amadeus
Bishop of Bio-Dome
And some of you guys complain about being called "massholes"?
(edit: this is only in good humor, BTW)
Are we on the brink of World War III?
- Thread starter amadeus
- Start date
And some of you guys complain about being called "massholes"?
(edit: this is only in good humor, BTW)
andycapp
Grumpy Old Griper
There is a touch of melodrama to the assertion that we're on the brink of WW3. Undoubtly there are flash points around the world that could escalate into something quite ugly, but adding all these (not necessarily related) incidents together and concluding that WW3 is about happen is a wee bit alarmist.
As ever the middle east is the place to watch for a descent into a wider war, closely followed by India and Pakistan - let's hope sanity prevails!
As ever the middle east is the place to watch for a descent into a wider war, closely followed by India and Pakistan - let's hope sanity prevails!
Maj
Emperor
Now that you've thrown up a few of the facts, why don't you string them together and form a solid argument. Several international controversies making news headlines are not precussors to a "world war" -- however you'd like to define it.
-Maj
-Maj
Magnus
Diplocat
I don't mind the term at all.
and to get back on the thread - I don't think you can really have a 'World War' without clearly defined sides, and I see a bunch of minor squabbles, but nothing out of the ordinary. I mean, yes I suppose it could blow up, but my gut says it will not - and I live and die by my gut and it has always been true so far, judged by the simple fact that I am still alive.
Anielewicz
Chieftain
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2001
- Messages
- 61
NO WORLD WAR III.
None of these facts are related. Even in the worse case if all these countries should start a war, that would be separated war. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict has nothing to do with Japan or Northern Korea, and still less with Argentina. Then why should there be a war in Argentina ?
The situation in Israel and India-Pakistan has existend since these countries were created after WWII. Nothing new there.
I even wonder why I am writing this...
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
Yep, shove me in the "No WW3" camp. An economic meltdown that was a long time coming, a few old news stories, and some suppositions do not a global war make. We are at war against terrorism for the side of good and civilization, but IMO a world war needs a clash of great powers in many theatres. There is not an overriding force controling each side in all of those. Some are related to a degree, others are very minor.
They may result in wars in a regional sense, but it will not erupt into the big one.
Times have changed, things have changed. Japan/ NK is simply a little skirmish, and NK is going down the plughole fast. Iran is no longer the fundamentalist menace of the 1980s, and is displaying signs of liberalisation and modernisation (of course, it may be an evil concealment plot to lure the Satanic west into a false sense of security ), and if I had Saddam Hussein as a neighbour, having gone to war in the recent past, I would explore avenues of defence.
Israel and the Palestinians does not look like springing up into a major war.
Terrorism is a threat; has been for a long time, only recently, it has changed, and so have our rightful reactions to it. Once bitten, twice shy.
India and Pakistan is seemingly a worry, but sabre rattling is common between the pair, and the current US interest and presence in the region should act as a circuit breaker if anything real starts to happen.
Importantly though, the great powers are quite snuggly at the moment. US/China relations have thawed slightly, but significantly since the incident, Russia is joining the fold, and Europe is behaving in general, as they should US and Britain have reinforced their special relationship, and even Fidel is acting more friendly than usual.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend (There was a really good 1980s Swedish television series of that title: 'Enemy of the Enemy'...)
They may result in wars in a regional sense, but it will not erupt into the big one.
Times have changed, things have changed. Japan/ NK is simply a little skirmish, and NK is going down the plughole fast. Iran is no longer the fundamentalist menace of the 1980s, and is displaying signs of liberalisation and modernisation (of course, it may be an evil concealment plot to lure the Satanic west into a false sense of security
), and if I had Saddam Hussein as a neighbour, having gone to war in the recent past, I would explore avenues of defence.Israel and the Palestinians does not look like springing up into a major war.
Terrorism is a threat; has been for a long time, only recently, it has changed, and so have our rightful reactions to it. Once bitten, twice shy.
India and Pakistan is seemingly a worry, but sabre rattling is common between the pair, and the current US interest and presence in the region should act as a circuit breaker if anything real starts to happen.
Importantly though, the great powers are quite snuggly at the moment. US/China relations have thawed slightly, but significantly since the incident, Russia is joining the fold, and Europe is behaving in general, as they should
US and Britain have reinforced their special relationship, and even Fidel is acting more friendly than usual.The enemy of my enemy is my friend (There was a really good 1980s Swedish television series of that title: 'Enemy of the Enemy'...)
All the events exposed for rmsharpe do not seem to be sufficient since to provoke the third world war.
