital and core is mostly gone.

Believers are the worst. Do they get their anger-on if you go democratic, or are they just programed to auto-hate gaians? And usually they are on the other side of the planet, but when I get over there with shard copters, they have impact rovers and other outdated junk.

Seems to me that the only way you'd make it up the tech tree is if you've won already.
 
I like to play as University, but always seem to have Hive as neighbours. my favoured way to keep them off my back is terraformers on land and water to dig a big trench between us. The bigger the map, the better this works.
 
I think its actually kinda cool that the AI is smart enough to fill in canals to get to you.

If I play greens I'm always beside spartans or believers. And even if I go police state I basically have to force them into submission for them to stop trying to attack me.
 
As people have been alluding to, SE choices can make the AI players agro quite quickly if you choose something that counters their agenda. There's something to be said for Frontier & co. if you don't want to have to pick something that's going to make you fall behind.
 
I'm currently playing as Drones and I found the Morganites within about 40 years and he threatened me, demanding money, so I guess your faction strength is also a factor towards AI aggression. When a faction threatens you to give money, they will always declare war on you.

The Morganites were crushed by me and Miriam as soon as they did that.
 
Yeah, the AI can definitely be aggressive at times. I have no idea how it works but I guess there are different or random factors regarding the AI's in each game. Some AI's are already at "Seething" when I first meet them. Sometimes I found a "Pacifist" AI even worse to deal with than an "Aggressive" one.


I do have to say, despite some of the AI's flaws, it really can affect me during gameplay. I actually felt hurt when I thought a faction I had a good relation with started extorting money from me, or when an ally backstabbed me. However, when I do have a good ally, I often find myself doing anything I can to keep them safe and protect them in a war.


I don't know exactly how to describe it, but the way diplomacy is implemented actually makes me care about what the other AI's are doing and actually making me feel hurt or happy when interacting with them. In the last game I had an AI which gifted me free techs, that really surprised me and made me feel in his debt (Zakharov - Pact Brother) for quite some time during the game.



I always thought the AI of the aliens is the most scary. I often feel uncomfortable when I'm next to them. They can declare war without provocation, they are often more difficult in diplomacy than the other "Aggressive AI's", and in the early game their military can really overwhelm you fast. They seem to stagnate though in the middle and late game IMHO.

===


I usually play on Huge maps so that there's often enough space between the factions. Unfortunately you can't be friends with everybody, most of the time I try to pick a faction nearby if possible with a SE choice that is the same as mine to become friends with. It's no use IMHO trying to invest in a friendship with an AI who has a different SE preference.


Some things I do to keep the AI away at the start:


- Give in to their demands. It can be humiliating but it will buy you some extra time to build your empire.
- If you have a strong and hostile neighbour, don't give in to the temptation to use an SE choice that's different than theirs. In those cases I keep "Frontier" a while longer.
- If you play Alien Crossfire, don't sign a Treaty with either Alien faction. IMHO it gives more trouble than it's worth unless one side is weaker than you.
- Try to engage in tech trades when you can, it often seems to improve the AI's opinion of you.
- When I'm rich, I often gift some money or techs to other less friendly rivals. It can help you for a while and it improves their opinion. Gifting a less important tech can give you some breathing room for a few more turns.
- I try to mediate for peace between factions early on in the game. If you're friends with an AI that is at war with your powerful neighbour it can quickly lead to problems.
- Try to switch between building infrastructure and military. I can't shake the feeling that the other AI's will make more demands from you if you're weak militarily. (In one game the Believers were "Seething" with me and made demands. When my military became a lot stronger their opinion improved to "Obstinate" and later "Noncommittal". I noticed they didn't make demands anymore.



- If you have Alien Crossfire, use the AI editor to set the AI personalities to "Pacifist" and remove "Conquer" from their research Priorities (This way they'll focus more on infrastructure and less on building an army). It's not a guarantee it will work, but at least it might give you a better and more peaceful start.
 
Nice tips there, but I've rarely needed to submit to AI demands these days. However, it has cost me in one game when the Spartans landed their forces straight after (like 1 turn) they declared war on me and I was screwed. I had no forces at all. They captured a base, I eventually got it back after hurrying up production on troops but then I lost it again and I thought I wouldn't last.

What really amazes (but mostly annoys) me with AI is when they call you "arrogant" for not giving them tech for free, but heed my previous message: any faction whether pacifist or not will declare war on you, even without choosing SE choice that is contrary to their choice.

Slightly off-topic: since AI factions can plead mercy to surrender, can they demand (or allow) you to surrender if you are in a bad position?
 
Thanks. :) And you're entirely right, it's not always necessary to submit to an AI demand. But sometimes I do it even when I'm stronger. At times I don't want to be in a war when an AI can strike first because they can still do a lot of damage. It's no fun giving in to their demands, but it gives me a chance to position my forces. After that I contact the AI (Relations are already bad most of the time) and demand money from them and usually they then declare war too. (Although sometimes they give in, as if they know what I'm up to)


Yeah, I've been in situations like you described with the Spartans as well. Sometimes the AI can really surprise you, I've been in situations I really had to fight to survive. (Against the Hive. Man, when these guys get into war, they mean it.)


