They have been there the entire time I have been using Worldbuilder. There were twice as many, but half of them disappeared when R&F was released.
All Quiet on the Civ Front
- Thread starter Duuk
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We have this discussion quite a bit around here. Paradox follows kind of a hybrid between "game company" and "MMO model" where they offer expansions every few months at between $10 and $20 (under their new pricing model) but offer free updates that go with those expansions, essentially gating some of the content behind paywalls while funding continuous patching with the expansions. It works for them but can also be a bit daunting for a "new" player that opens CK2 for the first time and "sees" that the "full game" costs $500 without realizing that the game comes with all of the development but with some features gated and you can pick and choose what you want.
So there are pros and cons.
acluewithout
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EU4 have this bundle called “Founder Pack” which has sort of what Paradox think is the core expansions. I think that’s quite a neat way to do it.
If Civ VI doesn’t pull its socks up, and assuming I have some time, I thought I’d get that plus Rule Britannia and see if that scratches the itch. The only reason I haven’t is just the effort of learning a new game, being slightly exhausted at the idea of a rea time game instead of turn based, and (to a small extent ) cost.
Disgustipated
Deity
I actually want to try these games, I have never played them before. But to me it does seem daunting. There's too much stuff out right now. I'd rather start fresh with a new game. But I doubt EU5 is coming out anytime soon is it? In some ways I prefer the Civ model. It's easier for a casual player to get into. If it's a game I really really love, I would buy all the dlc. Civ6 is actually a game I really really love where as Civ5 I did not buy all the dlc, only expansions.
Leyrann
Deity
I started playing CK2 only last month, and while the barrier of entry was pretty high I feel like that didn't really have much to do with all over-time content and rather just by the game itself being complex. Even then, an hour or two of carefully reading the hints provided for every single screen I came across gave me a good enough starting point.
And since... Well I'm at about 120 hours in a month's time.
I've tried and tried to like EU4 but it never became very fun for me.
The pausable real time feels a bit funky for me, even though it can be paused it feels there's always something you forget.
Also there are loooooong times where you just put the speed to fast-forward and wait for some stupid meter to fill. Even though it's very sandbox game, somehow I feel the games have always the same pattern: fabricate claim, annex, repeat..
In theory it's fun that you can play as some minor uncivilized tribe, but in reality it's even more fast forwarding when they have so many mechanics forbidden to them.
Just no my cup of tea I guess
The pausable real time feels a bit funky for me, even though it can be paused it feels there's always something you forget.
Also there are loooooong times where you just put the speed to fast-forward and wait for some stupid meter to fill. Even though it's very sandbox game, somehow I feel the games have always the same pattern: fabricate claim, annex, repeat..
In theory it's fun that you can play as some minor uncivilized tribe, but in reality it's even more fast forwarding when they have so many mechanics forbidden to them.
Just no my cup of tea I guess
The Kingmaker
Alexander
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The problem as I see it should is that Firaxis should keep attention on the game with regular DLC packs every 2-3 months, irrespective of when the expansions come out. It could even just be something small like a scenario or map pack. That keeps interest high and keeps fans playing the game.
These long waiting periods with no updates at all cause people to lose interest, likely leading to lower numbers buying the later content.
I have a lot of friends on Steam who have the game. Do you know how many have played the game recently? None of them.
Come on, Firaxis. It’s the 21st century now.
These long waiting periods with no updates at all cause people to lose interest, likely leading to lower numbers buying the later content.
I have a lot of friends on Steam who have the game. Do you know how many have played the game recently? None of them.
Come on, Firaxis. It’s the 21st century now.
Does the 21st century still have anecdotes?
Everybody has their idea on what they think a good business strategy is. Some people have legitimately good ideas. The problem here is twofold.
Firstly, it's a lack of understanding around the finesse in marketing video games. No joke. Some of the adverts may be dumb, may be overblown, and so on, and so forth. Some may be nonexistent. But there is a stupid (literally, sometimes stupid) amount of research (and often budget) that goes into these things, and a lot of it is market research. You can't say "look at game X, it does this". Well, you can. But it's only a factor. It's not a deciding reason, case closed. It's a factor, weighed against release windows, internal deadlines, quarterly reports, hiring windows (lot of temp. staff in video games, particularly around peak times during a project). What you think is a surefire idea is something that not only have most companies already thought of, they've already got it down on a spreadsheet next to 19 other things. Against a matching column that has 20 opposing things.
Secondly, you still have no idea whether or not your suggestion is actually good. To take a hypothetical, are scenarios good? Do map packs sell well? Do you know? We'd assume Firaxis know, and if not, we'd definitely assume 2K know. If these aren't selling, do you honestly think an AAA publisher would somehow not take advantage of this hypothetical gravy train? There's one thing we can rely on business to do, and that's to turn a profit (or try to at least). For better or worse, regardless of the results. That's what drives the machine.
