AMAZON Diplomatic Messages

Irgy

Emperor
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This thread is purely for keeping track of messages sent either to or from the team AMAZON. This will hopefully make it easy to keep track of who's said what when. A separate thread will be created for discussion.

From AMAZON to us:
Received: Monday, 24th May, 20:45 (GMT)
Subject: Greetings
We Zenobians hail the leaders of the Sirius Empire.

Our intrepid high-seas explorer Jenny has exchanged ship-to-ship greetings with the intrepid Voyager off the coast of Northern Jennilund. Word has been quickly sent back to the AMAZON camp where partying and general rejoicing broke out in the streets. After the raucous cheers died down the AMAZON tribe convened the Allied general council and this greeting was hammered out (with metaphorical hammers) and dispatched as quickly as possible to our new friends.

We hope this message finds your civilization prospering and we look forward to many years of friendly, mutually beneficial relations with the good people of the Sirius Empire.

The AMAZONs would like to enter into preliminary negotiations with the Sirians and discuss a potential for Open Borders, a possible Non-Aggression Pact, and the potential for future tech trades.

Please send all diplomatic correspondence to AMAZON1@gmail.com. We look forward to hearing from you. Our official Diplomat, SilentConfusion, will be contacting you soon with a much more detalied correspondence. Feel free to address all further communications to him.

Sommerswerd,
Captain of the AMAZONs
 
From us, to AMAZON:
Sent Thursday 25th May 2010, 07:28 (GMT)
Hail and well met, Captain Sommerswerd and peoples of the Zenobian Empire.

The Sirian Empire rejoiced at receiving word of contact with your vessel Jenny by our exploring craft Voyager. We look forward to a long and prosperous relationship between our great peoples. We are currently convening our high council to discuss this momentous occasion. We eagerly await hearing from your diplomat SilentConfusion to begin detailed correspondence.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received 26th May 2010 07:25 (GMT)
Greetings to Irgy and Team Sirius,

Thank you for your prompt reply. Your letter was met with excitement, drinking, and displays of AMAZON prowess. We are happy to find that there is intelligent life out there in the universe.

You previously received a welcome letter from Sommerswerd, Captain of the AMAZONs. I wanted to officially introduce myself, SilentConfusion, the foreign relations correspondent to Team Sirius.

I will be working to facilitate the communication between our two nations, so feel free to address future emails to myself, or simply just to The AMAZON.

The AMAZON people wish to extend our warmest welcome to Team Sirius. We hope to bring our two nations closer together by learning about each other, sharing information, and forming mutually beneficial trade agreements.

As a gesture of goodwill and in an effort to establish a trust between us, we would like to share some information with you. Voyager is skirting the coast of what we call Jennilund. The land turns sharply south just beyond where Voyager can see and continues going south past more desert. On turn 40, if Voyager continues it's present course, our cultural borders will be within sight. We wish the Voyager good luck as it continues it's journey of exploration. Has Voyager voyaged very far to get here?

We haven't met our other neighbors yet and are curious to know if we are the first civilization that you've met. We would like to discuss ways our two nations can work together and assist one another for the betterment of both of our people. We look forward to hearing more from you.

Sincerely yours,

SilentConfusion, AMAZON Diplomat
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Friday 28th May 00:20 (GMT)
Greetings SilentConfusion and peoples of The AMAZON

Thank you for your communication. We Sirians have unanimously agreed that close co-operation between our two nations will be of great benefit to both of us.

Firstly, thank you for your geographic information. We are happy to share our own geography as well. It appears that this desert peninsula is symmetric, as on our side it also continues to the south, and Jenny will shortly reach our cultural borders as well. We sense that the all-mighty creators have a love of symmetry, and have imbued our world with a great amount of it.

You are indeed the first civilisation we have met. Indeed, we believe that we have met at an unusually early date, by way of our two exploring vessels heading in complementary directions. This early contact is something that it would be good to take advantage of.

There are a number of ways in which we may co-operate, which you have already mentioned, and I think it is time to look at these in more detail.

A non-aggression pact is an excellent idea. Indeed we are eager to get along peacefully, and believe that aggression will benefit no-one. It would be very difficult for anyone to invade our homeland, as it is protected by a stretch of waters too dangerous to cross without a local guide (i.e. the help of our cultural borders). The creators love of symmetry leads us to believe the same is likely to be true of yours. This means that aggression would always be limited to needless harassment and destruction of each other's offshore assets, with true conquest impossible to acheive. This kind of aggression cannot truely be beneficial for either party, so it is clear that we are both best off avoiding it before it ever starts. Although the details of a non-aggression pact would need to be worked out, the general spirit of non-aggression should be clear, and we are happy to begin our part of that immediately.

Opening of borders to begin trade would benefit both parties, and we are happy to enter into such an agreement as soon as we can figure out a way to encode such a treaty. Our greatest minds are currently experimenting with means of making markings to represent speech, which they call "Writing", and we expect some results from this very soon.

Trading of technology would be of immense benefit to both of us, and in that regard we think it would be wise to divert each of our researchers in different directions, so that we will have more different ideas to share in the future. As we have said, we are currently looking into ways of Writing down language. To trade ideas, we will need to much better formalise our language (with an Alphabet). We previously had no plans to do so, but it is worth talking about what we may be able to get in return for this idea of an Alphabet.

We hope that all is going well in The AMAZON and look forward to hearing from you again.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
From AMAZON to us:
Recieved: Tuesday 1st June 21:07 (GMT)

Greetings again to the Sirians,

Congratulations on the founding of Canopus. I'm sure it will be a shining beacon of civilization for many millennia. Things have been well for the people of The AMAZON and we recently founded a new city of our own, although we've had to cancel our plans to build a circle of rocks due to some issues with international copyright laws on large structures.

