Approaches to REX-ing

[UncleJJ]

I see early HR and vertical growth as a viable alternative to REXing. As long as you have one of the strategic resources (copper, horses, or iron) you can easily take 2 or 3 badly defended border cities from an over extended AI with its wrecked economy. Four cities with sizes of say 12, 10, 7 and 7 are much better than 10 cities at size 4. If you give the AI enough rope they'll hang themselves and you can take advantage of the AI's greed and urge to grab territory it can't hold.

Just wait wait for its archer defended cities to grow to size 2 and then send in your axes or whatever. No need to conquer his capital or his whole empire just take a few new cities your economy can absorb and develop. After that first border war you'll have your 4 big cities and maybe 3 new ones and he'll have 7 weak cities and a wrecked economy. You'll be part way towards your first GG. If you have Alphabet or Currency you could pick up a cheap tech or some gold as part of the peace settlement as well as the gold from the city captures. Early border wars can be profitable and don't strain the economy.

 

[slaze]

This is nicely said and I'm aware of that. However I can't estimate cost of my new city untill it's settled. Is there an article how to estimate future cost of a new city given distance from capital and number of existing cities? That would really help.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=138473

Here's the article. As you can see, it varies with map size but on standard there's the general 1, 3, on so on. Maintenance also increases with city size and I don't understand that as being cleary accounted for in this article but it's still a very precise explanation.

 

[StuntedAzrael]

^^Ah, exactly what I was looking for. Thx.

@UncleJJ

Vertical growth is a great alternative to REX-ing. Tbh, I like to Rex, probably greedy myself.

But on a serious side, I don't like taking AI's border cities for two reasons. First, it pains me too see badly placed city. AI sucks at placing cities. Secondly, your 'new' border cities will have to suffer increased angry faces and cultural pressure.

A good test would be to pick an isolated start with a lot of land and to play few strats up to 1000AD and see how things turned out. Random events off, barbarians off, playing as Toku. First variant would rely on cottages, second on merchants & Col and third with getting currency early.

 

[mystyfly]

I think CoL doesn't have that much to do with rexing, more with recovering a crippled economy. Courts and specialists help you recover your economy but don't help a bit to get your cities out fast.

 

[Olodune]

IME, Expanding to 8 or more cities quickly requires one of three things:

1. An unusually commerce heavy start (multiple gold mines )
2. GLH + many coastal cites (a very strong opening if the board plays along)
3. Cottage spam in nearly every city, early and often (works great with Vicky+river cities)

Regardless of which of the above is used a Currency and/or CoL beeline is needed to leverage a ReX into anything economically useful.

I really like the hemispheres map script, which often has enough land area to attempt a fun ReX-'til'-in-the-red opening.

 

[Olodune]

I see early HR and vertical growth as a viable alternative to REXing. As long as you have one of the strategic resources (copper, horses, or iron) you can easily take 2 or 3 badly defended border cities from an over extended AI with its wrecked economy. Four cities with sizes of say 12, 10, 7 and 7 are much better than 10 cities at size 4. If you give the AI enough rope they'll hang themselves and you can take advantage of the AI's greed and urge to grab territory it can't hold.

I agree. However, in BtS I find a ReX is often preferable (unlike Warlords). I think this is because the AI protects outlying cities more aggressively than before. Starting next to leaders such as Gilgamesh and Hammurabi can make even border skirmishes expensive.

 

[Jerrymander]

I often play as Catherine (Imp/Cre) and get a few settlers churned out early, making a few cities that have border popped already. It's great for sealing part of my land off from my opponent.

Catherine and a gold mine start is an amazing thing to get. The game is practically yours.

 

[mystyfly]

2. GLH + many coastal cites (a very strong opening if the board plays along)

Well if you REX, you try to seal off as much land as possible (to backfill). Coastal cities are awful to block land usually.

 

[Olodune]

Well if you REX, you try to seal off as much land as possible (to backfill). Coastal cities are awful to block land usually.

Well strategic blocking and ReX aren't the same thing -- though they certainly have a lot in common. I've started on "Peninsulas" where a single city can block off a large chunk of (mostly coastal) land. More generally, a few strategic blocking cities can allow for a gradual backfill rather than an immediate city spam. You do make a good point though.

 

[StuntedAzrael]

I have tried fast rexing with the great lighthouse but I don't find them very strong openings. You get +2 trade ruotes in coastal cities. Early game that's exactly +2 commerce.

Going Trade economy overall might be very good and I have tried it few time but when they really kick in (Astronomy) AI's are not far from mercantilism.