Nevertheless the clash Islam - christianity seems to grow every day and probably it ends in a religious world war as Nostradamaus predicted.
And we do not forget San Malaquías's prophecies that says that the current Pope is the penultimate Pope.
Repent sinner!! :crazyeyes :crazyeyes :crazyeyes :crazyeyes
Nevertheless the clash Islam - christianity seems to grow every day and probably it ends in a religious world war as Nostradamaus predicted.
And we do not forget San Malaquías's prophecies that says that the current Pope is the penultimate Pope.
Repent sinner!! :crazyeyes :crazyeyes :crazyeyes :crazyeyes
'Iran is no longer the fundamentalist menace of the 1980s, and is displaying signs of liberalisation and modernisation'
Don't be ridicolous! (IMO, lol I have to add IMO to everything just not to flame too much..)
In Refasengani's (Irans former president) latest speech he says 'Must continue untill total annhilation of Israel' and he also specifically mentioned huge efforts to get nuclear weapons.
If Iran does some sucking up to the US and Europe when they get near them, it doesnt mean they get more liberal!
Iran is one of the most dangerous country in the world, or soon will be, its a terror-supporting fundementalistic unstable regime.
I hope Bush and Co. does not think like you, because as soon as Iran gets hands on WMD (World mass destruction) weapons, its the end for Israel and who other knows.
Iran continusoly supports all anti-western terror organizations, its been a very bad country since the rise of the religious regime.
Before that they were ok, but since then its a catastrophical country, with a regime with no moral values what so ever.
Don't be ridicolous! (IMO, lol I have to add IMO to everything just not to flame too much..)
In Refasengani's (Irans former president) latest speech he says 'Must continue untill total annhilation of Israel' and he also specifically mentioned huge efforts to get nuclear weapons.
If Iran does some sucking up to the US and Europe when they get near them, it doesnt mean they get more liberal!
Iran is one of the most dangerous country in the world, or soon will be, its a terror-supporting fundementalistic unstable regime.
I hope Bush and Co. does not think like you, because as soon as Iran gets hands on WMD (World mass destruction) weapons, its the end for Israel and who other knows.
Iran continusoly supports all anti-western terror organizations, its been a very bad country since the rise of the religious regime.
Before that they were ok, but since then its a catastrophical country, with a regime with no moral values what so ever.
FearlessLeader2
Fundamentalist Loon
A major war is coming, and it will be called Armegeddon by those that see it. But it will not be a mere clash of nations with nuclear arms. The end of this system of things is drawing near. Many of the signs in Revelations have come to pass already, and it cannot be long before the rest follow.
Read Revelations, and see if you can recognize the signs of the four horsemen's passage. Wars in every corner of the globe, inflation, disease, starvation, and death. It's all over the headlines of our papers every day.
We've got earthquakes in unheard of number, hurricanes, floods, landslides, and other disasters are on the rise.
The financial instability and collapse that we have witnessed is a clear signal that the "...third of the ships at sea, and a third of the port cities..." are in jeopardy. (Ships and shipping have been used many times in the Bible as symbols of trade.)
These things have already come to pass, or are happening as we speak. There is more yet to come:
The Whore of Babylon, false religion, will be turned upon by the Beast (that ten-horned, seven headed dragon that talks real big about itself, aka the UN). Say, isn't that happening, right now? Where are those boys in blue headed after taking care of Islamic terror? Oh yeah, they're going after the bloody Provos. A Catholic terror group. Who's next? Seems like most terror organizations are started by religions...
Yep, for a book full of fairy tales, it seems to be a tome of prophecy. Well, maybe fairy tales DO come true...
Anyways, there is a war on the way. But it's not some puny little WWIII. It the battle at Har-Mageddon, and after it, everything else is moot.
<shrug> Ok, let me have it. [punch]
Read Revelations, and see if you can recognize the signs of the four horsemen's passage. Wars in every corner of the globe, inflation, disease, starvation, and death. It's all over the headlines of our papers every day.
We've got earthquakes in unheard of number, hurricanes, floods, landslides, and other disasters are on the rise.
The financial instability and collapse that we have witnessed is a clear signal that the "...third of the ships at sea, and a third of the port cities..." are in jeopardy. (Ships and shipping have been used many times in the Bible as symbols of trade.)
These things have already come to pass, or are happening as we speak. There is more yet to come:
The Whore of Babylon, false religion, will be turned upon by the Beast (that ten-horned, seven headed dragon that talks real big about itself, aka the UN). Say, isn't that happening, right now? Where are those boys in blue headed after taking care of Islamic terror? Oh yeah, they're going after the bloody Provos. A Catholic terror group. Who's next? Seems like most terror organizations are started by religions...