The AMAZON agrees that it is fortunate that we met so soon and that by working closely together both of our peoples will prosper. We should act as quickly as diplomatically possible to take advantage of our chance early meeting.

We have heard rumors that the Sirian people have invented and started using symbols to represent speech. We think this is an important discovery and that it could be utilized to increase trade between our nations. Now that you have discovered Writing, we suggest that we open borders with each other. We think that it would benefit both of our peoples and from your earlier correspondence we seem to agree on this. To that end we have offered open borders in-game.

The peoples of The AMAZON are favorably disposed towards a non-aggression pact with our new friends, the Sirians, as soon as we can work out the terms. We hope to get a proposal hammered out and sent to you in short order. We are also looking forward to hearing your ideas on this.

We would also like to confirm our interest in trading technologies with you as soon as an Alphabet system can be discovered to aid in the transfer of scientific discoveries. We were wondering if you planned on teching Alphabet next after Writing or if you had other more pressing technological needs. If you are indeed planning to pursue Alphabet, it would help if we knew approximately how long it will take to discover it, as then we would better know what we needed to tech to best facilitate trade. The fewer techs we have to double tech the better. More needs to be discussed concerning this, and the sooner we can work out some kind of tech trading agreement the better we can coordinate our efforts.

Hopefully we can take the first step towards a strong partnership with an open borders agreement and continue to work towards a NAP and a tech trading agreement.

Sincerely yours,
SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Friday 4th June 06:04 (GMT)
Greetings again. Thanks for your reply and your openness.

We congratulate you also then on the founding of your new city, and give our condolences on missing your chance to build Stonehenge. We hope the work you had in progress there can at least be sold for gold to pay for some of the maintainence costs of your new city.

As you have probably already seen, we are pleased to accept your offer of open borders. We have discovered, with some experimentation, something unfortunate however. It appears the mechanics of this world are such that Jenny will not be able to cross the deep ocean waters to our island despite both our open borders agreement and our desire to let our cultural knowledge of those waters assist you. Similarly, we expect our Voyager will be unable to reach your home shores. This however is just a minor incovenience compared to the fact that it appears our trade will suffer from the same problems. Although each of us will be able to trade with future settlements on Andromeda (Jennilund as you call it), our capitals will not be connected, preventing either of us from gaining these more lucrative trade routes, and also preventing the exchange of resources. We will likely need to have more discussion of this issue in the future.


We are pleased to hear your confirmation of interest in trading technology. We are currently investigating Sailing. After this, many of us strongly desire to discover a system of Monarchy to keep our people happy under a better government system. However we also think that the sooner we can begin trading technology the better. So, we can consider diverting our efforts towards an Alphabet (once our already begun investigation into Sailing is complete), but we would be much happier to do so if we were likely to be able to gain in trade at least some of the pre-requisite ideas towards Monarchy. Currently our people have no Mysticism at all. Another benefit of your team pursuing some of the religious technologies is that it's most likely to avoid duplicating ideas which we have already, as we have most of the alternative technologies you may be considering. We'd be glad to hear your thoughts and what areas you were planning to research next.

Were we to direct our efforts towards Alphabet, we expect to be able to discover it on turn 51.


We have a simple draft proposal for the terms of the non-aggression pact:
* No declaration of war until the year 1AD, with terms to be re-negotiated at that time.
* An agreement that even after 1AD, either side give at least 10 turns warning prior to declaring war.

Let us know your thoughts on this proposal.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius.
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Tuesday, 8th June 12:04(GMT)
Hail SilentConfusion and The AMAZON

We appreciate the need for you to consider all of the information in our latest correspondence, and are aware that in general you have been at least as quick to respond as we have been ourselves. However, we do think it is worthwhile informing you that were we to direct our research towards Alphabet, we would do so starting from this current turn. So, it would be excellent to hear at least a short correspondence on just this one issue.

Respectfully yours,
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Tuesday, 18:07pm
Greetings to the Sirians,

Not that long ago we were pleased to see Voyager just outside of our cultural borders. Some AMAZONs even rowed out to share food and exchange greetings with Voyager before sending them on their way.

We are heartened to know that our Sirian neighbors are learning more about mastering the waves. Soon our mighty navies shall rule the seas. Alas if only one of our nations had unlocked the secret of Alphabet, we would have been happy to share this knowledge with you. Our shipwrights have long been experimenting with stretching sheepskins across wooden frames to make larger sails.

We understand wholeheartedly your desire to build and test out larger boats, and although this represents a slight amount of the duplicate research we hoped to avoid, we are hopeful that more open communication can benefit both of our teams in the future. We are eager to start technology trading and to avoid any further duplicate teching. Towards this end, we would like to accept your suggestion that we direct our research toward Monarchy while you pursue Alphabet. We are yet without The Wheel or Pottery, but we have set our research path towards Monarchy in order to facilitate earlier tech trading and to avoid duplicate further duplicate research. We look forward to trading techs with you when Alphabet is discovered around turn 51. We have all of the first tier techs except for the Wheel, as well as Sailing, Animal Husbandry, and Bronze Working. We are currently teching the Monarchy prerequisites and are happy to trade any techs that you don't have with you as soon as an Alphabet has been discovered with which to more easily transfer them. We would ask for a similar willingness from you.

Regarding the information about trade routes and cultural bridges over ocean tiles, we feared this might be the case. We will therefore not get to share the resources of our own island with you for some time. For the time being our Open Borders agreement can stand as a symbol of our close relations and our desire to work together.