 

[mike p]

Great Lighthouse depends on the map, but having three trade routes from the start pretty much means that each new city will provide a net plus to the economy. Either found cities on other land masses or open borders and 6 additional commerce will more than pay for the mantainece costs.

 

[Jerrymander]

I often play as Catherine (Imp/Cre) and get a few settlers churned out early, making a few cities that have border popped already. It's great for sealing part of my land off from my opponent.

A note here: Don't EVER expand in a straight line away from your capital. I was running a deficit with 20% science in 1020 AD and all the AIs had vastly surpassed me in research, despite having only a small part of my continent. I had sealed the other two AIs up against each other with 4 well placed cities, but my economy hated it. I should have moved the capital early to the middle city.

Capital moving is important in horizontal expansion.

 

[Gumbolt]

I normally do a spider like build approach. If i have taken a Ai capital i may build my empire towards their city. The AI capitals are normally larger cities and have worked land.

How far does rexing go?? (I assume Rex is rapid expansion?)

I did wonder about the Ai approach to expansion in BTS. Especially as they seem to build cities on whatever land they can grab. I tend to find the smaller empire AI civs with financial trait normally take the tech lead. better to wipe them out first before they trade away the techs.

 

[StuntedAzrael]

So far you have given me some good pointers about rex-ing. But is it possible to Rex at all in some circumstances??

If have today rolled for myself a new game. Imho I can win most games on emperor but I'm not sure of this one so I want your opinion how to proceed and what to do.

Settings:
Hemisferes
2 Normal continents with tiny islands
Standard map

Epic speed
Emperor difficulty

The start:

So, I'm leading a young new civilization named Portugal. People of Portugal were fast moving people, quick to get up and set to the new road and new challenges. They are expansive and imperialistic.

The start isn't good. AI recommends NW as a good city spot and I obey. He's right, that is a good spot to settle. In hopes of starting a new game with a explosive rexing I started develop my civilization. First thing is scouting the area.

So, after bronzeworking which was my first tech I have managed to find some in vicinity:

After some more scouting the situation looks tough.

My toughts here:
I have huge land area at my disposal which means I could in theory build myself large empire of my own. In reality I'll soon be swamped in barbarians.

Mehmed is I think on the far southeast below jungle belt. There is probably one or two civs on the continent but I haven't found them so they are probably far away.

No early hapiness resources. Plenty of health resources.

The land around my capital has lots of potential for food and production.

So I need some advice as it looks to be a challenging game. Anyone want to give it a try? Here's the save.

 

[Moxxa]

The best REXing strategy, IMO, involves building the Great Lighthouse and settling costal cities while teching Currency -> Code of Laws. If you have the GLH, any costal city is immediately profitable, or at least breaking even. Great Merchant points are good to have, too.

If you don't have at least 2-3 good costal city sites and you just want to REX, grab Code of Laws through Priesthood for Caste System. REX until you're basically bankrupt while running as many Scientists as you can. Gradually make the conversion to cottages and you're good to go!

 

[vicawoo]

Did you begin with two workers? I'd settle on the silk to get the corn and bronze (wheat and pig can be a food city). I think there are flood plains in the southwest, good for cottaging. I'm a little torn between cottaging (drawback, lots of workers) or running scientists (drawback, your happy cap is too low to whip them easily).

You need a monument at the bronze city, but you might need to get archers. Get pottery soon, too, half price granaries + lots of food + imperialistic (2 pop whip settlers). I'd say grab land along the rivered area after the bronze city, and that should support your expansion. Target monarchy as well.

 

[siggboy]

Loads of differing advice here. Let me point you to this interesting article by snaaty on how to beat Deity: BTS – A guide for higher difficulties for standard speed and maps (emperor+)

He basically recommends: start with a worker, then grow your city to happy cap, then use it as a worker/settler pump and expand aggressively towards your neighbours, blocking them off and backfill later. He posted a demo game where he shows how this works. He also advises not to whip in your capital.

Well, I have tried all this and I can say that it works really well (I'm not playing Deity mind you, but of course it also helps on lower difficulties).

Right now I'm testing this meta-strategy (capital = settler pump, satellite cities for production) in all my games. It's also quite easy to play out, as I've found. If you have an immediate happiness boost (like gold or ivory, for example), even better.

 

[Jerrymander]

Why did you waste all that time moving to the coast? D:

 

[Wacky]

I often hear about the 60% rule (Slider)

How importemt is that really ? Somethimes I fall to 40% cause I really need that just a bit more land

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I almost never mind the 60% rule...too constraining. I've had successful games running the slider at 30% close to the entire time.

If you stay in parity or ahead in tech, it doesn't matter what you're bringing in.