Yep, for a book full of fairy tales, it seems to be a tome of prophecy. Well, maybe fairy tales DO come true...
Anyways, there is a war on the way. But it's not some puny little WWIII. It the battle at Har-Mageddon, and after it, everything else is moot.
<shrug> Ok, let me have it. [punch]
Magnus
Diplocat
Why is it that every generation of Christians believes that Revelation is coming true in THEIR lifetimes? God is the ultimate procrastinator. 
scorch
Legalize Pot
seriosly, do youse think that some big world war with drafting etc is going to happen? No way, not unless the "bad guys" do something really unexpected and "bad" (like dropping a nuke), but other than that, nothigns happening.
amadeus
Bishop of Bio-Dome
Like I said, I don't believe it's World War III, I think it is a Third World War (ha-ha)
Simon Darkshade
Mysterious City of Gold
Who said anyone was going after the Provo's? Certainly no one I have ever heard of, and I am well acquainted with news regarding Ireland.
I don't quite think that the apocalypse is around the corner, but the fearless one is entitled to think what he wishes. It makes entertaining late night reading at least
On the matter of Iran, I note that those were the words of the former President. Having seen two big demolition jobs done on neighbours either side who tried to meddle with the international system, they may feel the beginnings of restraint.
They are a big nation, with an interesting military, including the only F-14s outside of the USN (but they would be in a bad operational state by now, with no parts or support since the 1970s).
I can understand that their support of Hizbollah and Islamic Jihad is but one of the things that causes worry to our Israeli friends and allies.
My point is that the regime has changed, albeit in a small way, since the 1980s. They no longer rail against the "Great Satan" in official broadcasts every hour, to the best of my knowledge. Khatami is a moderate compared to Khomeini, and the people are getting a little hint or taste of freedom. They would not easily relinquish it.
Therefore, my meaning is that Iran 2002 is not Iran 1982.
If they went nuclear, they would be wiped off the map by the US, Israel and assorted others. Maybe even the Pakistani's would join in.
Diego Garcia is within range.
They are capable of the type of action you described, Iceblaze, there is no doubt. But, IMO, this capability will not be translated into action, unless the current situation changes. If it does, the reaction of the world will not remain static. Never again.
If the regime does turn nasty, then a repeat of Osirak would not be frowned on, and the Russians value the friendship of America more than Iran, so they will cooperate.
In this new world order, any state that even hints of beginning to step out of line will get clobbered by the US, and their friends from the many headed beast.
There is also the Hetz to think of, if worse comes to worse.
BTW, Bush and others do think like me. I asked him last night over dinner (You'll have to go digging, but in an earlier post, I was married to GWB by the Rev Enemy Ace Curt Sibling... )
I don't quite think that the apocalypse is around the corner, but the fearless one is entitled to think what he wishes. It makes entertaining late night reading at least
On the matter of Iran, I note that those were the words of the former President. Having seen two big demolition jobs done on neighbours either side who tried to meddle with the international system, they may feel the beginnings of restraint.
They are a big nation, with an interesting military, including the only F-14s outside of the USN (but they would be in a bad operational state by now, with no parts or support since the 1970s).
I can understand that their support of Hizbollah and Islamic Jihad is but one of the things that causes worry to our Israeli friends and allies.
My point is that the regime has changed, albeit in a small way, since the 1980s. They no longer rail against the "Great Satan" in official broadcasts every hour, to the best of my knowledge. Khatami is a moderate compared to Khomeini, and the people are getting a little hint or taste of freedom. They would not easily relinquish it.
Therefore, my meaning is that Iran 2002 is not Iran 1982.
If they went nuclear, they would be wiped off the map by the US, Israel and assorted others. Maybe even the Pakistani's would join in.
Diego Garcia is within range.
They are capable of the type of action you described, Iceblaze, there is no doubt. But, IMO, this capability will not be translated into action, unless the current situation changes. If it does, the reaction of the world will not remain static. Never again.
If the regime does turn nasty, then a repeat of Osirak would not be frowned on, and the Russians value the friendship of America more than Iran, so they will cooperate.
In this new world order, any state that even hints of beginning to step out of line will get clobbered by the US, and their friends from the many headed beast.
There is also the Hetz to think of, if worse comes to worse.