It annoys me too regarding the "arrogant" part. They say "Friendship is a two way street" but often it seems just to come from the human player. I do have to say when an AI is your Pact Brother it can really turn into a great alliance. I'm still surprised Zakharov gave me free techs in an earlier game. ("Guard this knowledge carefully, and do not forget my generosity")



One of the reasons an AI keeps attacking or betraying you, might be because of a checklist within the game. I cheated in one game and looked at the AI settings in-game. One AI (The Hive) kept declaring war. Within the settings I noticed this was checked: "Shamelessly betray human players"/"Team up against human players")

It seems that even if an AI doesn't have a reason to attack you, the game might force the AI to attack you anyway. Often the Hive, Believers and the Caretakers/Usurpers have these options checked/enabled. Also, when you see "Commit atrocities wantonly" checked, don't let that AI get Planet Busters, they'll really use them!


===


That's a very good question. Personally I can't remember I've ever seen an AI do that. It might be possible, but I do notice that (Unless you've used a Planet Buster or if you really betrayed them) the AI will give you enough chances to make peace after taking a few cities from you.
 
sendos said:
Nice tips there, but I've rarely needed to submit to AI demands these days. However, it has cost me in one game when the Spartans landed their forces straight after (like 1 turn) they declared war on me and I was screwed. I had no forces at all. They captured a base, I eventually got it back after hurrying up production on troops but then I lost it again and I thought I wouldn't last.

What really amazes (but mostly annoys) me with AI is when they call you "arrogant" for not giving them tech for free, but heed my previous message: any faction whether pacifist or not will declare war on you, even without choosing SE choice that is contrary to their choice.

Slightly off-topic: since AI factions can plead mercy to surrender, can they demand (or allow) you to surrender if you are in a bad position?
Click to expand...

The game doesn't allow the human player to "surrender" to the AI and become its puppet, if that's what you're asking.
 
If you want to experiment with a less aggressive AI you can change the faction files a little bit.

A line from the Gaian faction file:
Gaia's Stepdaughters, The Green, Gaians, F, 2, Deirdre, F, -1, 0, 0, 0, 1,
Click to expand...

The -1 in that position makes Gaia a pacifist. There are 3 possible settings 1,0,-1 for that position. -1 is least aggressive and 1 is most aggressive.

I suggest you set all of the extra aggressive factions(hive, spartans, believers) to 0. For a strange game, set all factions to pacifist. Everyone will be in a treaty or a pact of brotherhood. This will grant huge trade route bonuses and research/gold will explode.

If you set all factions to -1 and one to 1, the aggressive faction will steamroll everyone else and become a runaway AI. So watch out.
 
Elliot said:
If you want to experiment with a less aggressive AI you can change the faction files a little bit.

A line from the Gaian faction file:

The -1 in that position makes Gaia a pacifist. There are 3 possible settings 1,0,-1 for that position. -1 is least aggressive and 1 is most aggressive.

I suggest you set all of the extra aggressive factions(hive, spartans, believers) to 0. For a strange game, set all factions to pacifist. Everyone will be in a treaty or a pact of brotherhood. This will grant huge trade route bonuses and research/gold will explode.

If you set all factions to -1 and one to 1, the aggressive faction will steamroll everyone else and become a runaway AI. So watch out.
Click to expand...

Good tip! I'll have to try making all the factions pacifists and see what happens.
 
As a challenge I "supercharged" the factions and made the AIs more expansionistic. Stuff like Spartans starting with Industry +6 and Growth +6.

... The Gaians with Fung Nutrient +3 and Fung Mineral +2, Green +6 took over most of the world aside from Believers (distant island), Hive (who had something like Industry +6, Growth +6), and Peacekeepers.

I still won, but it was at least more of a challenge.
 
Some good players can manipulate the AI factions to the extent that they can gain much and lose little in diplomacy most of the time. I'm more of an "ignore them until they vendetta player". I'll make treaties and trade or buy tech, but I never give in to demands and I run the SEs I want. Somewhere there is a guide (I'm sure) that explains the little tricks to manipulating the AI. I know having a less than top two power rating is helpful as long, as the top two factions on the power graph tend to tangle with one another, and all factions tend to drift towards hostility with the top dog.
 
I’ve played a short game this weekend as the Peacekeepers with all the original factions. I set all the AI’s to pacifist and to the “build” priority, except for Deidre which was set on “Explore”. I also enabled the option for each AI to build a lot of terraformers during the game.

It was a fun game, eventually war broke out after 2300 when Miriam declared war on me and then all factions got involved but before that everyone was at peace and focused on building an infrastructure. Eco-damage was minimal for a long time as the AI’s really seemed to focus on limiting it. They were popping out Tree Farm’s and Hybrid Forests everywhere, as well as Deirdre building a lot of Centauri Preserves.


When war did broke out, all the AI’s had a nice infrastructure in place and build out a strong army pretty quick. It was fun to see Deirdre’s army being different from the others as it mostly consisted of big Mind Worms.


It was interesting that some AI’s that are generally weaker with normal settings where now doing very well, especially Miriam and Santiago. Miriam had several size 12-14 bases with Hybrid Forests everywhere and Santiago, while being smaller, had some very attractive and well developed bases too. In my games they normally always fall behind mid-game. Deirdre even had size 16 bases at this point surrounded with Forests.


The only AI who did not as good as usual was Yang. He had a well-developed empire but was lagging behind technologically. (Probably due to the economy) I guess the AI for Yang really does work better with the “Aggressive” setting.


The only modification I made in the Alphax.text was disabling all air units except missiles/Planet Busters/Locusts.


===

I've played the game on the map below. The map is made by Kilkakon and it's really awesome. The AI also seems to feel really at home here.

His map really brought me back to Alpha Centauri again. :)


http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=15918
 
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