About a Non-Aggression Pact, we are sure you agree that cooperative teching requires peaceful cooperation. We are therefore delighted with the spirit of your suggested NAP. We would like to ask one question of the Sirians, to better clarify the nature of our burgeoning friendship. Would the Sirians like to be the best of friends, while maintaining maximum flexibility to talk over potential developments and refine our relationship as the need arises? Or do the Sirians wish to cement our cooperative venture for a well defined period to our mutual benefit, and then part ways as friends without further obligation, of course still able to re-enter a new cooperative agreement. For simplicity, we can name these options Diana's plan (as it was our princess Diana who came up with it) and Hera's vision (as one of Hera's priestesses divined the plan in a dream).

Our suggestion is that the Sirians choose whichever of the following best suits them.

Diana's plan: Immediate Permanent NAP, subject to cancellation at any time with 15 turns notice.
Hera's vision: Irrevocable NAP until 1AD, at which time we may negotiate a new NAP with new terms to fit the changed situation or we may part ways.

Let us know as soon as possible if you are delaying Alphabet, so that we can change our tech path if necessary.

Hopefully things are well with our Sirian friends since we last heard from them. May our relationship shine ever more brightly as we go forward and raise our civilizations from obscurity.

Sincerely yours,

SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat.
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Saturday 12th June 01:59 (GMT)
Hail SilentConfusion and The AMAZON

Our people were delighted to receive your latest correspondence. We would like to confirm that our research towards Alphabet is indeed well on track. We look forward to the sharing of ideas that this will allow.

Voyager was quite pleased indeed to see the borders of The AMAZON as well.

We agree that the duplication towards Sailing is unfortunate. Our people were very eager to explore Andromeda (Jennilund) however. We had in fact recently noticed that our research in this was progressing faster than expected, and suspected that our researchers were borrowing ideas from things they had seen in the waters around The AMAZON, however by the time we noticed this it made more sense to press on and complete the research. We agree that avoiding this duplication in the future would be much preferred.

We have held a vote, and decided to adopt Diana's Plan: "Immediate Permanent NAP, subject to cancellation at any time with 15 turns notice.". We are pleased to begin this agreement straight away.

However, we also wonder whether it is possible to eat our cake and have it too, by agreeing to both plans. This gives both the desirable sense of permanence of Diana's Plan, and the additional short-term security of Hera's Vision. We are interested in your thoughts on this.

Regards,
Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Wednesday 16th June 18:42(GMT)
Greetings again to our friends the Sirians,

We are glad to hear that we will soon be able to share our technological breakthroughs with each other. Our researchers are focusing their energies in areas that they think will help them discover a form of government that places the power in the hands of one person (we're calling it Monarchy). Our researchers recently discovered Masonry and will soon discover the secrets of Polytheism. Although the secrets of Polytheism have already been discovered elsewhere in the world, we are hoping that we might be able to be the first to postulate a theory of the existence of only one god, something our thinkers have speculatively called Monotheism. Such a discovery would be a great religious breakthrough for our people, one that we would happily share with our friends, the Sirians. We look forward to receiving Alphabet from you on turn 51, at which time we can share all of our discoveries with each other.

We have enjoyed our friendship with the Sirians, and are very interested in discussing the expansion of our friendship. We have taken a major step by agreeing to a mutual non-aggression pact, and we, also, are pleased to start our part of the pact right away. Princess Diana was so pleased that the Sirians accepted her plan that she immediately suggested planning a special ceremony to make the Sirians honorary members of The AMAZON. Our elders will discuss such an eventuality further and contact you soon. In the meantime, we are happy to discuss any matters which might bring us closer together as we seek to build an even stronger bond between ourselves and our neighbors the Sirians.

On an unrelated topic, one of our intrepid explorers, Martha, got "lost" on her voyage eastward. She claims that she lost track of a navigational star, but we suspect that she may have just overslept after an impromptu, un-sanctioned AMAZON drinking party that took place aboard the vessel. A full investigation into her fitness as an explorer is currently underway. The silver lining of her unscheduled detour was that she was able to spot Voyager speeding along on the horizon behind her. The crew of the Voyager were able to give Martha a few pointers on the correct use of stars before they both continued their journeys. With our vessels so close together, hopefully the opportunity to co-ordinate the exploration of a landmass will soon present itself. When the time comes, would the Sirians be interested in splitting our vessels paths so that we can explore more quickly? Of course the fruits of any such joint-venture would be shared freely and equally in the spirit of our ongoing mutual cooperation.

The people of The AMAZON are happy that we have agreed to a deal that will help assure that there will be peace between our two nations. This gives us cause to celebrate (and we know how to celebrate here in The AMAZON). Our people are very optimistic about the burgeoning relationship between our two peoples.

We look forward to your reply.

Best wishes,

SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Saturday, 19th June, 12:41 (GMT)
To our friends the Sirians,

Our Work Boat, Jenny, who sailed past your borders many turns ago has come in contact with an exploring Work Boat (named Ganges) belonging to Quatronia.

You have probably suspected already, but the map appears to be star-shaped with one arm between us. It is possible and even likely that other civs are on the other side of the two arms to the south of us. We have met Quatronia's boat just around the tip of the arm south of you. They will be coming your way and you will meet them probably in 9 or 10 turns if they keep their current course.

We have sent them a warm greeting, asking them how far their island is and whether they had met any other civs. We also are now focusing our espionage efforts fully on Quatronia and away from you. We hope to be friends with you for many, many years to come and in the spirit of cooperation and trust we will not be piling up espionage points on you.

We will wait for their reply and let you know if they tell us anything interesting. You almost certainly already figured out, as we did, that they built Stonehenge, but we can now officially see that they built Stonehenge in their capitol, which they call Continuum.

We think that we should at least consider trying to bring Quatronia into our budding trade alliance. We think it a good idea to add at least one more team to "our side" and hopefully two. We also think that it would be a good idea to formalize our cooperation and our officials are diligently putting together our ideas about how to do that and we look forward to comparing them to your ideas as we move forward. So look forward to hearing from us again soon.