You want your idea to be good. And to me that's great, as a fan of video games, I love ideas. They keep developers interested (believe it or not), and they keep people reading. The problem is when you don't stop to consider that maybe your suggestion has been considered, and start needling folks about it.
WillowBrook
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ltest branch updated again this afternoon. That's 3 business days in a row.
RohirrimElf
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Give Europa Universalis 40 hours and you should be loving it. Its a game that gets better and better when you understand the basics. The most important resources are money, manpower and monarch points.
RohirrimElf
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Is this a good or bad sign?
That seems like it means there are confirmed to be only 8 civs.
WillowBrook
Lurker
Probably a good sign that if it turns out to be anything we care about, we'll know what it is sooner rather than later.
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EU V isn't coming out soon. Crusader Kings II is still receiving expansions, and it came out a year and a half before EU IV (which is itself five years old now... kinda hard to believe but it does make my 900+ hours of playing it seem slightly less excessive). Paradox did recently say that CKII is approaching the limits of what they feel they can make of it with their engine, so perhaps Crusader Kings III will arrive in a couple years... although I'm hoping for Victoria III first.
If you want an earlier EU IV experience, you can select some fairly early (2014) versions from the Betas option in Steam. I think 1.4 is the earliest. I don't know if I ever played with that one, but I had a couple good games at 1.7. I like 1.5 as well, but it's one of the toughest ones to expand in, with aggressive nations quickly receiving coalitions to contain them. 1.6 overcorrected and made it possible to expand essentially without penalty, and 1.7 struck a good balance.
Point being, you can go almost all the way to the beginning (1.1 was the earliest version, and indeed was fun; it's at something like 1.22 now), and slowly add features and expansions as you go.
God of Kings
Ruler of all heads of state
Don't forget about the current trend of having PC games be available on consoles as well, Civ VI included.
And last expansion...
The Kingmaker
Alexander
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Does the 21st century still have anecdotes?
Everybody has their idea on what they think a good business strategy is. Some people have legitimately good ideas. The problem here is twofold.
Firstly, it's a lack of understanding around the finesse in marketing video games. No joke. Some of the adverts may be dumb, may be overblown, and so on, and so forth. Some may be nonexistent. But there is a stupid (literally, sometimes stupid) amount of research (and often budget) that goes into these things, and a lot of it is market research. You can't say "look at game X, it does this". Well, you can. But it's only a factor. It's not a deciding reason, case closed. It's a factor, weighed against release windows, internal deadlines, quarterly reports, hiring windows (lot of temp. staff in video games, particularly around peak times during a project). What you think is a surefire idea is something that not only have most companies already thought of, they've already got it down on a spreadsheet next to 19 other things. Against a matching column that has 20 opposing things.
Secondly, you still have no idea whether or not your suggestion is actually good. To take a hypothetical, are scenarios good? Do map packs sell well? Do you know? We'd assume Firaxis know, and if not, we'd definitely assume 2K know. If these aren't selling, do you honestly think an AAA publisher would somehow not take advantage of this hypothetical gravy train? There's one thing we can rely on business to do, and that's to turn a profit (or try to at least). For better or worse, regardless of the results. That's what drives the machine.
You want your idea to be good. And to me that's great, as a fan of video games, I love ideas. They keep developers interested (believe it or not), and they keep people reading. The problem is when you don't stop to consider that maybe your suggestion has been considered, and start needling folks about it.
I used to be on the testing team for Civ, so I’ve had a fair bit of contact with the Firaxis devs in the past.
IMHO, the real issue is the insane amount of analysis done behind the scenes by 2K, who are the ones who tell Firaxis what they can do.
On the one hand, having a supportive publisher is good. However, publishers can sometimes have a different vision for a game than a developer has, which can cause... issues.
I did not know that.
This is why I love indie games. When they're done well (which is an important caveat), they're the best of the market.
Leathaface
Emperor
I find Indie games can be awesome. Before I wasn't sure of them, thinking they were very low budget and that the didn't have enough finances to create a good game. However Cuphead and Dead Cells changed my opinion of that.
I can remember leading up to DLC releases of the past when Eagle Pursuit would say it was good when there were multiple consecutive where there was a change to a depot. IIRC this wasn't too far behind releases.
I've a question: If Firaxis were to release the DLL source, would they have to set up a depot for it? I would think not, but I dunno with these things. It might be as simple as copy and pasting the DLL file and uploading it?
I can remember leading up to DLC releases of the past when Eagle Pursuit would say it was good when there were multiple consecutive where there was a change to a depot. IIRC this wasn't too far behind releases.
I've a question: If Firaxis were to release the DLL source, would they have to set up a depot for it? I would think not, but I dunno with these things. It might be as simple as copy and pasting the DLL file and uploading it?
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