Are BE leaders too generic?

[WhiteKnight0311]

This is something I don't quite get. The new colony is supported by a faction, but is the leader of the faction still on earth, or did it go with that colony ship? The corporations or nations or whomever supports your colonizing attempt is sending the "ONE" leader to go and start this new off world colony, and if the ship never makes it, then what? It would make more sense that each colony ship/attempt is led by a high ranking official and not the leader of the actual faction.... Unless, there are multiple figureheads for each faction. Now THAT would be very cool!!!

Their businesses... the CEO leaves so another takes their place on Earth. It's just early retirement.

you have to consider that some of these faction leaders don't have the opportunites or freedoms they desire to have on Earth, so they pack their bags and join their own seeding operations to do things their way.

 

[SupremacyKing]

BE's sponsor leaders may not be as colorful as SMAC's leaders but I would not call them bland at all. I definitely think the in-game quotes will add a lot of flavor to the sponsor leaders. Plus, they may distinguish themselves more in diplomacy as well.

 

[SupremacyKing]

you have to consider that some of these faction leaders don't have the opportunites or freedoms they desire to have on Earth, so they pack their bags and join their own seeding operations to do things their way.

I definitely got that impression with Daoming. If you read the blog about her, she was butting heads with the other leaders in the PAC as she felt they were wrong. So she relishes the opportunity to leave Earth behind and do things her way. Similarly, Fielding leaves because she feels that she has finished taking ARC to the top on Earth and she wants a new challenge.

 

[Onemorecivfan]

I think the reason many people say Beyond Earth's leaders are bland in comparison to SMAC is that they are looking at it through rose-tinted nostalgia glasses. They have played SMAC for years (literally), they know the character and faction lore, they know their AI quirks by heart and they are comparing that to just a few little preview tidbits we have gotten about the BE leaders personality and ideology.

Thing is they need to step into the shoes of someone who never has played SMAC before, someone who doesn't know anything about the game, and look at it from that perspective. A Chinese Communist who wants to establish an atheist collectivist police state? How original. A fundamentalist Christian from the southern USA who wants to establish a theocracy? Really breaking stereotypes there, Firaxis. A business tycoon telling everybody greed is good while building a society that looks like it was designed by Ayn Rand? Are you guys even trying?

You get the point. In a lot of ways SMAC characters where somewhat bland and stereotypical at first glance but good writing and good gameplay design made them so much more than that. So why not reserve judgement on BE until we have actually played the game a little?

Finally someone says it, I mean of course the right wing survivalist is from Central America and obviously the scientist with dubious ethics is from Russia where else would he be from?

 

[NASAROG]

Their businesses... the CEO leaves so another takes their place on Earth. It's just early retirement.

you have to consider that some of these faction leaders don't have the opportunites or freedoms they desire to have on Earth, so they pack their bags and join their own seeding operations to do things their way.

That makes sense, but that's a might assumption that the ship will arrive unscathed in the first place and then make planetfall without any complications. But this also means that each colonized planet has it's own "CEO" to lead their respective faction. That would imply that there are multiple "leaders"/choices for each faction. Boy..... that would a lot of variety if such a thing existed.

 

[Browd]

This is something I don't quite get. The new colony is supported by a faction, but is the leader of the faction still on earth, or did it go with that colony ship? The corporations or nations or whomever supports your colonizing attempt is sending the "ONE" leader to go and start this new off world colony, and if the ship never makes it, then what? It would make more sense that each colony ship/attempt is led by a high ranking official and not the leader of the actual faction.... Unless, there are multiple figureheads for each faction. Now THAT would be very cool!!!

As each other faction lands on the planet, you are greeted by their leader. Leaving aside the fact that the leader would be long dead if they stayed on Earth (given the roughly 400 years of travel time to the planet), it would be impossible to maintain a real-time conversation from light years away.

 

[Hardcorps]

I'd actually argue it's not the Sponsors and Leaders that are generic.

It's the fact that they all have such minor boosts and no unique units or unique buildings or anything of the sort to actually drive the faction in that direction. Plus PAC seems to me to be by far the best Sponsor bonus, only spying I guess could rival it but that depends on how good it is.

But I guess time will tell. But I'm pretty damn sure the Sponsor bonuses are going to get reworked at some point prior or during the next expansion.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

This is something I don't quite get. The new colony is supported by a faction, but is the leader of the faction still on earth, or did it go with that colony ship? The corporations or nations or whomever supports your colonizing attempt is sending the "ONE" leader to go and start this new off world colony, and if the ship never makes it, then what? It would make more sense that each colony ship/attempt is led by a high ranking official and not the leader of the actual faction.... Unless, there are multiple figureheads for each faction. Now THAT would be very cool!!!