May the light always guide you and may your citizens be happy and prosperous.

Sincerely yours,
SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Monday, 21st June, 23:19(GMT)
Greetings to our Sirian friends,

We hope that our neighbors have been well since we last heard from them and that everything is running smoothly and without incident over there.

Enclosed is a proposed agreement to formalize our trading relationship, that we mentioned in our last letter to you. I have also appointed AMAZON nabaxo the Special Diplomatic Envoy to your glorious nation, so that you have one contact devoted solely to you. Diplomatic Envoy nabaxo will contact you soon with a more elaborate proposal to join the Sirians and The AMAZON in eternal friendship. Until then, we would like to formalize our agreement to share knowledge. We have Mysticism, Masonry, Polytheism, and will have Monotheism in a few turns. We will then tech Monarchy. All will be gifted when possible as per this treaty. It is our desire that we continue to work together cooperatively in all regards. We would also like to add one or two teams to this agreement to solidify a Tech Trading Alliance to ensure neither of us winds up on the wrong end of a Trade Alliance.

Here is the proposed treaty (it is formated so when it is copy-pasted into a post it will be formated):

The ETTT​

The Exclusive Tech-Trading Treaty​

The Exclusive Tech Trading Treaty is the governing treaty of the Exclusive Tech Trading Alliance (ETTA), which is composed of the members of the ETTT.

Section 1. Members of the ETTT

1.1. The AMAZON

1.2. Team Sirius​

Section 2. Addition and Subtraction of Members

2.1. New members may be added by unanimous agreement of all current members.

2.2. A member may be removed by unanimous consent of all other current members.

2.3. A member may be removed at any time if they are proved to have violated any of the terms of this treaty.​

Section 3. Treaty Duration and Cancellation Terms

3.1. The treaty continues indefinitely until it is canceled.

3.2. The treaty can be canceled at any time by the mutual agreement of all members.​


Section 4. Trading Policies

4.1. Members agree to trade freely and generously with all other members.

4.2. Members agree to trade with non-members only with unanimous consent from all other current members.

4.3. Members will be open and forthright about research plans to avoid duplication of effort and ensure rapid progress.

4.4. All technology shall be shared openly, upon request, without regard to beaker value.​
Section 5. Amendments

5.1. A proposed amendment may be submitted by any member. The proposed amendment must be sent to all members.

5.2. A proposed amendment will be adopted upon the agreement of all members.​

If you have concerns about the treaty please let us know so we can address them because working together is the most important thing to us.

We look forward to hearing from you as soon as possible.

Sincerely yours,
SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat

EDIT - I removed the part that was just a quote of their own previous reply, as it just confuses things.
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Monday 21st June 23:54(GMT)
Greetings again SilentConfusion and The AMAZON, and a warm welcome to Naxabo.

You are too fast for our slow democratic process. This is not a complaint by the way but a compliment. Each time we are about to send a correspondence, new input from you has sent us into another round of discussion, consensus and confirmation which delays our response. In order to avoid treating you with unwarranted silence, I will send the bulk of what we had prepared with just a few comments first on the differences it raises.

Firstly, we had evisaged the technology alliance as an agreement of free, unrestricted, but balanced trades, as contrasted to your proposal of complete tech equality. We appreciate the co-operative spirit of the proposal, but we need to discuss and consider amongs ourselves, and potentially negotiate the consequences of this difference. The suggestion we make below of no-brokering would obviously not apply in a situation like you propose of complete tech equality, as the need for this would no longer exist.

Secondly, I'll just promote the importance of a minor point previously hidden in the text below. The bonus that Priesthood provides for Monarchy almost pays for the cost of Priesthood, and the bonus it will later provide to researching Code of Laws makes it quite profitable, even without the (admitedly minor) benefits that the technology provides on its own. We advise that skipping this technology would be inefficient.

Below is the state of our thoughts prior to receiving your latest correspondence:

We thank you for letting us know about your meeting with Quatronia. This sort of openness inspires us with confidence. We had our own suspicions about a star shaped map, indeed one team member proposed it a long time ago and must be feeling very clever now. We eagerly await any further news from you about Quatronia. We are happy to reciprocate on the assignment of EPs, as soon as we have contacted another civ ourselves. By the looks of things we may both contact a civ to the east before Quatronia reach Sirian borders.

We were indeed wondering how it was that we had managed to catch up to Martha. We're sorry to hear about her unfortunate delay, but the crew of Voyager are indeed glad to have some company. We agree that Voyager and Martha should eventually part ways to explore in different directions once that becomes possible. In the meantime at least it will mean that we discover any civilisation in this next area at around the same time.

We have had an initial look at a first technology trade, and have come up with the following. We hope this seems fair to your people.
Team Sirius provides:
The Wheel (60) + Pottery (80) + Writing (120) + Alphabet (300) = 560 beakers
AMAZON provides:
Hunting (40) + Mysticism (50) + Polytheism (100) + Priesthood (60) + Monarchy (300) = 550 beakers

We are glad to hear you are attempting to discover Monotheism, and wish you the best of luck in that. We are currently planning to pursue Mathematics next, with an intention to use this to help develop standard units of trade known as Currency.

We would like to consider an agreement to avoid brokering each other's technology to third parties, to prevent one of us setting themselves up in an unfair trading position. This has become even more important since meeting another team. Our proposal is as follows. The exact number of turns is considered negotiable.
* When receiving a technology in trade, the other team will not trade that technology on to a third party, until at least 30 turns have passed since the trade occurred.

It appears to be almost standard practise to perform technology trades as separate gifts, to avoid a score increase appearing for both teams simultaneously, as well as avoiding a score increase for one team while the only other is logged in. Although it's not foolproof, it at least prevents other teams from immediately knowing for certain that technology trading has taken place and exactly which teams were involved. Let us know your thoughts on this.

