Anyone else feels like capturing city is hard and boring?

[aandrzej]

For me it looks really hard to capture a city, at the time i have 3-4 catapults - just one archer and walls makes it sooo hard and boring to capture any city. It always drives me off the game once i reach that point.

 

[youngsteve]

For me it looks really hard to capture a city, at the time i have 3-4 catapults - just one archer and walls makes it sooo hard and boring to capture any city. It always drives me off the game once i reach that point.

I find it makes the game better, & you have to think of a way to take a city down, other than brute force. Anyway if you go in with a majority of siege units, without sufficient support, you are asking for trouble. They are the first units I target, as does the AI.

 

[hokath]

are you talking about taking a city in just a single turn?
I just won a domination victory and found the sieges to be a good length (Prince diff.)

 

[andersw]

On higher difficulties I cant take cities until I have +range, possibly with trebs if its a weak opponent usually need cannons or even fieldguns if terrain isnt favorable.
If you capture cities with catapults then you're basically speedrunning.

 

[pineappledan]

You should try the Israel civ. Their unique GG makes sieges faster

 

[Amask]

On high difficulties the AI can replace its lost troops almost immediately. Around medieval and renaissance it's literally immediately. One-turning tercios in their cap (confirmed with spy), and probably in other cities too.
Not sure if this is still a thing, but it used to be that they get bonus production when they lose units.
So what is even the point of killing them if they can just replace them instantly?
Against a deity AI it takes quite a while to get to a point where you can kill more every turn than they can build every turn.

In my latest game I had good results when I changed tactics to just injuring units, but leaving them alive.
Now they retreat and stop being a problem for a short period.
This only works if your firepower is great enough to incapacitate a large enough fraction of the entire enemy army every turn.
In a few turns they'll run out of full hp troops and you can advance.

I don't really like this state of things, but I'm not sure what to do to improve it.

 

[Amask]

Later in the game when armies are bigger, you can also try distracting the AI army.
Here's a fun example. Look at how many troops Egypt sent to deal with a single explorer.
Another good chunk of his army is healing.
Without full hp tercios to lead the way, he's too scared to send in cannons and crossbows, so they're just sitting far back doing nothing.
And I can quite safely move in.

 

[Recursive]

Not sure if this is still a thing, but it used to be that they get bonus production when they lose units.

This was removed a long time ago.

In the latest version, instant Production yields from difficulty and the AI's unit supply bonus were also removed.

 

[Boombar]

Cities without an army to defend it should go down fast which is not the case here. Single unit in a city on a vulnerable spot can hold off and entire army for a very unreasonable and unrealistic amount of time. That is why I made some modifications to reduce city hit points and combat strength by 30-40%. I also buffed siege units damage vs cities by a lot.
Game feels so much better and I started seeing AI actually getting close to domination victory. That is something i have never seen in my 2k+ hours of playing civ 5 which is in my opinion a very significant indicator that something is out of balance.

 

[Alpharius]

Disagree. Sieges can feel boring and tedious at times yes, but not particularly hard. Playing on Emperor difficulty

 

[azum4roll]

Siege should be much more resistant to ranged attacks/city strikes after the Bonus vs Domain fix change.

 

[AndreyK]

Sometime seems sieges are too easy, I take too many AI cities too quick. They declare a war even when they are weaker and refuse to make a peace until you take their cities, then I have to battle unhappiness.

 

[greenfieldpark]

One trick I use to aid in capturing cities is using a worker to chop trees that are preventing my ranged units from targeting the city.

 

[CppMaster]

Yeah, I also feel like it's too easy to defend cities without many units. If cities defenses would be nerfed then having an army would be more important.

 

[azum4roll]

City defense is already very low if there isn't a garrison. It's just that garrisons are way too hard to kill without missiles.

 

[CppMaster]

Hmm then maybe garrison influence city defense too much?

 

[Zuizgond]

Agree with you that cities have too much HP/defense. Also units can be replaced faster than they can be killed if you have the money.

Maybe a solution could be to remove the ability to purchase an unit but only reduce its production cost by 50% (similar to buildings purchase) or put a 3-turn cooldown on buying units.

 

[rusbeh]

On high difficulties the AI can replace its lost troops almost immediately. Around medieval and renaissance it's literally immediately. One-turning tercios in their cap (confirmed with spy), and probably in other cities too.
Not sure if this is still a thing, but it used to be that they get bonus production when they lose units.
So what is even the point of killing them if they can just replace them instantly?
Against a deity AI it takes quite a while to get to a point where you can kill more every turn than they can build every turn.

In my latest game I had good results when I changed tactics to just injuring units, but leaving them alive.
Now they retreat and stop being a problem for a short period.
This only works if your firepower is great enough to incapacitate a large enough fraction of the entire enemy army every turn.
In a few turns they'll run out of full hp troops and you can advance.

I don't really like this state of things, but I'm not sure what to do to improve it.

Nerfing promotion stacking could help? Logistics, range etc. promotions are really good in player hands so nerfing those would make it harder for human players to fight the AI. That could open possibilities to reduce AI unit production.

 

[pitofanavocado]

In my most recent game, I dropped 2 atomic bombs on one city in a turn and still couldn't capture it with my Paratrooper the same turn. That was a bit annoying.

I've resigned myself to playing Tradition and just turtling because city capture and microing units all day is a slog.

 

[frktest]

My experience is that prior trebuched siege unit it is nearly impossible to capture a city. In the time I need to produce enough catapults and take them in position, the AI with the present science speed, have pikemens already and make defense too much strong.
I feel that in the current Vox Populi catapults became a useless unit. From Trebuchet and ahead I find siege system well balanced.