The Characters are Not the leader of the faction/sponsor, they are the leader of ONE the faction/sponsor's expeditions*

Exceptions: Fielding is the leader of ARC (CEO+CFO), Kavitha is the "spiritual leader" of the Kavithan Protectorate.

but Barre, Soucha, Hutama, Elodie, Bolivar, and Kozlov are just the people the sponsor picked to lead the expedition (they are high ranking/important people, but not the leaders)

*remember each faction sponsors dozens/hundreds of seeding expeditions, you just happen to be playing the one with that specific leader going to planet X (where whichever other leaders you encounter also seem to be going).


also, I'm not sure the sponsor bonuses will be 'reworked' They will definitely be Balanced though (ie all of them are based on simple numbers.. which can go up or down)

 

[NASAROG]

The Characters are Not the leader of the faction/sponsor, they are the leader of ONE the faction/sponsor's expeditions*

Exceptions: Fielding is the leader of ARC (CEO+CFO), Kavitha is the "spiritual leader" of the Kavithan Protectorate.

but Barre, Soucha, Hutama, Elodie, Bolivar, and Kozlov are just the people the sponsor picked to lead the expedition (they are high ranking/important people, but not the leaders)

*remember each faction sponsors dozens/hundreds of seeding expeditions, you just happen to be playing the one with that specific leader going to planet X (where whichever other leaders you encounter also seem to be going).


also, I'm not sure the sponsor bonuses will be 'reworked' They will definitely be Balanced though (ie all of them are based on simple numbers.. which can go up or down)

So, does this open the door to multiple representatives from each backer as you explore different planets? That would be great if we could customize our leaders.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

So, does this open the door to multiple representatives from each backer as you explore different planets? That would be great if we could customize our leaders.

If they want to, yes.

Although keeping leader-faction name-faction bonus-faction symbol all constant helps maintain some simplicity (which I hope they don't ruin with waves of dlc/expansion factions/additional leaders)

 

[SammyKhalifa]

I'd actually argue it's not the Sponsors and Leaders that are generic.

It's the fact that they all have such minor boosts and no unique units or unique buildings or anything of the sort to actually drive the faction in that direction. Plus PAC seems to me to be by far the best Sponsor bonus, only spying I guess could rival it but that depends on how good it is.

But I guess time will tell. But I'm pretty damn sure the Sponsor bonuses are going to get reworked at some point prior or during the next expansion.

The "uniqueness" is going to stem from all of the decisions you make about what you send to the new planet at the opening of the game--faction leader being just one component of that. Of course that one slice of your "civ" isn't going to be as strong as we're used to.

 

[AriochIV]

My only concern with the more dynamic Seeding options is: when you meet another faction, you'll know which sponsor was chosen, but how will you know which spaceship, colonist and cargo options that faction chose? Those will significantly affect how that faction plays.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

My only concern with the more dynamic Seeding options is: when you meet another faction, you'll know which sponsor was chosen, but how will you know which spaceship, colonist and cargo options that faction chose? Those will significantly affect how that faction plays.

Well, it could be hidden or it could be in the diplomacy screen somewhere. I could see either way as legitimate design choices.

 

[GenEngineer]

As for figuring out the seeding options in diplomacy, I don't think the spaceship configuration and cargo really matter, sponsor is obvious when you meet them. As for colonists, Scientists and Aristocrats will be implied in the trade screen, based on the initial gold per turn and research per turn they have available to offer. No idea about how to guess between refugees, engineers, or artists though, unless you can monitor how fast the city grows/expands/produces stuff.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

My only concern with the more dynamic Seeding options is: when you meet another faction, you'll know which sponsor was chosen, but how will you know which spaceship, colonist and cargo options that faction chose? Those will significantly affect how that faction plays.

I remember seeing a screen where those were displayed (possibly the diplomacy)

Spaceship does matter a bit, particularly Continental will matter long term.

 

[DarkestOnion]

I think the Blank Slate Approach is something that Civ:BE has positively going for it. Wouldn't you rather let your imagination run wild about your Expedition as a whole rather than focus on who is in charge at HQ and what they are wearing this season?

 

[bhavv]

Another thing with Smac was it was so easy to modify and add your own factions, and also you could modify the policies.

I like the individual stat based bonuses / negatives that it had due to that ease of modding via simple txt files.