Finally, thanks for your correspondence, and we apologise for the delay in ours. We look forward to further discussions.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius.
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Tuesday 22nd June 20:43(GMT)
Sirian Friends,

Our Diplomatic Offices are closed for the night, and so I, the Captain, have been authorized to relay information on behalf of our Diplomatic Offices,

We appreciate the long and deliberative process that is democracy, and we are hopeful that our Sirian friends are making inroads towards a decision on our recently proposed Tech Alliance. We have also made the same offer to the Q Continuum, in the hopes that our 3-way alliance will soon be complete. The only question to address then, will be whether we will seek to truly dominate the world by making our alliance of 3, an alliance of 4.

Another matter, is that of our intrepid explorers, Martha and Voyager. We have spotted a point where Martha and Voyager might part ways... one to determine if there is a path North through the center of the Map, and one to continue West. We are aware, of course, that the one who continues West is in the best position to meet new civilizations first, but we also see great value in the detection of a more direct route from our Northern islands to the Southern ones. We would like to hear your thoughts on this.

We have some sad news to report to our friends. Unfortunately, Monotheism was snatched from us, and our high hopes of founding a religion of our own have been dashed. This development presents us with a pressing dilemma. As your last message reflected a desire to have Priesthood, we are considering halting our pursuit of Monotheism in favor of Priesthood, however in order to make such a commitment, we first must consult with you.
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We directed our research towards Monarchy at your behest, with the expectation that we would triumphantly enter into a Tech-Sharing Alliance this very turn. However, your last message has given us pause, and we wish to better understand your intentions.

Do you wish to enter a Tech Alliance, where all Alliance Partners share knowledge freely, enjoying equal footing and complete technological parity?... Or do you wish to engage in at-arms-length Tech Trading, where knowledge costs are carefully counted and each advance is paid for as one would a sheepskin vest?

In a Tech Alliance, as we understand it, (our Nation, afterall, is an Alliance of Matriarchal tribes) the partners enjoy equal footing,... All are treated the same, as part of one nation. In a Tech Alliance, no knowledge is shared outside the alliance, unless it is the will of the entire Alliance to do so.

However, your proposal seems to be more in the flavor of a single trade, to possibly be followed by additional trades, each carefully calculated to protect the comparative advantages of each party. In such an arrangement, exclusivity is counterintuitive, because each traded morsel of knowledge is fully paid for... thus additional conditions on the trade are not paid for and consequently innapropriate. For example, would you buy a sheepskin vest, if the merchant told you, that you would not be allowed to give it to your sister as a birthday present? Of course not, because you had fully paid for the vest and thus it was yours, to do with as you wished.

Also, exclusivity runs counter to comparative advantage in trading. For example, it is known to The AMAZON, that Sirians are skilled in the nature of finance (FIN) and therefore have a proclivity towards garnering new knowledge. With your unique skills, it is unlikely that The AMAZON could ever hope to acheive knowledge parity with the Sirians in the near future.
It was therefore puzzling to us that you would consider offering us an exchange based upon that imbalance, while denying us the benefit of the resources we invested towards meeting other trading partners. Such an arrangement would inevitably relegate The AMAZON to perpetual backwardness relative to the wise Sirians. What we offer, is our loyalty, forthrightness and worthiness as an ally, in the hope that we can make what the Sirians feel is a valuable contribution to our alliance, as the nature of our friendship grows and expands.

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As is our custom, to help us articulate our thoughts, we have consulted first, with our Princess, Diana, and next with our Goddesses. As always, the wise Diana presented a deal:

Diana's Deal


On this turn (51) we will provide you with Hunting (40:science:) + Mysticism (50:science: and next turn (52) we will provide you with Polytheism (100:science: = 190:science:total

in exchange for,

The Wheel (60:science:) + Writing (120:science:) = 180:science:total (the extra 10:science: being compensation for the 1 turn delay on Polytheism)

Next, of our many Goddesses, the radiant Aphrodite was first to reply, in the form of a whisper, to one of our Preistesses:

The Path of Conditional Love - (Aphrodite's Whisper)


Sirius will immediately (turn 51) accept the ETTT, commencing the full and free sharing of technology between our peoples. However, if The AMAZON or Sirius is unable to secure a third partner for the ETTT before Sirius is offered entry into another alliance of 2 or more teams, Sirius shall be free to leave the ETTT immediately if Sirius so desires, with 1 turn notice. The AMAZON will not be free to leave the ETTT, except according to the express terms of the ETTT.
Time Is Of The Essence​
As per Diana's instructions, we are only authorized to extend this offer until the conclusion of the current turn, after which, we will be forced to direct our technological efforts in disparate directions, possibly away from Priesthood and Monarchy.

Why the rush you might ask? As we never keep anything from our Sirian friends, we can happily reply that the answer is quite simple. You will make contact with the Kingdom of Merlot soon, and we need to ascertain whether you truly intend to form an alliance with us, or whether you intend to wait, in the hopes of brokering a better deal with our neighbor to the South, effectively shutting us out and isolating us. Of course we would consider this most unfortunate, and it would leave us with very few options. However we understand that you seek only the best for your people, and we bear no grudge towards you whatsoever, regardless of what you may choose.
We are saddened to have to be this blunt, and we hope you can forgive us, for what must seem like high-pressure tactics, but we have faith that our past conduct towards our Sirian friends speaks for itself. We wish now to place all our cards on the table, in a full, open-handed offer of lasting friendship. We hope that you accept.

Truly Yours in Friendship,

Sommerswerd, Captain of The AMAZON
on behalf of
SilentConfusion, Diplomat of The AMAZON
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Wednesday, 23rd June, 12:08(GMT)
I'll get a couple of smaller issues out of the way first, before diving into the big issue in a separate message.

