ancient ageless buildings locking out tiles

[ggmoyang]

The problem is that they don't -- as Leyrann also mentioned, the warehouse bonus on Granaries disappears after the Antiquity Age, at least if the UI is to be believed.

Thing is, you can't believe the UI in Civ 7.
The effect of legacy ageless buildings stays the same, notice the grassland tile I highlighted and the horse pasture tile gets +1 food with granary built.

 

[StargazingDog]

This problem is only going to feel worse as a fourth age is added. I don't know what the solution could be. I do like that ageless buildings are there forever, as it makes you plan. Maybe all we need is more experience with the game and a more informative UI.

I hope that one of these two March updates will fix the UI not showing the actual yield bonus of warehouses. I often don't bother with sawmills or granaries late in the game, simply because I'd have to manually count how many tiles would be affected.

 

[uppi]

The problem is that they don't -- as Leyrann also mentioned, the warehouse bonus on Granaries disappears after the Antiquity Age, at least if the UI is to be believed.

Here is Pengcheng in the Antiquity Age. The Granary will get +2 warehouse Food from the two Pastures.
View attachment 723136

Here is Pengcheng in the Exploration Age. The Granary gives no warehouse bonus even though there is a Pasture and a Farm.
View attachment 723137

Now buy the building on exploration age and discover that the food yield in the settlement increases by more than 1 (although they might be a lie as well...)

This is the biggest reason I think destroying ageless buildings should be allowed. I have seen the AI build a brickyard and stone cutter for 1 mine & 0 claypits.

Aside from other arguments, the AI is not smart about placing ageless buildings and needs to be programmed to understand. But if not, then let a conqueror destroy all ageless buildings without razing the city. I like the logistical problem of the granary taking up space all game. But being locked into its placement when it MUST be one of the first things you build (Connected to the City Center) with no option to push it out further towards the farms is pretty harsh. Having to sacrifice turns to build a granary for the 2nd time is a fair punishment enough. Let it be obsolete and able to overbuild in later ages. But I would allow us the option to pick the which building we want to overbuild instead of the game picking for us. (The game does a good job selecting what to overbuild generally, but in this case you want to give control to the player.)

If you want something done properly, do it yourself. If you take a city off an AI, which is already very positive for you and very negative for the AI, the imperfect build of the city is an acceptable drawback.

 

[Siptah]

This problem is only going to feel worse as a fourth age is added. I don't know what the solution could be.

I do: don't add a full fourth age. Have the third age as a full age, but make it play like the first and second. And then have the fourth age start when the 3rd age reached 100%, and let it just be the end game - 30 turns where you race to your victory based on your previous accomplishments, with one tier of new units and a handful of new buildings but no new civs, uniques, wonders.

 

[stealth_nsk]

This is the biggest reason I think destroying ageless buildings should be allowed.

I think the idea is that you can't remove buildings, which aren't obsolete (meaning buildable in this age). But, honestly, I'd just allowed building new buildings over any other non-wonder building. I don't see any big exploits here, other than chances of finding artifacts on overbuilding, but it looks like being easily tweakable.

This problem is only going to feel worse as a fourth age is added. I don't know what the solution could be.

The solution is to make ageless buildings replaceable.

 

[Leyrann]

I don't see any big exploits here, other than chances of finding artifacts on overbuilding, but it looks like being easily tweakable.

That's quite simple to solve. Allow it to trigger only if:
-This is the first time you build a Modern building in this slot and
-This is the first time you build this specific Modern building in this city.

 

[stealth_nsk]

That's quite simple to solve. Allow it to trigger only if:
-This is the first time you build a Modern building in this slot and
-This is the first time you build this specific Modern building in this city.

I'd just trigger it only if you overbuild something built in previous ages, because it's logical to find artifacts only if something older was here.

 

[Leyrann]

I'd just trigger it only if you overbuild something built in previous ages, because it's logical to find artifacts only if something older was here.

I meant in addition to overbuilding. These rules would be to fix exploits like overbuilding in the same spot over and over or using one building (that you remove) to overbuild everything even though you haven't teched towards other buildings yet, stuff like that.

 

[Wabnosa]

Allow wonders to overbuild ageless buildings.

 

[AriochIV]

View attachment 723140View attachment 723141
Thing is, you can't believe the UI in Civ 7.
The effect of legacy ageless buildings stays the same, notice the grassland tile I highlighted and the horse pasture tile gets +1 food with granary built.

Granted that the UI is unreliable... but the question is, which of the UI elements is lying to us?