BTW, Bush and others do think like me. I asked him last night over dinner
(You'll have to go digging, but in an earlier post, I was married to GWB by the Rev Enemy Ace Curt Sibling... )
Originally posted by Magnus
Why is it that every generation of Christians believes that Revelation is coming true in THEIR lifetimes? God is the ultimate procrastinator.
LOL!! Good point.
But really....when it comes to "predictions" of the future....unless they are very specific.....like "The Berlin Wall will fall in 1989." (Assuming that's the right year.
)Then that's an ok prediction.
But when it's "White will rise and strike down the great people." And you say that it means an anthrax attacks on the US and related deaths, then your reaching a little.
Basically....if someone has to explain WHAT the prediction is.....then it's not the greatest prediction. (However....back in the day, people wouldn't know it was called anthrax and the USofA....but you see my point.)
FearlessLeader2
Fundamentalist Loon
Ok, explain to me how the four horsemen prediction was at all vague? Other than personifying the events as horsemen, which is a literary technique steeped in antiquity, and therefore easily understood, there is no ambiguity whatsoever.
What about 'nation will rise against nation'? How is that ambiguous?
Keep trying.
What about 'nation will rise against nation'? How is that ambiguous?
Keep trying.
Originally posted by FearlessLeader2
Ok, explain to me how the four horsemen prediction was at all vague? Other than personifying the events as horsemen, which is a literary technique steeped in antiquity, and therefore easily understood, there is no ambiguity whatsoever.
What about 'nation will rise against nation'? How is that ambiguous?
Jesus Christ......do you have to disagree with everything I say?
I'm not saying every prediction is wrong.....and I'm not even talking about your prediction AT ALL!
I was talking about predictions in general.
Vague predictions.....in which someone has to explain the meaning of everything, holds a much smaller effect with me. Like AFTER an event happens....someone says...oh this guy said anthrax attacks would happen because the "White" = anthrax and "great people" = USA. That's what I consider Grade A bullplop. The same prediction could be answered by a blizzard in England which kills 25 people. "White" = snow and "great people" = England
That's why I put little stock in vague predictions.
Why does everyone always misunderstand what I say....and ALWAYS in the negitive?!?!?
'Nation rise against nation' is not at all vague.
Its just like a kid saying 'Cookies are tasty'.
Of course they are tasty, that is the reason they are made.
Same thing with militaries, they are made to survive the 'nation against nation'.
The human nature is warmongering at most, and its not a prediction saying 'Nation rise against nation', its obvious it will happen over and over again in history.
True predictors know something before it happens, and dont apply some nosterdamous line to something after it happens, thats just... well, dunno how to say it but it is kinda stupid being smart in retrospect.
IMO, nosterdamous's predictions are smart to his time, he realised what will happen in these ages, but on the other hand considering his PoV of what the world will be like today, he predicted every disaster avaliable. So we find several, maybe even dozen or two, that are true, but think about all the others that aren't.
He is a predictor, he really is (IMO), but I don't value much of his predictions because he covered every aspect of disaster that can happen in the reality he saw of the current future (current for us, future for him).
About the bible predictions, I think it's all BS.
I have been in some Israeli Bible Predictions believers site, and what they actually do is not predict, but throughly searching for a line that reminds a disaster after it happens.
In one case, they found 'Bladen ben (not bin, ben) bladen' and they thought it predicts of the come of bin laden... well to me it all looks like BS
But that's just me
Its just like a kid saying 'Cookies are tasty'.
Of course they are tasty, that is the reason they are made.
Same thing with militaries, they are made to survive the 'nation against nation'.
The human nature is warmongering at most, and its not a prediction saying 'Nation rise against nation', its obvious it will happen over and over again in history.
True predictors know something before it happens, and dont apply some nosterdamous line to something after it happens, thats just... well, dunno how to say it but it is kinda stupid being smart in retrospect.
IMO, nosterdamous's predictions are smart to his time, he realised what will happen in these ages, but on the other hand considering his PoV of what the world will be like today, he predicted every disaster avaliable. So we find several, maybe even dozen or two, that are true, but think about all the others that aren't.
He is a predictor, he really is (IMO), but I don't value much of his predictions because he covered every aspect of disaster that can happen in the reality he saw of the current future (current for us, future for him).
About the bible predictions, I think it's all BS.
I have been in some Israeli Bible Predictions believers site, and what they actually do is not predict, but throughly searching for a line that reminds a disaster after it happens.
In one case, they found 'Bladen ben (not bin, ben) bladen' and they thought it predicts of the come of bin laden... well to me it all looks like BS
But that's just me
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