We agree that Martha and Voyager parting ways in the directions you suggest is quite wise, however we would like to ensure that we both meet the team on the island our vessels are currently near first. You mentioned us making contact with Merlot soon, can we take this to mean their borders are nearby?

We give our condolences on missing the religion from Monotheism. Do you know who it might have been that took it? Is it a team without a religion of their own, or is one team trying to horde religions? As for Priesthood, we consider Code of Laws to be at least a medium term goal (possibly higher since you missed your chance at a religion), so gaining Priesthood has benefits in that respect. However my point about efficiency of research was mostly meant simply on face value. Depending on how far into Monotheism you have researched, the same argument about the pre-requisite bonus would apply to researching the remainder of Monothiesm before starting on Monarchy, even if you were to take Priesthood first.

We see no reason not to at least trade the technologies we have already, so as not to delay your access to Writing and The Wheel. As such, we will offer these technologies to you in-game, some time shortly after sending this message.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Wednesday, 23rd June, 12:09(GMT)
Greetings AMAZONs,

We apologise for any delays in our responses recently; we are unfortunately not as efficient at conducting diplomacy as our AMAZON friends. We will try to work on this in the future.

We are pleased to announce that we would be happy to accept your proposed "Exclusive Tech Trading Treaty (ETTT)", with the simple condition that we strengthen the existing alliance between our two teams at the same time. The reasoning for this is simple - we'd be absolutely delighted to enter into a free tech-trading alliance with you, but it feels a bit odd if underlying this close technological friendship is a mere non-aggression pact that can be cancelled at any time. We're sure you agree that it doesn't make sense to have such a close technological alliance, and yet still at all times have the threat of a potential war between us being only 15 turns away on the horizon. Simply put, it seems to us that our old non-aggression agreement just doesn't fit any more with this new extremely close friendship which we are about to enter into.

As such, we propose the following extensions of our alliance as conditions for accepting the ETTT:

- Non-aggression between our nations fixed until at least 1000 AD. The only condition for this being broken is if all other nations in the game have been destroyed before then (which is extremely unlikely, maybe even impossible). Explanation: This guarantees a peaceful and friendly environment for both of us to conduct our close technological alliance within.

- Both of our nations agree to help one another where possible if either of us are involved in a defensive war. For offensive wars against third parties, neither of our nations is obligated to get involved, although of course we may choose to fight together. Explanation: If someone is attacking you, it's reasonable to expect your allies to help out. But if you're invading someone else, that's your own choice, and your allies may or may not want to get involved right away. Agreeing to provide military assistance to each other in times of defensive war helps both of us by making our nations more secure against invasions.

- Complete openness and honesty in our friendship. Neither of us holds back any information which we feel the other would like to know. This includes stuff like contact with new nations, important diplomacy with other nations, positions of suspicious rival units, information gained through espionage, and Settlers sent anywhere remotely close to the north-south line down the middle of the mainland territory between us. This is perhaps redundant as we have already been very open with one another (and we appreciate this greatly!) - but we may as well put it into words. Explanation: This way we'll both have maximum knowledge of our enemies' and each others' intentions, leaving no possibility for misunderstandings or frustrations between us.

Note that we are not proposing necessarily adding these conditions to the ETTT, which other teams may be included in, but as a specific and separate agreement between our two teams.

We hope that you'll agree that these extra conditions will further enhance our friendship, and we look forward to entering the ETTT with you!

Sincerely,
Lord Parkin and Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Wednesday, 23rd June 17:30(GMT)
Greetings Sirians,

We are happy to accept all of your additional terms and consider our nations bound by the language of the ETTT, as well as the additional conditions you outlined.

Incidentally, our elders have been working on a treaty in anticipation of your concerns that included terms similar to the ones you have proposed as well as other ideas for how we can work closely and cooperatively. We have tentatively called it The ASP (AMAZON-Sirius Pact). Our Diplomatic Offices will present this to you soon, along with a letter addressing some of the unrelated issues you raised in previous letters.

Your friend,
SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Thursday, 24th June 05:14(GMT)
Greetings to our Sirian Allies,

This is a long message, but now that we are going to be long-term allies, we have much to talk about.

We are very excited to be working with you to build a strong tech alliance. We have sent a copy of the ETTT to Quatronia, but they have not responded to us yet, although they seemed very interested in working with us. We should discuss who we want to add to the ETTA (Exclusive Tech Trading Alliance). We will meet the Mavericks soon, who are between you and Quatronia. We have already met House Merlot, and you will meet them next turn. Then the only team we will not have met is CDZ who must be south of Merlot.

We have accepted the techs offered. We see that you have also accepted Mysticism, Hunting, and Masonry which we offered to you. We will offer Polytheism next turn. We think that the trades will not go unnoticed by the other teams, and it may even help put pressure on the other civilizations to join our alliance, which will mean increased teching potential for all of us.

If the Voyager just follows in Martha's wake you should make contact with them next turn. We can see Merlot's borders this turn, and since we think you are only one turn behind us, you should meet them next turn. Two tiles south of Martha there appears to be another channel opening similar to the ones that are on either side of Andromeda/Jennilund. We have speculated that our creator may have made waterways that lead from the center of the star to each civilization to increase contact. We think the presence of these waterways could have given the barbarians the idea of building the Great Lighthouse. The presence of a third one of these "openings" makes us suspect it seem likely that this is the case. The presence of these canals must be even more exciting to you, considering that your civilization is capable of fielding a very strong navy.

We were disappointed that someone discovered Monotheism first. Only three teams gained points that turn: you, Quatronia, and the Mavericks. Since we know that you teched the second era tech Alphabet and Quatronia teched Writing (not only did they tell us that's what they were teching, but we can now offer Open Borders), it must have been the Mavericks. In that case it is a team that already had a religion. We think they may want it more for the production boost of Organized Religion than for the religion, and we think they plan to build more wonders. They possibly now have forges (MC from Oracle?) and Organized Religion.

Consider we have solidified our Trading Alliance, we will continue to research toward Monarchy. We appreciate the reminder of the benefit of having both optional prerequisites. We will proceed to get Monotheism and Priesthood, followed by Monarchy. How long do you think it will take you to research Mathematics, because we would probably switch to Priesthood first if you are going to start teching Currency before we finish both Monotheism and Priesthood. Right now we are running at 0% science to gather gold for binary research, and taking into account the fact that we will meet the Mavericks soon who have both Priesthood and Monotheism it seems wisest to do 0% research before we meet them.

You also undoubtedly noticed our score decrease during this turn. For efficiency reasons due to our IMP trait, we wanted to whip our Settler. Some of us were concerned that this might be construed as neglecting our research rate after we have secured a tech alliance, however we want to assure you that it did not pull off any of our commerce-producing citizens and did not decrease our tech rate at all and actually lowered our maintenance cost for the time being. Another city will result in a continued net gain in beakers for our alliance. We only mention this because we want nothing to call our intentions into question regarding this Alliance we have just entered into. We consider this alliance, and our close relationship with the Sirians in particular, to be our top priorities.

We want to start discussing a settlement plan for Andromeda/Jennilund. We have landed a scouting party on that landmass and have uncovered some resources. We would like to share the positions of these resources with you and keep you updated on what else we find, so that we can more quickly come to an agreement about the settling of this landmass. Coming to such an agreement, not only allows us avoid potential tension, but also gives us the option, if we so choose to focus our primary colonization attempts away from each other having already by agreement secured the land between us.

Here's a description of what we know the landmass looks like as we can see it:

Rows listed from North to South, tiles listed from West to East. A question mark is a guessed tile, still in Fog of War.

1st row: 3 land tiles: Desert, Desert, Desert
2nd row: 3 land tiles: Desert, Desert?, Desert
3rd row: 3 land tiles: Desert, Plains hill?, Desert
4th row: 3 land tiles: Desert, Plains hill?, Desert
5th row: 3 land tiles: Desert, Plains hill Marble, Desert
6th row: 3 land tiles: Flood Plains, Flood Plains, Flood Plains
7th row: 5 land tiles: Grass, Grass, Grass, Grass, Grass
8th row: 5 land tiles: Grass forest, Grass?, Grass?, Grass, Grass forest
9th row: 5 land tiles: Grass, Grass forest?, Grass, Grass, Grass
10th row: 7 land tiles: Grass, Grass, Grass?, Grass Banana, Grass, Grass forest, Grass
11th row: 7 land tiles: Grass, Grass hill?, Grass forest?, Grass, Grass, Grass hill Horse, Grass
12th row: 9 land tiles: Grass forest, Grass, Grass?, Grass?, Grass, Grass, Grass, Grass forest, Grass forest
13th row: 8 land tiles: Grass forest, Grass?, Grass jungle?, Grass jungle Banana, Grass, Grass, Grass forest, Grass forest

We are almost positive that the Grass hill in the 11th row on your side is also a Horse. We suspect that it was designed to cause conflict, with resources directly in the middle and a source of horses right next to each other's capitol. Hopefully others spend more time squabbling and less time working together. We want to work out a deal rather quickly so we can both plan our future settling strategies.

We would like to propose what we call the AMAZON-Sirius Pact (or ASP), and continue to work on a settling agreement with can be added as an amendment to the ASP. We incorporated our existing NAP and all of the terms you suggested to us in your last letter.. Let us know what you think.

The ASP​

The AMAZON-Sirius Pact​

Section 1. Members of the ASP

1.1. Team Sirius

1.2. The AMAZON​

Section 2. Pact Duration and Cancellation Terms

2.1. The pact continues indefinitely until it is canceled.

2.2. The pact cannot be canceled until 1000AD.

2.3. The pact will be canceled if at any time there are no non-member teams left in the game.

2.4. The pact can be canceled by either member if the other member knowingly violates the terms of the pact.​

Section 3. Non Aggression

3.1. Both members agree not to attack each other at any time while this pact is in effect.

3.2. If a third party attacks either one of the members, the other member agrees not give aid to that third party.
3.2.1. Giving aid to a third party includes providing gold, gifting military units, and granting passage to troops.​
3.3. Both members agree to help each other where possible if either of them are engaged in a defensive war.
3.3.1. If either member is engaged in an offensive war against a third party, the other member is not obligated to get involved, although help may be given voluntarily.​
3.4. If the pact is canceled because there are no non-member teams left in the game (Section 2.3) a Non-Aggression Pact will go into effect that will last for 10 turns after the last non-member team is eliminated.​

Section 4. Open Borders

4.1. Both members agree to maintain an Open Borders treaty to facilitate trade and unit movement for the length of this pact.​

Section 5. Resources

5.1. Both members will seek to trade excess resources with the other member first before attempting to trade it to a non-member.
5.1.1. If the other member is unwilling or unable to make a reasonable trade offer the resource may be traded to a non-member.​

Section 6. Sharing Information

6.1. Both members agree to cooperate with complete openness and honesty.
6.2. Neither member will hold back any information which we feel the other member would like to know. This includes but it not limited to all of the following.
6.2.1. Contact with new nations
6.2.2. Important diplomacy with other nations

6.2.3. Positions and strengths of suspicious rival units

6.2.4. Information gained through espionage

6.2.5. Settlers being sent anywhere close to the line running North to South bisecting the mainland area between the two members.​

Section 7. Mutual Technological Advancement

7.1. Both members agree to conduct tech trading honestly and fairly.

7.2. Both members agree to continue to coordinate tech paths to avoid duplicate teching for the length of this pact.

7.3. Both members agree to the terms of the Exclusive Tech-Trading Treaty (ETTT) and agree to remain members while both The ASP and The ETTT are in effect.

7.4. Neither member will vote for the other to be removed from the ETTT.

7.5. Both members agree to seek to add at least one more member to the ETTT (for a total of 3 members) to ensure that both ASP members are not on the outside of a major tech trading alliance.​

Section 7. Religion

7.1. If either member gains a religion in any way while the other member is without a religion, the member with a religion agrees to make an effort to provide the other member with a missionary within a reasonable time limit.​

Section 8. Wonders

8.1. Both members agree be open with each other about plans to build World Wonders, to avoid duplication and the tension that could arise from secretly competing against each other.​

Section 9. Temporary Exceptions

9.1. Temporary exceptions can be made to the terms of the pact with the express agreement of both members. This is meant to allow either member to react to unforeseen circumstances.​

Section 10. Amendments

10.1. A proposed amendment may be submitted by either member.

10.2. A proposed amendment will be adopted upon agreement of both members.​

May the stars continue to show you favor.

Your allies,
nabaxo, AMAZON Special Diplomatic Envoy
SilentConfusion, AMAZON Diplomat
 
From AMAZON to us:
Received Friday 25th June, 08:06(GMT)
Greetings to our Sirian allies,

We know that progress has come to a halt somewhat in the world right now, but while we're waiting for the world to come back online we'd like to take this chance to share some interesting new developments with our allies.

We told you that we had also contacted Quatronia in regards to joining the ETTA. It took them a little while to get back to us, but we just received word from them saying that they would be very interested in joining our Tech Alliance. This is, of course, subject to approval by Team Sirius, who is already in the ETTA, but we think that this news will be as welcome to you as it is to us. Having three teams on board means we will not have to go up against a bigger tech alliance. We think we should both accept Quatronia into our Alliance so that we can increase our teching power immediately. Not only did we receive this good news from The Continuum, as they call themselves, but they also informed us that they have had very good relations with CDZ for a while now and they feel pretty confident that they could bring them into our Alliance, giving us four members. They seemed to think that CDZ may be willing to or may already be teching Iron Working.

We have noticed (and you may have considered it too) the nice symmetry that it would bring to our Alliance if we had the two top teams and the two bottom teams together. Not only does this leave the two remaining teams, Merlot and the Mavericks, far apart from each other while every Alliance member has an ally close by, but it also gives every Alliance member one side on which they can expand aggressively while the other side can be secured by the two Allies.

The first issue is whether to accept Quatronia into our Alliance. We whole-heartedly suggest that we do. The second issue is whether we give them the go-ahead to try to bring CDZ into the ETTA. While we wish that one of us could speak directly with CDZ, we think it important to act on this opportunity quickly and we are in favor of attempting to acquire CDZ as an Ally. Quatronia says they have a good relationship with them and think they can get them on board. We suggest you send us your decision on whether to add Quatronia as soon as you make it, while a response to the rest can take more time in coming. If you accept them, this will allow us to most efficiently manage our tech path from day one.

Also Quatronia informed us that they would divert their research away from Alphabet, if we accept them, and would switch research to Mathematics. However, you are already teching Mathematics, so it would be good to inform them right away of our tech plans so we can avoid duplication. So we should get back to them pretty soon, so they can switch. We haven't revealed either of our tech plans to them yet, since we wanted to receive your agreement before doing so.

That is the major news of the day, but we also picked up a few tidbits which we can share with you. Quatronia says there does seem to be channels leading to the center of the star, which they say is a somewhat desert area. It took Merlot quite a while to answer our welcome letter, and when we received it, it seemed fairly devoid of information. Quatronia says that this is the same kind of result they got when they met them. So you may find this to be the case as well, or maybe they're just still working out the kinks in their system. Quatronia has another work boat on the other side of Merlot's land, so they may meet Voyager near the same time their other work boat finds your homeland.

Quatronia confirmed what our intelligence department had figured out: that Mavericks did found Judaism in addition to Hinduism. They also told us that the Mavericks' researchers were so inspired by the building they built called the Oracle, that they almost immediately divined an understanding of Metal Casting.

We will offer you Polytheism when we log in next turn. We also would like to place a city on Andromeda/Jennilund sometime soon to claim the horses, as they may be needed on our other front, although we realize that Copper may be a more effective weapon against House Merlot's early soldiers. We want to place this city in a way that is fair to both of us as we wish no tension to arise between us. Our Settling efforts after this will be primarily directed in the direction of House Merlot. We are sure that we will be able to work out a Settlement plan that works for both of us.

Please don't be intimidated by our long communications. We just want to follow a policy of complete openness with the Sirians. Please feel free to respond to different parts of our communications separately if you wish. Also feel free to send us a quick note with what you feel is the more important time-sensitive stuff and take your time with the rest. We don't wish to overwhelm you, just to keep you informed.

The stars seem to be shining on us at the moment. If you've been talking to them on both of our behalf we very much appreciate it. Let see if we can keep them working in our favor.

SilentConfusion, AMAZON diplomat
 
From us to AMAZON:
Sent Friday, 25th June, 11:36(GMT)
Greetings Amazons

I'm taking your advice on getting the important stuff out of the way quickly. A much longer message will follow in about 12 hours.

We wholeheartedly accept the terms of the SAP as you have proposed. We acknowledge that it incorporates all of our requests, with the addition of extra terms which are all entirely sensible and wise. We are all overjoyed to be part of this, and look forward to working with you through the future.

Irgy, on behalf of Team Sirius
 
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